Mag 4D sst-90 W.I.P.

[kl3vr]

Hi, this is a thought experiment about a maglite mod using a sst-90(or brighter) and heat-pipes for cooling.

I'v been thinking about this for a few weeks now and am learning a LOT.
I'm new to modding, so I want to get as much planning and discussion in before I commit to buying lots of materials. I already have the old incandescent mag 4D with a D in the serial number. This will be the victim.

I especially want this to be a thrower so I'll probably go aspheric unless someone can convince me otherwise.

I have access to a dremel, lots of manual tools, solder gun. No welder or lathe, but if it came down to it I could find someone to do it at college.

Cross-section of main body:

Side view of head:

Whole Body View:

Green is background,
Black is maglight body
Grey is battery
Copper is the heatpipes
Blue is some sort of insulation
Red is SST-90 square base and driver pcb's
White is button hole in mag case
Yellow is SST-90 dome size (approx size)
Pictures are to scale as much as a ruler and PS will allow.

Blue insulation could be anything really, the more insulation the better to protect the batteries from the heatpipe.
Batteries: Either 6*18650 series or 3*2 parallel, with bored side walls of maglite, but that requires more tools then i might have (requesting information on how to do this) OR slightly smaller diameter batteries, still unsure whether to use Lithium or NiMH.
I got some thermal glue (grease like) coming, i'll lather that poop everywhere.
As you can see, there's lots of space between the heatsink and the button hole, so there's room for more boards, more heatsinking and recessing the LED to get focus. Perhaps the whole slug (led, heatsink and drivers) could move up and down like the regular mag bulb does, with a spring to keep the tension?
Reflector with Brass Base:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.13803
Title says copper but in comments they say its brass. It may not fit or work the best but it'll be something to try.
Aspheric lens is coming from:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.12834
Good reviews, fits the mag 4D, glass.
Heatpipes will come from, 6mm:
http://www.avc.com.tw/products/NB-Thermal.htm#
found the information from this thread:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=101918
Thanks NewBie. I'm gonna need 4*6mm*300mm tubes. If anyone has these tubes left over from another project or could help me order this small quantity, please contact me.

With this much heatsinking, should I go for a brighter LED? I'm looking to make this a thrower, with an adjustable head.

No idea what driver to use, but it should be quality buck/boost at around 9-10amps, also depending on battery chosen i guess. I'd prefer a 1-2 mode driver.

I like the original mag switch but maybe a 3 position switch would be cool, off-med-hi, but that complicates the driver wiring im sure...

My questions:
How would someone bore out the sides to fit 2*18650?
What battery chem and size?
Aspheric or reflector for best thrower?
Focusing design needs work.
I need help finding the heatpipes.
What drivers should I use?
How easy would it be to use a 3-pos switch?
Should we go brighter? :devil:

Thanks for your time, please share your idea's! I'll document the work as much as possible, so when its done there will be a nice tutorial for anyone following along.

-Jordan

 

[420light]

I would like to see this come to life. Seems interesting.

 

[monkeyboy]

IIRC someone produced some 2+2 18650 bored mag hosts. The length was approximately 2.5D.

 

[netprince]

hi kl3vr

I was thinking about something similar the other day...

It is common for modders to use 26650 cells in mags with shortened tail caps. They also use common pvc tubing to fill in the space between the cells and the tube. I was thinking instead of pvc tube, create a solid copper tube, which runs from the bottom of the emitter, to just before the spring.

The inside of the tube could be exactly the right diameter for the parts of a C size mag, you could fit the C switch inside it, also a driver which will fit in a C mag. The inside of the tube would be skewed towards the switch hole so the C switch would drop in normally.

I know I would like to have such a large heatsink...

 

[kl3vr]

Thanks for in replies
I'v seen that someone already bored out their mag D to accept 2*18650 cells across, but I have no idea how they did it.
I already have a 4d maglite that I want to use, so buying someone else's host does not appeal to me.

The 26650 batteries I see on all-battery.com are 2000mA and 3000mA, but i'd only be able to put 3 of them in the host, so 6000mA or 9000mA total.
With 18650 batteries I'd be able to fit 2 across, with the same length. I'd have 6 batteries at 2500mA each, for 15000mA total.
This would leave 53mm either behind the batteries or in front. I'm thinking some more heatsinking fins with possible vents, or use that space for the battery indicator. I dont have access to a tool to re-create the threads

I think u'd be surprised how efficient heatpipes are at moving heat. They are hallow too so they're lite.
My main concern is still getting the heat pipes and boring out the maglite, everything else is just deciding on the best components.

 

[kl3vr]

*bumb*
I'm still clueless as to how or where I'd get the heatpipes, anyone know of a site selling in low quantities?
How would I go about boring out the maglite to accept 2*18650 across?
Also, what drivers would you recommend to reach 9-10amps from 3 banks of 2*18650's(in parallel)?
Thanks,
-kl3vr

 

[jarekdadej]

You can salvage Heatpipes from this or this.

 

[alpg88]

heatpipes????? are bulding liquid cooled light??? if not go to home depot, or any hvac supply house, they have copper pipes, thou imo heat sink should be solid piece of copper, or aluminium
as for borring out, there are few ppl here that provide that service, i suggest you visit this thread
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=156080

 

[mudman cj]

What is your plan for dissipating the heat once the heat pipes bring it to the tail end of the flashlight?

 

[Fulgeo]

*bumb*
I'm still clueless as to how or where I'd get the heatpipes, anyone know of a site selling in low quantities?
How would I go about boring out the maglite to accept 2*18650 across?
Also, what drivers would you recommend to reach 9-10amps from 3 banks of 2*18650's(in parallel)?
Thanks,
-kl3vr

Hey kl3vr I do not mean to besmirch your build but I think you would be better off setting up your build on that 4D Mag using 4 D size NiMH batteries. This would give you 10000 to 12000 mAh total and save you some money in the process. You could build a driver up using AMC7135 buck boards. You could even build up a two stage driver using AMC7135 boards. Just heatsink the chips well to dissipate the heat. You could probably get away with just one resistor of decent wattage capacity if you did not want to play with AMC7135 boards. If you are set on using multiple 18650 lithium cells and heat pipes there are three 9 amp drivers currently under development that will fit you needs. Alas non of them are quite ready at this point. Here are the threads that I have been following in anticipation.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=259247
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=253241
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=252095

Your ideas look interesting. I would run those heat pipes outside the body of that flashlight near the head using bird cage symmetry and give it that Steampunk look. Happy Mods!

 

[kl3vr]

Hey! thanks for the responses!
So, I guess I should have found out just how hot these LED's on steroids actually are. I see people modding their mags with 6 sst-90 in the head, but are they useable for more then 10 seconds before the rubber o-rings start to sizzle? Would a single sst-90 not create enough heat that a simple slug die heatsink couldnt keep at reasonable temp? Basically, should I even bother with complicated stuff like heat pipes and bored out hosts? Or was it all a pipe dream to begin with ;P

The highest AMC7135 I could find were 1400mA, so i'd need like 6 of them stacked:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.1886
And I'd need to buy a pack of 10 for $18
That doesnt sound very efficient, but 4 of:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.20330
would deliver very close to 9A because some comments report they deliver around 2.3A. :shrug: but it'd cost me $20 so any idea when one of those 9A boards under development will come out? under $20? Or significantly more efficient?

I did also consider just using D NiMH cells for convenience, and I guess it depends on if I'll need the heat pipes at all. Looking at:
http://www.all-battery.com/dsizeseriesnimhrechargeablebatteries.aspx
I could get 4@$6.50=$26
And I'd need to get a charger for these D cell size , where as I use 18650's in a lot of my other lights, so i'd have a nice supply already.
Or:
http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.5790
3 packs @ 8.50=$26
So, it comes down to if heat pipes will be needed at all, or if it'd just be wasted.

And FINALLY, the added space given by using 3 stacked 18650 vs 4 D-cells would give me heat dissipation room for ?vents? with finned copper heat dissipation.
Thanks all,
-Jordan