Newbie questions

[jon_slider]

I have to agree.

guys, youre really getting sidetracked here, arguing about whether you agree or disagree with someone who agrees or disagrees with my opinion.. Why not keep it simple, post your own answer to the original post.. give your own opinions, instead of getting into multiple layers of opinions about opinions.. answer the OPs question.. WhirledPeas

For illustration of CCT and CRI options, though the OP does not like the Zebralight form factor
SC52 L2
Nominal CCT 6300K 75?CRI
SC52 L2 AA Flashlight Cool White - ZebraLight, Inc.:
"I would strongly recommend against buying the L2. The L2 contains the new "lighter" switch. The lighter switch self activates all the time in my pocket. You only realize after the light starts heating up"

SC5fc
Nominal CCT 4000K 85CRI

to the OP, note the huge difference in CCT
there is also a large difference in CRI

for more education, heres a thread that has pictures of various CCT and CRI plots and graphs

Do you prefer Warm or Neutral White?

Im heavily biased to the 4000k 91CRI Nichia.. your needs may vary.. I will stop harping on it for now

 

[germ65]

look at my last signature link "Tint (actually CCT) Selection" and page through looking at all the pictures to get oriented

OK, I see. High CRI means higher color fidelity. I hadn't thought about this. Maybe there is merit in high CRI, if it does not come at the expense of much intensity.

I have a lot of criteria you dont mention. I dont want PWM, so I wont buy the Eagletac. I wont buy the Fenix because it is not High CRI, So the L3 L10 with Nichia 219 is closest to my primary criteria, No Clickie, No PWM and High CRI

OK, so now I have TWO more questions:
1. Why no PWM?
2. Why no "clickie"? Does that mean you want twisting on/off?

I suggest you NOT straddle the fence with the 14500 requirement unless you can find a light with NoPWM, just buy an AA light with a Nichia 219 LED, and leave LiIon and Low CRI Cool White for another day and another flashlight.

When youre really ready for a LiIon experience, join the big boys and get into an 18650 light. Its in a whole other league. Or, if you want to edc something smaller, look at a single CR123 light (possibly the most popular high brightness edc battery size) with LiIon compatibility, High CRI, and NoPWM (which means no HDS, Malkoff nor McGizmo)

I looked at 18650, but that's a much larger battery, and therefore a much larger light. Not for the pocket anymore.

Whatever you buy, you will learn things you like and new things you are curious about. I bet you cant buy just one

I believe you are right. I already want two or three...

 

[germ65]

If you are pondering switching to NiMh (Eneloops or equivalent) and also comtemplating going Li-Ion in the future, go ahead and get a charger that can charge multiple formats. I suggest the Xtar VC4, or Nitecore D4 (or the 2 cell equivalents). These are smart chargers and you can use them to charge Lithium Ion after you are aware of the dangers of using such cells.

MX421, thanks for the charger suggestions.

 

[germ65]

Do you prefer Warm or Neutral White?

Im heavily biased to the 4000k 91CRI Nichia.. your needs may vary.. I will stop harping on it for now

But, looking at the tech specs for the Eagletac D25A (http://eagletac.com/html/d25arc/features/output.html):

LED Lumen: Turbo/High/Med/Low
XM-L2 U2: 200/121/11/1
XP-G2 S2: 190/117/13/1
Nichia 219 (CRI 92): 132/82/10/1

So I lose 33% of my output by choosing a high CRI LED. That's a heavy price to pay.

 

[jon_slider]

OK, I see. High CRI means higher color fidelity. I hadn't thought about this. Maybe there is merit in high CRI, if it does not come at the expense of much intensity.

the penalty is significant, take a Lumintop tool as an example, its 110 lumens on high with a XPG2 and just 80 lumens with the Nichia. The XPG2 is 38% brighter, but has a CRI of 71, the Nichia CRI is 91 or 28% more red production essentially.

OK, so now I have TWO more questions:
1. Why no PWM?
it interferes with my iPhone photos, of flashlights LOL, see the PWM sticky, I have lots of posts and pictures of examples where PWM is revealed. imo its like using a strobe, albeit at higher frequency of variable noticeability.. Im esoteric, I dont want my brain getting pulsed lighting..
2. Why no "clickie"? Does that mean you want twisting on/off?
Im not in a pocket clipped knife nor light phase. I drop either in a pocket. A clickie is more potential to accidental activation. Also clickies make clickie noises. I prefer the silent twistie.. otoh, clickie is much easier to hand to a naive user.. And Clickie does not have the issue of skipping modes that a twistie can have when over greased. I think clickie is good if the carry mode is pocket clip based. In fact, its easier to operate a clickie one handed.

I looked at 18650, but that's a much larger battery, and therefore a much larger light. Not for the pocket anymore.
I tend to agree, and am also considering buying an AA

I believe you are right. I already want two or three...

Im fighting the urge to invite another battery technology into my life (LiIon). Im quite happy with Eneloops, in fact, I have some AA size and no light to put them in. I almost ordered an L3 L10, but they were out of the color I wanted.. Orange.. I dont want black.. these preferences make my wallet happy

My Nichia AAA lights are great for indoors and close up, which is what I wanted. But I also realize they are too low powered to be useful for other things, like working on a car in daylight. I considered the SC5 but it has PWM, I looked at the new Olight, but they use ridiculously low CRI, in favor of the market leading spec, brightness.. Unfortunately buying for brightness comes at the expense of CRI.. hence, more than one light

enjoy shopping, share your impressions

 

[eh4]

Oh, you're going to get flamed mercilessly now. ;-)
Not that kind of forum.
All I'll say is that Coast had one, great big, good idea, and they sat on it and prevented other manufacturers from using it. And other than "zooming" spot to flood, their Lights kind of suck IMO. -So they sat on innovation... deprived us of more great options, and themselves fell behind. ..
There's nothing sadder than having a great idea and getting scared that you'll never have another great idea. -It can easily become a self fulfilling prophesy.

 

[Chicken Drumstick]

But, looking at the tech specs for the Eagletac D25A (http://eagletac.com/html/d25arc/features/output.html):

LED Lumen: Turbo/High/Med/Low
XM-L2 U2: 200/121/11/1
XP-G2 S2: 190/117/13/1
Nichia 219 (CRI 92): 132/82/10/1

So I lose 33% of my output by choosing a high CRI LED. That's a heavy price to pay.

to a certain extent people get too hung up on lumen numbers. Basically I wouldn't worry all that much. If numbers matter, then you'll want to be looking at li-ion power anyhow.

The Nichia LED's are quite nice. But reasonably rare in standard lights, and not usually driven to their full potential. A neutral white Cree emitter will be a good step, even if the CRI isn't quite as good.

And honestly the the best way to learn this is to buy a few lights and see what th differences are. Reading stuff on forums will only get you so far.

And you you don't need to spend a fortune to get nice lights either. If you feel responsible enough moving to li-ion will allow you far more choice and a source of cheap performing torches.

The Convoy range of flashlights are brilliant. Well made, great output, good drivers and a choice of emitter tints. And they start from $11 with free shipping.

Use Google to find a company called Banggood and then search for Convoy S2.

 

[emarkd]

Use Google to find a company called Banggood and then search for Convoy S2.

Nothing wrong with this advice but I'll just add that Convoy themselves maintain a factory store right here on AliExpress. You may actually get slightly better prices on a reseller like Banggood or Gearbest, but you can support a small company and get much faster service by buying directly from them on Ali. Choose the ~$2 epacket shipping option and you'll have your light in about 2 weeks.

 

[germ65]

Chicken Drumstick, Convoy light look good, but it seems to me they all use 18650.

 

[Chicken Drumstick]

Chicken Drumstick, Convoy light look good, but it seems to me they all use 18650.

Yes they are mostly 18650, which is why I say it's well worth considering going to Li-ion.

I have nothing against NiMh and indeed have quite a few, but it's a bit like comparing steam power with petrol.

But if you have an interest in flashlights and want to learn about them, then you may find it more cost affective to look at alternatives.

For example, an EagleTac D25A is what $45-55 in the US. This is still a good light, and you may still want to get something like this.

But if you are unsure about tints or CRI, it'll get pricey to try them at $50 a time.

Something like the Convoy S2+
http://www.banggood.com/Convoy-S2-CREE-71356-5-Modes-LED-Flashlight-1x18650-Titanium-p-954830.html

Can be had in 5 different tints and you can probably buy 3 for the price of one EagleTac. Once you know what you like, then spend it on the more pricey ones.



If you want to try a Nichia LED out cheaper, take a look at the Astrolux A01:
http://www.banggood.com/Astrolux-A0...of-Keychain-EDC-LED-Flashlight-p-1026854.html

These run on NiMh AAA's, so no need for Li-ion either.


-- I'm no way claiming these are better than lights like the EagleTac or other premium brands, just that they are more cost effective way of sampling different tints and LEDs until you know what you like.

 

[jon_slider]

Something like the Convoy S2+
http://www.banggood.com/Convoy-S2-CREE-71356-5-Modes-LED-Flashlight-1x18650-Titanium-p-954830.html
… If you want to try a Nichia LED out cheaper, take a look at the Astrolux A01:
http://www.banggood.com/Astrolux-A0...of-Keychain-EDC-LED-Flashlight-p-1026854.html...
-- I'm no way claiming these are better than lights like the EagleTac or other premium brands, just that they are more cost effective way of sampling different tints and LEDs until you know what you like.

Great Post, even though it lacks an AA light that the OP asked for
Major respect for your posting links, and I found your review:
Review: Convoy S2+ (the red one!) – Fantastic 18650 EDC
and this one that shows a size comparison to an Eagletac that can use 16650:
Review: Four-way Convoy S2/S3 mini-review | BudgetLightForum.com
imo those lights definitely need a pocket clip to keep them vertical in pocket (if youre into carrying the weight), too big to roll around in the bottom of a pocket

one thing that stood our for me, the Convoy lacks an approximately 1 lumen level.. otoh, the low and medium on the AAA Astrolux are lower than I like . In AAA I prefer the Maratac (only comes in Cool White) and ReyLight Tool lows (available with Nichia)

sooo, now we have to add the criteria for mode preferences for the OP.. does a 1 lumen, or even a 0.5 lumen apply to your needs?
Im a big fan of the 4 mode (.09-3-30-90) Nichia equipped AA battery L3 offerings, available in clickie or twisty..
L3 Illumination L10 - SBFlashlights

this has turned out to be a very informative thread, I hope the OP shares impressions of whatever he buys.
Resistance is Futile

ps, a visual on the tradeoffs between brightness (lumens), and CRI (color) from Darksucks.com

 

[germ65]

sooo, now we have to add the criteria for mode preferences for the OP.. does a 1 lumen, or even a 0.5 lumen apply to your needs?

Yes, definitely like more modes. In fact, in my OP I asked for continuously adjustable output.
In this age of electronics, why not have 7-8 modes instead of just 3 or 4? Each click goes through the modes from low to high, then low again. With the twistie, you could even twist one way to go up in intensity, twist the other way to go down.

 

[mcnair55]

I would buy a decent Led Lenser if I were starting over, a zoomable one and a simple aaa key chain light and that would be me done and several hundred pounds better off.

 

[vadimax]

I would buy a decent Led Lenser if I were starting over, a zoomable one and a simple aaa key chain light and that would be me done and several hundred pounds better off.

LED Lensers are inferior to Fenix FD40 -- less output at a higher price. And not even IPX-8 rated.

 

[mcnair55]

LED Lensers are inferior to Fenix FD40 -- less output at a higher price. And not even IPX-8 rated.

Last time I looked it was a tube that produced light, inferior is your opinion but my Led Lenser(s) have no issues at all and I own more Fenix than any other brand.New users do not need to be shown the anorak at such early stages as they can try the fit on later.

 

[vadimax]

Last time I looked it was a tube that produced light, inferior is your opinion but my Led Lenser(s) have no issues at all and I own more Fenix than any other brand.New users do not need to be shown the anorak at such early stages as they can try the fit on later.

There is a neighbor thread "Why Led Lenser's flashlight so bad?" and you offer the one to a newbie...

 

[mcnair55]

There is a neighbor thread "Why Led Lenser's flashlight so bad?" and you offer the one to a newbie...

Well as one of the best-selling Torches in the world with slick marketing and tremendous retail support and the company quickly snapped up by another top company in "Leatherman" I think my recommendation stands proud.As a user of many brands including Fenix and Led Lenser, I can tell you I have no issues with either.Because of Led Lensers dominance in retail and at trade level they are easy to come by and trade wise you generally will get a discount.

I am fortunate I use my light for its intended use of illuminating a darkened area and do not give a stuff about all the nonsense I read from the armchair scientists with graphs and whatever.I like to enjoy my hobby by usage and not having to wear an anorak and obtaining a first class honours degree in Applied Science.

 

[vadimax]

I may be wrong, but I guess if a person joins CPF he or she hopes to get the most technologically and price wise balanced response. Not a product well known or available only because of marketing decisions.

I personally would never offer anyone to buy anything that contained 70% of its price -- salary to marketing department, reseller revenue, dealer's margin, etc. Plus outdated technology.

 

[Chicken Drumstick]

I may be wrong, but I guess if a person joins CPF he or she hopes to get the most technologically and price wise balanced response. Not a product well known or available only because of marketing decisions.

I personally would never offer anyone to buy anything that contained 70% of its price -- salary to marketing department, reseller revenue, dealer's margin, etc. Plus outdated technology.

I bet many things you buy are exactly what you describe. In retail it's normal for a minimum of 100% mark up.

Led Lensers generally are available with the same tech as most others. For example, what is out dated on the P7.2???? It uses an XP-G2 emitter on a custom copper sink pad! And is one of the higher performing torches available using an alkaline power source.

Other Lensers can be had with Li-ion including 18650's and different programmable regulation modes. The only thing they don't offer is a choice of emitter tint, but then neither do FourSevens, Nitecore, Olight or Fenix for the most part.

The only real negative with Lensers is the higher models are comparatively expensive. Although the lower and mid range models are fairly priced vs other premium offerings.

 

[mcnair55]

I may be wrong, but I guess if a person joins CPF he or she hopes to get the most technologically and price wise balanced response. Not a product well was known or available only because of marketing decisions.

I personally would never offer anyone to buy anything that contained 70% of its price -- salary to the marketing department, reseller revenue, dealer's margin, etc. Plus outdated technology.

I am not privy to the costs of how Led Lenser get to a selling point, always thought that was strictly confidential information and not shared with the public or trade for that matter but never the less buying Led Lenser in the EU makes far greater sense due to our consumer protection laws.Many times you read on here Mr Joe Spanner buys a new branded light and after a day or two it fails to light and Mr Spanner decides to try and fix it himself after failure he emails the maker and gets no real service returns the item to seller and then becomes the next village id yacht waiting weeks for a repair.That never happens with LL over here.Using your inside information of 70% of its price provides much more thinking out of the box.