Novatac 120P poor run-time?

[robo21]

Robo21...hmmmm.... well, I believe you will still get the most runtime using primaries, as I'm pretty sure they generally have about 1/3 more juice to start with than rechargeables.

Yes, that's what I thought also. But evidently your runtime tests indicate much more runtime on your rechargeable than the primary runtime in the link you provided unless I'm reading the graph wrong.

 

[thermal guy]

robo i just looked at those graphs and to me primary cells last way longer than rechargeable more than 2 times as long if I'm looking at it right

 

[robo21]

robo i just looked at those graphs and to me primary cells last way longer than rechargeable more than 2 times as long if I'm looking at it right

Thanks, you are right! D'uh! I was looking at the red plot. My mistake.

 

[turbodog]

Ok I still think 1 cell should last 1 hour look at the p2d it has a 1 hour runtime on turbo. Two cells shouldn't give it 4 times the run time.

It's not linear. 2 cells have twice the voltage. This allows the converter to work more efficiently, wasting less energy as heat. It also pulls less amperage from the cells, which wastes less energy as heat. And finally, since cell capacity depends on discharge rate, the cells last longer.

So you've got at least 3 things in your favor for 2x123 compared to 1x123.

And yes..... I haven't looked at my runtime #s lately, but 2 cells DOES give about 4x the runtime.

 

[turbodog]

not sure it's a good idea to run rechargeable without doing a reset wont that make the light think it has a primary in it and allow it to drain that battery? not good with rechargeable. i know that the flashlight has a safety to let you know when this is happing but it doesn't shut the light off. you must turn your lite off yourself to save the battery

If the light's set for a primary it will automatically detect a li-ion due to the higher voltage. But if set for a li-ion, you have to manually redetect for primay cells.

 

[turbodog]

I wondered the same thing the pd3 is putting out more lumes on turbo mode and lasts for 1.8 hours with two batteries the novatac lasts for 30 minutes on 1 battery shouldn't it last for close to 1 hour.

See my above post about efficiency. From 2 cells to 1 cell...... qbout 1/4 the runtime at similar brightness levels.

 

[turbodog]

This post in the cpf marketplace details runtime tests done with various cell setups with the hds and novatac light.

 

[tebore]

We really need to pull the old HDS and novatac threads out from CPF MP and dump it all back in CPF Proper.

 

[Derek Dean]

If the light's set for a primary it will automatically detect a li-ion due to the higher voltage. But if set for a li-ion, you have to manually redetect for primay cells.

That's interesting, I didn't know that. I did, however, get 2 very different results for my run time tests using rechargeable cells, depending on whether I had done the battery-detect reset with the rechargeable in place, which gave me a plot that looked like the one on the review site, or when I left the light set for a primary cell (factory reset), which gave an additional 30 minutes of regulated runtime at 60 lumens.

I don't pretend to understand all the variables at play when using li-ion batteries.... I only know that I got fairly substantial, repeatable differences. Maybe the light's automatic detection of the li-ion's higher voltage sets the threshold level differently from a battery-detect reset. Hmmmm........ I do enjoy learning new things and exploring this neat light's potential.

 

[thermal guy]

no truer words have been spoken:twothumbs

 

[berto]

turbodog forget the pd3 wrong light to compare. Now the pd2 has one cell and is putting out about 120 lumes out the front and lasts 1hour on turbo vs .5 hours on the 120. Why? I really want to know because the 120 is my favorit light and dont understand why a light 1/3 the price gets twice the runtime as the novatac with the same battery and output.

 

[thermal guy]

berto dont forget with the novatac after 30min at 120lm the light just doesn't shut off. you still have alot of battery life left and thats why the 120lm only lasts for 30min. it was built like that so you are not left in the dark.You will still have a light that will be very use full for quite some time If hds/novatac built a light with say one setting at 120lm it would more than likely run for alot longer than 30min

 

[turbodog]

turbodog forget the pd3 wrong light to compare. Now the pd2 has one cell and is putting out about 120 lumes out the front and lasts 1hour on turbo vs .5 hours on the 120. Why? I really want to know because the 120 is my favorit light and dont understand why a light 1/3 the price gets twice the runtime as the novatac with the same battery and output.

I think I have a pd3. That's the cree fenix, right? I'm a little rusty on the flood of cree-based lights.

In any case....

1. is the fenix's output valid?

2. what's the runtime plot for the fenix?

3. the novatac's not finished. the designer left before finishing the light

4. novatac has tint control..... wonder what this does to battery life/etc

5. fenix keep same level as it heats up?


In short...... several unknown variables.

My 120 appears brighter than my fenix.....

 

[THE_dAY]

berto,

here is chervrofreak's runtime chart of the P2D-CE and the 120P (both on energizer 123):

http://lights.chevrofreak.com/runtimes/Novatac EDC-120 Beta - vs Fenix P2D - Max.png

remember to not always go by manufacturers specs, since most will overate output/runtime and actually a few will underate output/runtime.

 

[berto]

Ok looking at those runtime graphs clears things up. The novatac seems to have a much better runtime to output ratio.
One more thing that graph is for the pd2 with a cree in it right?

 

[Supernam]

Yes, I always like to look at the "area under the curve" to determine overall runtime.

 

[djblank87]

120 user I have a few questions for you and do not want ot start a new thread so any help would be great.

1. Does the 120 come with the pocket clip?
2. Can it use RCR123?
3. Is it at tough as advertised?

I'm at work right now and am getting ready to buy one and am wondering about the above stated.

Thanks for the help guys and sorry I wasn't trying to steal the thread for the OP.

 

[Derek Dean]

120 user I have a few questions for you and do not want ot start a new thread so any help would be great.

1. Does the 120 come with the pocket clip?
2. Can it use RCR123?
3. Is it at tough as advertised?

I'm at work right now and am getting ready to buy one and am wondering about the above stated.

Thanks for the help guys and sorry I wasn't trying to steal the thread for the OP.

1. Yes it comes with a pocket clip. Actually, I believe it was designed for a belt, and it works very well for that. I like the clip, but quite a few other owners have expressed dissatisfaction with both the design, and with the fact that it bends some what easily.

2. Yes.... the light is rated up to 4.5 volts.... more than enough for a fully charged 3.7 volt RCR123 battery.

3. I think more time is needed for a definitive answer to the question of how tough it is. It seems very well built, and after several months in my front pocket with change, keys, and other assorted pocket stuff, it shows zero signs of wear on the finish...... with the exception of the polycarbonate front window, which does actually have some light scratches. I'm not sure how much, if any, effect these have on the quality of the beam... but I can't see defects while shining it on a white wall.

You might find these interesting:

http://www.cpfreviews.com/NovaTac-EDC120P.php

http://www.light-reviews.com/novatac_120p/review.html

Hope that helps..... feel free to PM me if you have any more questions.

 

[djblank87]

1. Yes it comes with a pocket clip. Actually, I believe it was designed for a belt, and it works very well for that. I like the clip, but quite a few other owners have expressed dissatisfaction with both the design, and with the fact that it bends some what easily.

2. Yes.... the light is rated up to 4.5 volts.... more than enough for a fully charged 3.7 volt RCR123 battery.

3. I think more time is needed for a definitive answer to the question of how tough it is. It seems very well built, and after several months in my front pocket with change, keys, and other assorted pocket stuff, it shows zero signs of wear on the finish...... with the exception of the polycarbonate front window, which does actually have some light scratches. I'm not sure how much, if any, effect these have on the quality of the beam... but I can't see defects while shining it on a white wall.

You might find these interesting:

http://www.cpfreviews.com/NovaTac-EDC120P.php

http://www.light-reviews.com/novatac_120p/review.html

Hope that helps..... feel free to PM me if you have any more questions.

Thank you sir, I just placed my order about four minutes ago. I know that asking "How Tough Is It"? Is kind of a wasted question, but all I meant is will it survive grappling someone and falling on to the ground or chasing a patient and falling and rolling across the ground etc.

But I will find out in do time when I get mine if it will live up to the name. Thanks again :thumbsup:.

 

[THE_dAY]

Ok looking at those runtime graphs clears things up. The novatac seems to have a much better runtime to output ratio.
One more thing that graph is for the pd2 with a cree in it right?

hi berto,
yes that is the cree version of the P2D. i don't think chevrofreak has done a runtime on the rebel version yet.
here is his directory of runtimes, imho, very helpful info:

http://lights.chevrofreak.com/runtimes/?N=A