No more nitecore for me.

[KeepingItLight]

My EA8 was basically a "shelf queen" but it still died. That mirrors the story given by others.

What are some of the common causes of this sort of failure?

Oxidation that impedes an already flakey connection somewhere, perhaps in a switch?

Standby operation leading to a circuit failure somewhere?

 

[CelticCross74]

from what I have read its just bad soldering and weak connections

 

[scs]

I speculate that the frequency of Nitecore product failures is getting blown out of proportion. Despite seemingly having a less than stellar reputation, Nitecore is still in business. Thriving it appears! In addition, Nitecore continues to be a popular brand on CPF. If Nitecore quality is really that bad, why are people still buying their lights? Why is Nitecore still in business? Are people really that dumb, irrational, or loyal to the brand? Maybe Nitecore is really no better and no worse.

 

[scs]

In case they ARE that bad, then c'mon guys, do everyone a favor, everyone on CPF, fellow flashaholics, fellow consumers in general. Stop buying Nitecore. Don't keep feeding bad businesses.

 

[KeepingItLight]

from what I have read its just bad soldering and weak connections

That sounds plausible, but what I don't get is how a bad solder joint could suddenly crack or break in a non-moving flashlight. Wouldn't that usually require some sort of motion, if only the normal operation of the flashlight? Obviously, an impact could crack a solder joint.

The light "18650" was talking about was just sitting on a shelf!

 

[NoNotAgain]

That sounds plausible, but what I don't get is how a bad solder joint could suddenly crack or break in a non-moving flashlight. Wouldn't that usually require some sort of motion, if only the normal operation of the flashlight? Obviously, an impact could crack a solder joint.

The light "18650" was talking about was just sitting on a shelf!

You can place blame on your local environmentalist for RHoS legislation.

For those that don't know, RHoS is the reduction of hazardous substances act. Until 10 years or so, solder was lead, and a small amount of tin or antimony.

Lead is now a dirty word. Lead was replaced by tin based solders which are environmentally good. Unfortunately tin solder exposed to moisture grows whiskers. When the whiskers touch, circuits short out. The only way around this issue is to conformal coat the soldered joints.

Production soldering is done via flow coating. If the temperature of the solder is off just a little bit, the solder doesn't have the duct ability and it cracks.

A few years back, either Play Stations or Xboxes had this problem. Some nVidia graphics cards also suffer this problem. The problem can be temporally fixed by reheating the devise to reflow the solder. The only sure fix is repair by lead based solder.

 

[18650]

You can place blame on your local environmentalist for RHoS legislation. For those that don't know, RHoS is the reduction of hazardous substances act. Until 10 years or so, solder was lead, and a small amount of tin or antimony. Lead is now a dirty word. Lead was replaced by tin based solders which are environmentally good. Unfortunately tin solder exposed to moisture grows whiskers. When the whiskers touch, circuits short out. The only way around this issue is to conformal coat the soldered joints. Production soldering is done via flow coating. If the temperature of the solder is off just a little bit, the solder doesn't have the duct ability and it cracks. A few years back, either Play Stations or Xboxes had this problem. Some nVidia graphics cards also suffer this problem. The problem can be temporally fixed by reheating the devise to reflow the solder. The only sure fix is repair by lead based solder.

That's an easy scapegoat but it's a level playing field and none of my other RoHS compliant lights have failed in such a way. Do we actually know it's poor soldering that does the Nitecore's in?

 

[18650]

I speculate that the frequency of Nitecore product failures is getting blown out of proportion. Despite seemingly having a less than stellar reputation, Nitecore is still in business. Thriving it appears! In addition, Nitecore continues to be a popular brand on CPF. If Nitecore quality is really that bad, why are people still buying their lights? Why is Nitecore still in business? Are people really that dumb, irrational, or loyal to the brand? Maybe Nitecore is really no better and no worse.

I personally have only the EA8 as one. I bought it because I was looking at the TK41 but the neutral emitter of the EA8 won me over. I suspect the lower pricing may have won others over. The EA8 vs the TK41 for example is almost 25% lower in upfront cost.

 

[ForrestChump]

Here are some simple FACTS that people don't like. Im going to use a little OT to make my point. For example, I don't like my fat gut, doesn't mean its not there.

FACT:

Nitecore makes flaky lights - 8 solid years of CPF research backs that up. A lot of CPF will back that up. There are many instances of crap warranty experiences as well. They also have stolen from CPF members. The waters may be murky here, but if so desired I can provide other examples.

FACT:

SureFire, through great effort, is now a solid hit or miss manufacturer who dumps heaps of money into marketing. Their R&D seems feeble at best and their QC appears non existent. Then they let the very friendly a good natured folks in tech support clean up the mess. They have not produced a single model in the past 2-3 years ( PK time? Not sure?) that has not had significant and widespread reliability and functionality issues. Many seem to go unresolved for months and in rare cases, years.


These are facts we don't like. The proof is in the Google. Just because I don't like brussel sprouts doesn't make them disappear off my plate ( Likely contributing to the gut that I don't like, but is still there, despite the fact I don't like it. ) I get a little tired of the excuses when you can simply use your keyboard and invoke a little free thought into your fact gathering to form a more well rounded opinion.


Don't tell me it's a numbers game. There are manufactures out there with thousands of lights in service with next to nothing of reported failures. There are also ones that have 0 warranty complaints. ZERO.

 

[snowlover91]

Fwiw I haven't had any issues with Nitecore failures with my oldest light being a 2009 Nitecore D10. Gave an EA41w to a buddy who uses it on camping trips every few weeks and his is working fine also. My favorite lights they made were the PD series; these did have a lot of QC issues for some members here but if you got one that worked well out of the box then it will last a long time. They've done better in recent years to up their QC similar to how Zebralight seems to have upped their game as well.

 

[ForrestChump]

Fwiw I haven't had any issues with Nitecore failures with my oldest light being a 2009 Nitecore D10. Gave an EA41w to a buddy who uses it on camping trips every few weeks and his is working fine also. My favorite lights they made were the PD series; these did have a lot of QC issues for some members here but if you got one that worked well out of the box then it will last a long time. They've done better in recent years to up their QC similar to how Zebralight seems to have upped their game as well.

Had 2 D10's

Hardly used,

I don't doubt there were solid designs behind those lights and some have potential to work for years, the consistency was the problem...you older CPF folks remember the ones that were snapping in half? ha...

 

[ForrestChump]

Okay, okay. There's only one way to fix this. Everyone send me all of your Nitecore products. If you don't want them, don't throw them away. I'll take them.

MORE NITECORE FOR ME!

Nope, Im sending you Brussel sprouts, only they may not exist, because I don't like them.

 

[WarRaven]

I've been seeing some here, having to use that Zebra light warranty, that's alarming to me.
Not so to many here though, given the terrain are these bumps overlooked too I wonder.

 

[CelticCross74]

go as far back on CPF as you can and the overwhelming result are NC complaints out of all brand complaints. Why are they still in business? Because not all high output LED buyers are flashaholics they just equate LED lights with being very bright and then may consider form factor at most. The AR coating on my first P12 stopped halfway across the lens it drove me up the wall but it still works. MH20 and the other 2015 models seem to be a new gen of NC that for now seems to have gotten many manufacturing kinks out of the way

 

[snowlover91]

Had 2 D10's

Hardly used,

I don't doubt there were solid designs behind those lights and some have potential to work for years, the consistency was the problem...you older CPF folks remember the ones that were snapping in half? ha...

Ah yes I remember the issue of some of them having a thin wall and snapping in half. I also remember the issues some had with using 14500 batteries which fried the circuit board of some lights as well as the piston switching issues. Their QC back then was pretty bad and was really put in the spotlight with the PD series. However the ones which worked did work well and all my PD lights in my collection work great even now. My D10 I've used about 6 years straight and finally retired it from EDC use after breaking the glass lens. The consistency was definitely the problem back then but the good ones without the switch issues/thin wall were solid and work quite well.

Although Nitecore has had a history of QC issues if you look at their overall progress you will see they are upping their QC control and consistency as well. The lights I've bought from them in the past 2 years have all been excellent with no problems. My SRT5, EA41W given to a friend, Ex11.2, and D11.2 lights all work great with no switch or QC issues. I believe if you look on the forum you'll find that 2015 has been a significant step up with their consistency and quality control vs previous years, especially 2008-2012 which seemed to be the worst years for them with things gradually improving thereafter.

 

[ForrestChump]

Ah yes I remember the issue of some of them having a thin wall and snapping in half. I also remember the issues some had with using 14500 batteries which fried the circuit board of some lights as well as the piston switching issues. Their QC back then was pretty bad and was really put in the spotlight with the PD series. However the ones which worked did work well and all my PD lights in my collection work great even now. My D10 I've used about 6 years straight and finally retired it from EDC use after breaking the glass lens. The consistency was definitely the problem back then but the good ones without the switch issues/thin wall were solid and work quite well.

Although Nitecore has had a history of QC issues if you look at their overall progress you will see they are upping their QC control and consistency as well. The lights I've bought from them in the past 2 years have all been excellent with no problems. My SRT5, EA41W given to a friend, Ex11.2, and D11.2 lights all work great with no switch or QC issues. I believe if you look on the forum you'll find that 2015 has been a significant step up with their consistency and quality control vs previous years, especially 2008-2012 which seemed to be the worst years for them with things gradually improving thereafter.

Hey bro, I don't know who you think you are with your rational and thoughtful response...

That said, I have stood corrected before in the QC department with out of date research of ZebraLight....So the Forrest of Gump, at the suprise of many CPF members, may not be totally infallible. You might just have a valid observation on very current QC.

That said, you steal from CPF members, you steal from me..... no soup for you!

 

[Crazyeddiethefirst]

I can only base my experience with Nitecore on the 7 or 8 lights I own. The EC11 & EA11 have been in the EDC rotation since purchase and so far they are flawless. I also like to Lego the body from my EC20 & the head from the EC11 so I have 960 lumens and 18650 runtimes. I bought my Sunwayman D40 after I read about the switch issues with the NiteCores, but all of their new stuff reflects a solid response to a previous lack of good QC. As of today, I have no qualms recommending NiteCore. Just my 2 cents based on my actual use of their products, not based on anyone else's experience...

 

[campingnut]

I have used my D11 every night for the past five years with zero issues. I use it as a night light next to my bed. I turn it on, tail stand her up to bounce off the ceiling, then read in bed for 30-60 mins. Sometimes I fall asleep and she runs all night. I also knock it off my nightstand onto the hardwood floors quite often. I know this is anecdotal, but this light has been solid.

 

[xzel87]

You can place blame on your local environmentalist for RHoS legislation.

For those that don't know, RHoS is the reduction of hazardous substances act. Until 10 years or so, solder was lead, and a small amount of tin or antimony.

Lead is now a dirty word. Lead was replaced by tin based solders which are environmentally good. Unfortunately tin solder exposed to moisture grows whiskers. When the whiskers touch, circuits short out. The only way around this issue is to conformal coat the soldered joints.

Production soldering is done via flow coating. If the temperature of the solder is off just a little bit, the solder doesn't have the duct ability and it cracks.

A few years back, either Play Stations or Xboxes had this problem. Some nVidia graphics cards also suffer this problem. The problem can be temporally fixed by reheating the devise to reflow the solder. The only sure fix is repair by lead based solder.

I had to stick my laptop motherboard into the oven at 350 degree celcius for 15 minutes to get it fixed. Didn't believe the method when I read it on the Internet, but I tried it anyway and it actually works. It's been baked for 3 times now in the past 2 years so I guess it's not a permanent solution and whatever problem it was having is getting more severe.

After some research, the original problem was that due to repeated heating (expand) and cooling (contract) of the solder points/joints micro cracks are formed in the solder itself and the cracks might get large enough to cut connections. Baking it reflows the solder and reestablishes connection.

I guess this could also happen to flashlights, with repeated heating and cooling through normal usage (extended turbo runs maybe?). Perhaps this is why potted electronics fare better?

The only NC product I have is the MT21A and it is still working fine almost 10 months usage.

 

[CelticCross74]

A good source of NC technical info is on Vinhs page of the forum. Dig deep enough and youll see examples of shoddy soldering and cheap as possible components in almost all NC's save for the Tiny Monster series that hes done. Only now is he cracking open NC lights regularly they are all 2015 models.