Phillips weather vision

shepherd79

Newly Enlightened
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hagerstown, MD
OK I got a hold of two pairs of philips weather vision. 9006 and 9005 series. They were givin to me to try it out.
this is what i have read so far on them.
also according to this site they supposed to be better.
it has a slight tint that is visible at some angles. I took some pictures of the bulbs.
Picture 1 (no flash)
Picture 2 (no flash)
picture 3 (no flash)
picture 4 (with flash)

I am going to install them tomorrow into my wife's car, 03 accord.
 
These are commonly used in Europe, or at least they were in the 90s when I was last there. I've seen very few of these in use in the U.S., judging by the number of amber headlights on the road (not many).

Is amber light really better that usual white light in fog/rain/snow??
 
France required all motor vehicle forward illumination devices (headlamps, fog lamps, driving lamps) to emit Selective Yellow light from 1936 through 1993. Selective Yellow light was banned in some European countries (e.g. Germany), and permitted in others (e.g. Netherlands, UK), but it was only ever required in France. For most of those years, it was achieved with absorption filtration. The pre-halogen lamps either had yellow lenses or used bulbs made out of Selective Yellow soft glass, depending on manufacturer and design. Halogen bulbs were initially made out of fused quartz and then hard glass, neither of which is available in Selective Yellow. The H4 halogen bulbs had a Selective Yellow soft glass balloon clinched to the base; all other types (H1, H2, H3...) were used in their ordinary colorless form with a Selective Yellow optical element (lens, reflector coating, or glass balloon built into the lamp unit).

In the late 1980s, dichroic multilayer coatings were applied to bulbs to produce what were generally known as "gold" bulbs. These produced a saturated Selective Yellow light similar to that produced by absorption filtration, at least on axis. The elimination of the Selective Yellow absorption filter was primarily driven by vehicle end-of-life recyclability concerns (they think about these things in Europe), because that particular color in soft glass is obtained by means of Cadmium compounds that are toxic and difficult to recycle safely.

After the mandate for Selective Yellow light was dropped, gold bulbs carried on in production from the major suppliers for awhile, who also released versions with dichroic filters giving a much less saturated yellow color. These were called "All Weather" (Philips Europe), "All Season" (Osram), "All Day" (Tungsram), "Azurro" (Narva) and "Weather Vision" (Philips USA). The light they produce is slightly Selective Yellow tinted, but still falls within international automotive definitions of "white" light. Remember the "white" range is quite large and encompasses the bluish white light from HIDs and LEDs, the brownish white light from old tungsten sealed beams, and everything in between.

These light-yellow bulbs offer no benefit when used in headlamps. A case can be made for using them in fog lamps where no true (fully saturated) Selective Yellow option is available.

"Amber" is an orange-yellow color not used in automotive illumination. It is used in signalling (turn signals, US parking lamps, sidemarkers).

More info here and here.
 
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well I got the lights installed and all i have to say boy the old ones looked like they were about to burn up. This new lights are brighter, but i think it is because they are NEW.
Also, i find them to be a lot easier on the eyes. my eyes don't hurt as much.
 
first thing i notice about the 2 bulbs is not the color, but it looks like the right one does not have the Black filment killer cap on it.
that black cap they put on keeps other drivers from seeing direct into the filiment of the bulb, removing it makes the bulb about 20% brighter, just because its not capped off with black.
a silverstars main feature was using "silver" for the cover cap, as opposed to black. the silver would reflect the light somewhere usable, and also reheat the filment itself a bit. it still stopped other drivers from seeing direct into a tiny hot filiment.

now with that said . . .
i used to scrape the black cap off the dang bulbs, As long as the fixture that it was going into, still provided the filiment cover in it.
i surely didnt need people going blind when passing me, and . . . getting to close to my car.
if the filiment of the bulb is exposed, it makes for a extreeme hotspot, most legal auto headlight lighting, is comming out of 50X as much square area, so it (attempts) to keep peoples irises from closing down, making them blinded by the light. as long as the headlight fixture has the filiment cover in it, then the principal behind the stupid black cap is maintained.

its funny how the same companies are selling slight tint blue lights, and slight tint yellow, and saying that they are BOTH better :)
it just depends on what your Trying to view, and what you NOT trying to view, when using filtering of the spectrum.
from experiance with RGB, blue seems to light up the "skin" of water in the air, much faster than the other colors, i dont know any science behind it, but dumping blue out of a rgb spectrum , you can see through water better, even in the creek or lake.

yellow fog lights really had thier biggest color advantage from showing YOUR car to others, not really helping you see anything. when your in a glow of fog or mist, any colors stand out a lot faster than being just another sun or moon. you have been there, when everything is a "white" blur, it doesnt help to have just some brighter white blur comming out of your car. And if you havent seen fog lights in the fog/mist/snow mabey you can relate to how strongly emergency vehicle lights of red and blue will change the color contrast of the white blur, so you know your comming up on something.

the Wide spread on "yeller" fog lights was obviously intent in making a colorised halo around your car, because "white" driving lights placed LOW too at 13-20* beam pattern were more effective than wide spread fog light to see through fog and snow, just completly useless to anyone being able to see you.

Some of the same things apply to eye filtering, the amasing blue blockers LOL, its not about how much light you removed by filtering, its What you filtered, if your not driving in the blueish skies above, then you dont need that area to be so bright in your view. color contrast, and selective/filtered viewing, with adjustable iris. not everything is about raw lumens output as metered.

Staying alive on the road, is often MORE about protecting yourself from the other driver, than it is about how fast you can slip past them all :) there is no advantage to blinding or reducing visibility of any of the 4000lb death machines humans are caged to.

there is more, but it gets complex, long term night drivers, will get a retnal scarring on the back left side of thier eyeballs, i think (but cant prove it yet) this is due to the headlights comming towards them when thier iris is open at night. this constant source of bright lights in the periferal offset, when thier iris is adjusted for dark, tears a retnal burn back there. the freeway eye fry.

Notes: silverstars are unnessisarily tinted/filtered to a microbe more blue, but the reflective cap (if you have a cap at all) does allow more light to escape than a black cap.
"Fog lights", can also be spotty huge round throwing lights as seen on ya big huge suv things, they are not always wide, nor low ;-)
"driving lights" i referance, were usually about the same pattern as headlights, and just boosted total light in simalarity to headlights.
all of that lights stuff comes in many different packages and sizes and types, that sometimes defeated entirely the "original" or "traditional" design, but was still called what it most represented.
 
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that black cap they put on keeps other drivers from seeing direct into the filiment of the bulb, removing it makes the bulb about 20% brighter

In an integrating sphere, you will see about 9% more luminous flux if you remove the obscuration cap. However, this is useless light. It is coming through an area of unpredictably distorted glass, so it could not be used even if there were a way for it to be collected and focused by the headlamp's optics. If the headlamp has no bulb shield, this light just creates glare and backscatter. if the headlamp has a bulb shield, this light is blocked. There is no good reason to scrape off the obscuration cap. It does not make the headlamps better in any way. At best it does nothing, and at worst it just increases glare and backscatter.

a silverstars main feature was using "silver" for the cover cap, as opposed to black. the silver would reflect the light somewhere usable, and also reheat the filment itself a bit.

Neither of those statements is true. The silver obscuration cap does not reflect the light in any usable fashion, and it does not reheat the filament.

ts funny how the same companies are selling slight tint blue lights, and slight tint yellow, and saying that they are BOTH better

Well, let's talk about color filtration. The visible spectrum consists of all the colors of the rainbow: Red, orange, yellow, green, blue, and indigo + violet. Glowing filaments produce a whole lot of light in the red-orange-yellow-green wavelengths, and relatively little light in the blue-violet wavelengths. To put very rough numbers on the matter, a middle-of-spec 9006 bulb operating at 12.8v produces 1000 lumens, of which approximately 250 are red, 250 are orange, 250 are yellow, 175 are green, 50 are blue and 25 are violet.

Now, suppose you want to add a filter to the glass that makes the light look bluer/colder. How does it do that? Well, there's no such thing as a filter that adds light into the beam passing through it -- filters can only suppress light, not add it. So if we can't add green-blue-violet light, then the only way to get the light to look colder is to suppress green-blue-violet's opposites, which are red-orange-yellow. If we want the light to look, let's say, 20% colder, we suppress red-orange-yellow by 20%. Looking up above, we see that we've got a total of 750 lumens' worth of red, orange and yellow. So, cutting this by 20% leaves 600 lumens, plus essentially all of the bulb's original green-blue-violet output of 250 lumens, so we've now got a bulb that produces light that looks 20% colder and produces 850 lumens.

Now, 850 lumens happens to be the minimum legal output for a 9006 (which has a spec of 1000 lumens, ± 15%). Unless we're an evil fly-by-night company that really doesn't care about quality and legality, we can't produce a bulb that produces only the bare minimum of light, because half our production will be 849 lumens or less just on account of the variances encountered in mass production. So, we have to put in a high-luminance filament to try to counteract some of the filtering losses, but we still have to come in under the max-allowable-wattage spec in DOT or ECE regulations.

So, let's say we build our 9006 with a high-zoot filament that produces 1200 lumens. That's too much for a legal 9006, but we're going to block some of those lumens with our colored filter (blue glass). This 1200-lumen filament produces, let's say, 300 lumens red, 300 lumens orange, 300 lumens yellow, 210 lumens green, 60 lumens blue and 30 lumens violet. Now we put that same blue glass over it, which suppresses red-orange-yellow by 20%. Now we've got 720 lumens' worth of red-orange-yellow after filtration, plus 300 lumens' worth of green-blue-violet. That gives us a 910-lumen bulb, which is enough above the 850-lumen legal minimum that we can run the bulb and even if some filaments only produce 1150 lumens instead of 1200, we're still legally OK. Of course, we still only have 910 lumens instead of 1000, and our 1200-lumen filament is going to have a significantly shorter life than a 1000-lumen filament, but we've got our colder/bluer light appearance in a legal bulb.

By now you probably see why filtering for yellow does not significantly reduce light output: Take our 1000-lumen 9006 as broken down by color output above. No such thing as a filter that adds extra yellow light, so we have to get our yellow by suppressing blue-violet (the particular yellow that yellow headlamp/foglamp bulbs produce, called "selective yellow" and described above, contains all the green found in white light. If we took out green, we'd have a turn signal type of amber-orange light.) OK, then, let's cut blue-violet by 80%. That means we've got our 925 lumens' worth of red-orange-yellow-green, plus 15 lumens' worth of blue-violet (after filtration). Total: 940 lumens. MUCH smaller loss! OK, so we put in a very slightly better filament, say one that produces 1060 lumens, and now we've got 980 lumens' worth of red-orange-yellow-green, plus 16 lumens' worth of blue-violet (after filtration) for a total of 996 lumens, which is for all intents and purposes identical to our original 1000-lumen uncolored bulb (a parking lamp bulb puts out as few as 30 lumens).

from experiance with RGB, blue seems to light up the "skin" of water in the air, much faster than the other colors, i dont know any science behind it, but dumping blue out of a rgb spectrum , you can see through water better, even in the creek or lake.

That is an effect of the interaction between the light and your eyes, not between the light and the water particles in the air. More info here .

yellow fog lights really had thier biggest color advantage from showing YOUR car to others, not really helping you see anything.

Incorrect, see article linked above.

the Wide spread on "yeller" fog lights was obviously intent in making a colorised halo around your car

No. Fog lamps are illumination devices, not conspicuity devices. See here . Of course, most any operating illumination device will provide some conspicuity, but this is incidental, and not deliberate.

"white" driving lights placed LOW too at 13-20* beam pattern were more effective than wide spread fog light to see through fog and snow

This, too, is incorrect. "Driving lights" are more properly called by their technical name, auxiliary high-beam headlamps. They produce a centre-weighted beam with no particular control of glare or backscatter, and as such, they make absolutely rotten bad-weather lights and are illegal for use in traffic, with low beams, or in inclement weather.

not everything is about raw lumens output as metered.

That is true, but assuming we keep the composite beam pattern fixed and can alter only the spectral power distribution ("color") and the overall proportional intensity, the latter is overwhelmingly the predominant factor in the safety performance of a vehicle's forward illumination system.

there is no advantage to blinding or reducing visibility of any of the 4000lb death machines humans are caged to.

Absolutely right. Glare is not the same as conspicuity (a lot of motorcycle operators conflate the two and think brighter and ever-brighter lights are the way to better safety. They are not.)

there is more, but it gets complex

It is indeed very complex, but without intending any mockery, I must ask where you are getting some of these factoids you are presenting.

Notes: silverstars are unnessisarily tinted/filtered to a microbe more blue, but the reflective cap (if you have a cap at all) does allow more light to escape than a black cap.

This is flatly wrong.

"Fog lights", can also be spotty huge round throwing lights as seen on ya big huge suv things, they are not always wide, nor low

The technical regulations governing fog lamps, particularly in North America, are quite lax. The automakers like it that way, for it permits them to cheaply offer useless "fog lamps" as high-profit cosmetic playtoys to gullible vehicle buyers.
 
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ya sure, have you done it?

...it stimulates the reaction we call "glare". So, culling the blue out of the spectrum lightens the optical workload and reduces glare.

and what exactally is the blue bouncing off of to achieve the glare ? a vaccume? LOL
its all about perception, if i can percieve better using that method, all the math and science in the world isnt going to change that.
filtering is effective, as long as the humans eye iris and retnal triggering adjusts , if were using cameras and integrated spheres , then its useless junk. but the eyes adjust and can balance out via triggering and brain assembly.
it is all about perception, because its about what our brains have the ability to see assembled , via contrast, color contrast , and light output, not just light output. then turn around and the constant triggering becomes balanced out again, making the offset filtering or unbalanced spectrum, percieved as "white".

there is some asumption that we know what white even is :)
i live under "bluish" leds, and have begun to perceive it as "white", the spectrum shows quite well that it is not white at all.

its also all about where the light lands, as you discussed, a "PIAA" bulb had a different filiment type (originally) that in some encasements the reflection would make for more throw, depending on the application some people percieved there to be more light throwing in front of thier car, where they needed it, in some applications it changed nothing.
In some USES, driving around in the dark on a weaving country road the lack of flood does not help. yet the slight blue filtering was the thing to discuss, when the light pattern was what some people got the biggest change from. so everybody saw different things, same light, different uses and perceptions of the value of it.

What you stuff something into, How you use it, and what Your Needs are to "reflect back light" from things and colored things vary, i can see no way to determine for every use or person what they percieve to be usefull. only an integrating sphere driving down the road can do that aparentally :)
 
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ya sure, have you done it?

Yes, and yes.

and what exactally is the blue bouncing off of to achieve the glare ? a vaccume?

No. It's "bouncing off of" the human optical system (eyes).

its all about perception

No. It's all about objectively quantifiable performance. Guesses, opinions, subjective preferences and your perceptions do not trump the facts, no matter how much the facts may upset you. The human visual system is a notoriously poor judge of its own performance; it's very easy to create situations in which we feel (subjectively) that we can see much better or not nearly as well as we actually (objectively) can.

filtering is effective

I'm not sure what you mean by this general statement. Filtering is effective in that it removes (filters) a portion of the spectrum of light passing through the filter. The implications of that effect upon seeing performance while driving vary according to the light source, the filter, and the ambient conditions.

but the eyes adjust and can balance out via triggering and brain assembly.

This doesn't mean anything. The eye and brain cannot "balance out" light that has been needlessly removed.

it is all about perception

Repeating this will not make it so. You are as safe as you are, not as safe as you perceive yourself to be.

there is some asumption that we know what white even is

We do. In the context of light, it is clearly and unambiguously defined by several technical standards. That, however, does not mean there is one single specific SPD or CCT that is white. White, like all other light colors, is a range. A box on the CIE 1931 colorspace plot. Go to the left of the blue boundary, to the right of the yellow boundary, above or below the upper and lower boundaries of the white box, and the light is no longer white. This is not a matter of opinion or perception or guess, it is a matter of fact.

i live under "bluish" leds, and have begun to perceive it as "white", the spectrum shows quite well that it is not white at all.

It shows no such thing. Those LEDs may well be bluish, but it is a bluish-white light they are emitting.

In some USES, driving around in the dark on a weaving country road the lack of flood does not help.

This sentence is not coherent.

yet the slight blue filtering was the thing to discuss, when the light pattern was what some people got the biggest change from. so everybody saw different things, same light, different uses and perceptions of the value of it.

Neither is this one.


What you stuff something into, How you use it, and what Your Needs are to "reflect back light" from things and colored things vary, i can see no way to determine for every use or person what they percieve to be usefull.

You seem to have little understanding or knowledge of the science of light. That's fine, nobody requires you to know any specific amount of the science before posting here, but — again — your guesses, opinions, subjective perceptions and assumptions do not substitute for actual facts, knowledge, and science.

only an integrating sphere driving down the road can do that aparentally

Do you even know what an integrating sphere is...? How it works? Why it's used?
 
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no asumptions or guesses, actually put this stuff in cars, motorcycles, scooters, drove them around, different things did different things, some good some bad. have used various dicromic, filtered, hid , higher wattage lamps everything.
been in blinding snow blizzards in whyoming, fog in the bay area, rain in the pacific northwest, piddled with the various lighting from hid to worthless illegal blue bulbs from driving lights of various types, and yeller lights of various types. manually adjusted, changed altered, and tested ONLY for the purpose of achieving what i desired. turned them on and off , IN the actual situations i got in. been there done that, didnt need an integrating sphere, science or math, to see the effects.

even had a RGB fully adjustable flashlight that i walked for hours each night in varying condidtions.

it is my opinion, everything i post is my opinion. :twothumbs
 
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no asumptions or guesses, actually put this stuff in cars, motorcycles, scooters, drove them around, different things did different things, some good some bad. have used various dicromic, filtered, hid , higher wattage lamps everything.

Your statements are assumptions and guesses, because they are based on your subjective impressions, and not on objective reality.

it is my opinion, everything i post is my opinion.

Nothin' wrong with that, but when your opinions cannot be supported by fact, your statements are may be challenged and your information corrected — whether that makes you happy or not.
 
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