Rant : 20 minute max setting runtime.

[the.Mtn.Man]

Henry under drives his lights to increase battery life, LED life, and to ensure the lights never become dangerously hot.

Our advanced technology allows our lights to provide superior light output without overdriving the LED.

We do not overdrive the LED because overdriving an LED produces excessive heat, reduces the efficiency of the LED, reduces runtimes, reduces the reliability of the LED and rapidly ages the LED - which permanently reduces light output.

For maximum reliability and safety, we monitor and regulate the temperature of the LED. Heat is the primary enemy of your LED and so regulating the LED temperature prevents premature aging, increases reliability and increases efficiency. In addition, regulating the LED's temperature prevents the flashlight from becoming dangerously hot and injuring someone who touches it.

http://hdssystems.com/?id=LightFaq#Overdrive

 

[iocheretyanny]

Henry under drives his lights to increase battery life, LED life, and to ensure the lights never become dangerously hot.

First I apologize to Henry as I did not mean this thread to be about his lights at first (just used as example), but now it is.

Having said that - I do wish his current philosophy was different.

1) I do not agree with 'increased battery life' statement, as one still has the option to use 200 lumens as the max and keep the battery life as long.

2) same goes for 'LED life'. And I am not saying that there should be dangerous overdriving, just dont under drive. Program the max lower if you wish. Latest LEDs rated much higher lumens with no overdrive needed.

3) lights do not 'become dangerously hot' quote also does not make sense to me when referring to HDS lights - that is why they have thermal management, and will reduce output as needed. HDS lights are build like a tank, and have good amount of aluminum for cooling, and will not become too hot immediately.

And that is my rant.
For lights that have many levels and especially ones that are programmable, I do not see good reason to under drive, give people the flexibility to make their own decisions.

Having said that, I am surprised that no one seems to agree with me, most folks in this thread seem to be trying to prove me wrong, and disagree.

 

[AnAppleSnail]

3) lights do not 'become dangerously hot' - that is why they have thermal management, and will reduce output once needed. HDS lights are build like a tank, and have good amount of aluminum for cooling, and will not become too hot immediately.

And that is my rant.
For lights that have many levels and especially ones that are programmable, I do not see good reason to under drive, give people the flexibility to make their own decisions.

Having said that, I am surprised that no one seems to agree with me, most folks in this thread seem to be trying to prove me wrong, and disagree.

This is a good point (#3) especially. Try the Lux-RC line of lights - they seem to be no-holds-barred 3A pocket rockets designed to only step down as requested by the user or required by temperature.

 

[HighlanderNorth]

Back in the day before Henry went with the ridiculous(my opinion) 1 hour runtime on max setting - it used to be max brigntess for only 20 minutes. That was ok because HDS had 20 levels and one would usually use the lower setting, but the ability to have the absolute brightest level for the time was there if the need arose.

Why can't any manufacturers do the same?

Maybe I am part of the bygone era, but I keep waiting, especially in AA nimh factor. Would it not be cool to have 300+ lumens if needed from a cheap and safe single nimh, or having a 450+ lumes HDS level handy. To me having ability to run at max brightness with a shorter runtime like 20 minutes seems like a great compromise.

You need a Jetbeam PA-10.

 

[eala]

I think a Mac's Custom EDC will meet your needs. Driven at 2.8Amp, they are very bright. Only three levels, however. The trade off is that you need an IMR cell to deal with the current draw. The runtime is short too.

eala

 

[iocheretyanny]

You need a Jetbeam PA-10.

Yea looks to be a nice light - I just wish it was brighter on a primary.

 

[Brasso]

Max brightness is a lose - lose situation. Rarely is the light going to be able to get brigh enough (above what its highest setting already is )that it really makes any practical difference. The trade-off is drastically reduced run time. Reduced circuitry life. Reduced led life. Possible battery failure. Even the popular lights out now, such as the Jetbeam rrt-0 and vr11, warn you not to run them in high for more than 5 minutes. What they are saying essentially, is "We have designed this light to be brighter than is safe". The led's, drivers, and batteries of today have effectively out run the ability to physically cool them in a pocket sized light.

It was only about 7 years ago that we thought, "If only a AA light could produce 100 lumens" the need for anything else would be over forever. LOL

Lights are getting brighter and brighter. However, I personally question the need for even what we have now in a 500 lumen pocket light. Do you really need that much light in your pocket? Not me. I'm perfectly happy with 200-300 lumens. I'm pefectly happy with my 80 lumen max E1L. I guess I prize run time over output.

 

[Tiresius]

I wonder, if you got a properly heat-managed body to maintain the heat for over 20min, can you still run the light for long on an 18650 cell? I am nervous about damages to the cell as they have some rare occurrences of fire and/or explosion that caused major damages.

 

[iocheretyanny]

I guess I prize run time over output.

I also prize runtime over brightness 95% of time. But I see no reason to limit brightness when a light has many levels or is programmable. Why not let the customer set and use as they need. There are occasional situations where one wishes they had a brighter level at hand.

 

[Norm]

I also prize runtime over brightness 95% of time. But I see no reason to limit brightness when a light has many levels or is programmable. Why not let the customer set and use as they need. There are occasional situations where one wishes they had a brighter level at hand.

Because it's the manufacturer that has to warranty the light, they try to build a reliable product, how many race cars do you see coming out of car factories?

Norm

 

[Tiresius]

Because it's the manufacturer that has to warranty the light, they try to build a reliable product, how many race cars do you see coming out of car factories?

Norm

One car, Toyota LFA :nana:

 

[Norm]

One car, Toyota LFA :nana:

The US$465,000 Lexus LFA Nurburgring – the most expensive Japanese car ever.

Base model Corolla $16,230, Lexus LFA $465,000 = approximately 28 and a half times the cost.

Are you prepared to pay a comparable price for you flashlight? your new EDC = approximately $120 * 28.5 = $3,420

I hope you have deep pockets to by your ideal EDC :devil:

Norm

 

[morelightnow]

You can't get full power from the newest led's in that form factor. There is just too much heat buildup, and the output will never be maximum; may even drop over time. I have a linger special with two led's in P60 format that I think runs too hot on maximum, and it's a much bigger flashlight than AA.

It would be cool yes, just not possible.

 

[iocheretyanny]

You can't get full power from the newest led's in that form factor. There is just too much heat buildup, and the output will never be maximum; may even drop over time. I have a linger special with two led's in P60 format that I think runs too hot on maximum, and it's a much bigger flashlight than AA.

It would be cool yes, just not possible.

I would think programming can take care of the heat issue. Since most lights have sensors for that - step down a level once heat gets past threshold.

I do not think a light needs to be designed to run on max for too long. Most of time couple even a few minutes is fine.

If a lights is only 1,2 or maybe even 3 levels, it should handle max level indefinitely, but a light with 10 levels or even more, there is no need to limit artificially low, except for durability as has been mentioned. But if light keeps stepping down as heat heats to dangerous levels, I do not see durability as much of issue.

 

[adnj]

This thread goes on and on...

Sounds like time to build (or have built) a pocket rocket of your own specification. Plenty of mods on the forum with custom drivers installed. I am just waiting for the next iteration of the HDS with some new emitter or feature.

 

[Joe Talmadge]

Why can't any manufacturers do the same?

Somehow this ended up substantially about HDS, but if you include "any manufacturers", it's clear that there are some great options. There are, for example, single 123A lights whose max wll be in the 400-500 lumens for an XM-L (e.g., v11r, rrt-01) or 250-300ish for an xp-g (e.g., xt1c) if you run those lights on a 16340. HDS is a great choice but not the only game in town, and you definitely can get great lights with very high short-lived runtime