NEW!! 300mW Green & 40mW Blue handheld lasers are out...

[nero_design]

Wicked is apparently using new (and probably quite pricey) Sony diodes in these new 'Spyder' Series lasers. And they have their own manufacturing plant now. The cost of Blue diodes should drop over the next two years but only when other manufacturers are producing similar diodes and outputs as this will force Sony to be more competitive.

As for "illegality", ( https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/76273 ) you should note that anything at all in the Class 3B range is subject to FDA guidelines. Besides, where do you think all the US sold CNI lasers come from to begin with? (Answer: China) ...I was looking at Laserglow's models just last night which are likewise high powered. Anyone owning a modded laser or buying a 3B is supposed to be sensible with it and you won't find this sort of thing on a typical store shelf. I think they're supplying US forces with a variety of units and these new ones (being waterproof) are probably ideal for desert and tropical search & rescue conditions. Lithium 123A batteries are likewise ideal for their sustained output levels and extremely long shelf life. For what they are, their specs are pretty cool per $. Curious to hear from anyone who gets to handle/use one (either wavelength).

And now....I must go sell a few more pints of blood...

 

[jellyfish414]

When this was a big argument a few months ago (the legality of WL) I emailed the FDA to ask. It took about six weeks to get a response, but the agent who finally wrote back indicated WL is not authorized to distribute in the United States and that they will "continue to investigate Wicked Lasers and put more effort into curbing the importion of illegal lasers" whatever that means. (Personally, I take it to mean they don't really care :lolsign: )

The agent didn't quite explain why they were illegal, but from what I've read here, 3B lasers must have safety features such as a turn-key lock and a delay.

Check out Laserglow's page on the legality of the new Hercules model:http://www.laserglow.com/hppointers.html They have a nice discussion of modified laser pointers vs "certified portable lasers."

 

[imbolc]

FDA on WL "DETENTION WITHOUT PHYSICAL EXAMINATION"
http://www.fda.gov/ora/fiars/ora_import_ia9504.html

 

[nero_design]

The addition of 'safety' features doesn't affect FDA rating, legality and/or approval of such items. To quote the link posted by imbolcabove:

This alert does not cover detention of shipments of laser
pointers, laser levels, laser gunsights, laser light show
projectors, laser pointer key chains, and similar products
where:

(1) there is not an emission indicator;
(2) there is not a separate beam attenuator; or
(3) the certification and identification information is in the
instructions for use rather than on the product itself.

The main issue that the FDA had was with 'incorrectly labelled and non-labelled' lasers... and frankly, that's quite understandable. Who wants a 15mW keyring laser when being it's sold as a 'harmless 2mW pointer'? I'm in Australia & we just don't have such scrutiny or concern with private imports....yet.
_____________________________________

I think it's great seeing Blue lasers at last in a portable manner. It's a shame that they require the Lithium 123As over AAA batteries but I think that the 3 hours continuous use by far exceeds the 10 minutes of use that the old twin-6volt HeNe pointers would offer.
_____________________________________

Has anyone here used a 473nm blue laser in front of friends yet? What was their general reaction or response to the colour?

 

[exterminate]

3499.99 for a 40mw blue laser....

if only i was crazy.

 

[kushy04]

I beleive I am crazy...

I beleive I shall get one...

I beleive I am referring to the 300mW greenie...

I beleive I can take it into the pool with me...

I beleive I shall have fun...

 

[The_LED_Museum]

Has anyone here used a 473nm blue laser in front of friends yet? What was their general reaction or response to the colour?

I'lll fess up to doing this...and one of the only times it operated reasonably properly too.
Two of my best friends take me out for birthday pizza every September, and this time, I had the blue laser pointer in my bag. I whipped it out when we got to the restaraunt and sat down after placing our order. They seemed almost mesmerised by the color of the beam, and they're not flashaholics - they're the kind of people who would keep a plastic 2-D cell incandescent flashlight in the garbage drawer for emergency use only.
But they really did like the color of the blue laser beam, tell ya what. :thumbsup:

 

[nero_design]

Interesting! I've heard that the blue beam colour is quite mesmerising. Quite a few people have said that they find it unusual since they only get to see that colour on the more powerful Argons. I've always been fond of the beam colour in the Argon lasers but the new DPSS blues (especially the new Deep Blues) are supposed to be quite interesting on the eyes.

 

[The_LED_Museum]

I have a single line TEM00 argon ion laser emitting radiation at 488nm at 16mW, and (currently away for warranty repair) a blue DPSS laser emitting radiation at 473nm at ~170µW, and I definitely prefer the wavelength of the DPSS laser - though in no way am I poo-pooing the argon ion laser.

I've heard of blue DPSS lasers emitting at approximately 444nm; directly-injected blue diode lasers are made that emit at 440nm if you're willing to pay the price (~$5,000.00 the last time I checked - and that's just for the bare laser diode with no optics, case, or PSU). I've never seen either of these though, so I cannot offer any commentary on the beam color.

 

[Lunarmodule]

I'm really salivating at these new models. First Laserglow rolling out the triple D cell 300mW Hercules and now these gems! This was the stuff of dreams six months ago when I really wanted something like it. The prices are even reasonable given the performance levels, although most of you are doing double takes on the blue units.

I have a 50mW 473nm blue laser from Extreme and it is stunning to behold, much more subdued than a 532nm green but much more enticing to view IMHO. Most benchtop units retail for $3000 or so for under 100mW in blue, so the prices of the WL Spyders are not too out of line, just steep. Theres nothing else to compare them to, the previous <5mW blue pointers were just pathetic so these should actually be worthwhile, albeit lottery-winner expensive. I think 20-30mW of blue is necessary to have a nice viewable beam.

I cant wait until some lucky dog acquires one of these and posts a thread here. I might have to sell off some things and go after one of these, most likely a blue unit as I have a strong preference for the color.

 

[Raccoon]

Does anyone here REALLY want a laser rated at "300mW with a peak of 450mW"? Does anyone here even know what that MEANS?

It means that these lasers are extremely unstable and unreliable. A laser that has an average output of 300mW with a "peak" of 450mW, means that it also swings down to 150mW. While using this laser, you will notice extreme modulation and disappointment.

PS. Wicked Laser does not "manufacture" (read: fabricate) ANYTHING. They only "create" (read: modify) existing lasers with ultra-cool gimmick names.

 

[Athoul]

Actually the lasers are garaunteed not to go below 300mW, they do infact make their own lasers though not all their models. The 450mW is most liekly the initial startup spike that all DPSS lasers experience.

They might assemble their products and not make the actual parts, but this would also give you a unique end product depending on their design. However they are slowely starting to come out with their own unique products.

 

[bootleg2go]

Raccoon is right,
Large peak power measurements that vary much from the average power output is a sign of instability. If the peak power is more than 8-10% more than the average power output, then it's too unstable and could die at any time. So for instance a 200mW (average output power) laser that has peak power output of greater than 220mW, will have a much reduced lifetime and the higher the percentage of peak vs average output the worse and shorter it life will be.
A 300mw with 450mw peak output would have 50% instability and it's life would be super short and die at any time. A 200mW average that peaks at 250mW would have 25% instability and not really last long either.

Any of mine that have over 10% instability over a 20 second period measured at .1 second intervals, is not sold and goes back for repair/replacement.

Since the new power meter I now have can sample of time and give statistics on the output plot, I see typical instability of 4-8% over a 20 second period on my lasers.

Also with peak measurements, it goes both ways. You can't just say a minimum of XXXmW with peaks up to XXXmW. The instability goes both ways, negative too. A 300mW laser with 450mW peaks is going to have some valleys as low as 150mW at times.

bootleg2go

 

[KBlaserman]

From what I know all CNI and Lambda lasers have 20% instability, as far as i know Lambda at least will not let you send a laser back because it has more than 10% of instability. Unless the laser has a system with TEC and VDC Driver it will always have stability problems.



Not to disagree with you but I have had lasers with the standard 20% instability last me for over 4 years with good care.

ALSO: any company that says their laser won't dip down didn't tell you that, when you use your laser you will drain your batteries and then the output will be greatly lowered.

 

[alaskawolf]

Does anyone here REALLY want a laser rated at "300mW with a peak of 450mW"?
.

Yes

 

[bootleg2go]

From what I know all CNI and Lambda lasers have 20% instability, as far as i know Lambda at least will not let you send a laser back because it has more than 10% of instability. Unless the laser has a system with TEC and VDC Driver it will always have stability problems.



Not to disagree with you but I have had lasers with the standard 20% instability last me for over 4 years with good care.

ALSO: any company that says their laser won't dip down didn't tell you that, when you use your laser you will drain your batteries and then the output will be greatly lowered.

Most bench top TEC cooled lasers have their stability rate in % change over 4 or more hours of sampling. I agree that all the handheld laser will vary in output as their battery voltage/charge decreases and would have horrible stability over hours of testing if a power supply was used to as the voltage source. Over that amount of time, TEC cooling is needed for both the diode and seperately for the crystal as they each have different thermal coefficients. What I measure is stability during the 1st 20 seconds before the battery drops in output.
I have no problem returning any product that does not meet the spec agreed upon with the manufacturer/distributor. I buy in large quantities an have some say in what is aceptable and what is not.

I also test for any movement of the beam to the target over the test period and the beam moving around much is a sign of instability as well.
What meter do you use to test your lasers with before shipping them to customers?

bootleg2go

 

[KBlaserman]

That's great that you have the opportunity to have a say in what goes on, most other people do not have that luxury.

Its funny how when you open a site you have 1000x people against you and would only wish anything better that you get hit buy a bus. I have had people sit outside my house and call me just to put me down; I don't understand the community for lasers, quite odd. I hope you haven't had the same experience as me.

 

[bootleg2go]

That's great that you have the opportunity to have a say in what goes on, most other people do not have that luxury.

Its funny how when you open a site you have 1000x people against you and would only wish anything better that you get hit buy a bus. I have had people sit outside my house and call me just to put me down; I don't understand the community for lasers, quite odd. I hope you haven't had the same experience as me.

In the beginning I didn't have much clout, but my orders got larger and more frequent and that helps, you will see.

I don't understand??? Are you getting 1000's of people against you emailing and calling you on the phone? I usually only get ~30 messages with questions each day and that is with my site getting ~70,000 hits per day, no phone calls as that number is given out except upon request or to current customers.

Bootleg2go

 

[KBlaserman]

No that was an exaggeration, but it seems more are against me than with me. they don't even know what they are talking about and they will put me down.



I had one guy say.



"Great... more illegal, overpriced, high-power laser pointers. Just what the world needs.

I especially like the part where the "IN STOCK" icon represents items that are NOT IN STOCK and usually ship within 1 - 2 business weeks. What is a "business week" anyway? "



Some people are just ignorant..



U advertised by being friendly and by word of mouth right..



Also I don't give out my phone #. I do have a fax and email though.

 

[rsilvers]

Jellyfish,

I am not sure why you are so excited to discourage people from buying from Wicked. Wicked is not being deceptive. They are correct that their lasers are legal to "own" in the US and they say many times they are dangerous if misused.

BBlaserman, you state that the new Spyder series is 'very illegal.' That is false information. I believe you say this because they do not have a beam attenuator or key lock. They are sold as "OEM industrial portable laser components." That is an acceptable variance under FDA regs. Edmund Scientific sells OEM IIIb laser components in the US and has for years.

The FDA is correct that 'high powered laser pointers' are illegal to sell,
but the Spyder series is not sold as a consumer product or a laser pointer.

Athoul,

"You can not sell 3b lasers in the USA unless they meet the safety requirments by the CDRH"

That is not true for OEM industrial laser components.

"but there is no law that says you can either"

Sigh. That is not how laws work.

If you import a Spyder with the intention of integrated it into/onto another product (such as packaging it with a telescope), it is 100% legal. Wicked makes it clear with a user-agreement. Once you have it, you can do what you want with it. Here is a small part of their user agreement:

"Legal Notice for US Customers: Wicked Lasers products are class IIIb lasers. They exceed the US FDA power limitation of 5mW for import as laser pointers or for general use and are classified as OEM (original equipment manufacturer) laser components for industrial use or for incorporation into another product in accordance with 21 CFR (code of Federal Regulations) 1040.10 and 1040.11."

Anyone who says they are illegal to import are just plain wrong.