"Real World" Haiku XP-G Light Output comparisons

run4jc

Flashlight Enthusiast
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UPDATED - added Haiku XR-E - thanks Greg!

I'll say at the outset that this post might should be in General or Reviews, but considering the 'test' has mostly McGizmo lights, the thought was that it would be the most useful in this area.

I have a life - really - :eek: - but my fascination with these lights borders on obsession. Early in the stages of the addiction, the 'substance' of choice was, of course, the lumen rating. But, as time passed and I learned from so many of the experienced CPF sisters and brothers in this forum it quickly became obvious to me that 'lumens' rating was only a small part of the story. I mean, what good is a 600 lumen monster if it is too big to carry? Granted, they all have a place - and yes, I'd love to have a monster HID for the shock and awe value of it, but like most, the lights I buy are intended to be used as every day carry tools to help my 52 year old eyes 'see better.'

Thus the nature of this post. Curiosity got the better of me and an investment in an Extech EA1 Light meter was made...:eek:...and in usual fashion, Amazon had it to me quickly. What to do with this new toy? No integrating sphere anywhere within this house...

Still, think about real world use - at home or anywhere. Power failure - all is dark - take out the EDC, click it on and tail stand it...or just hold it. How well does it light up the room?

So the basis for this 'test'...far from scientific, but hopefully useful to my friends on the forum, and it proves even further how amazing and how much utility this little jewel from Hawaii really has.

Not totally realistic, but close - this was done in a 6 x 8 foot room, off white walls, low (8 foot) ceiling (in my basement.) It's the only room in the house (other than the dark dungeon of a utility room) with no windows, thus with doors closed, total darkness.

The meter was set up on a tripod approximately 5 feet from the floor. Each light was placed in a mic holder (really should be called a 'Gizmo holder ;)) at a distance, from the bezel of the light, of 32 inches from the ceiling. The 'ambient' light in the room with the 2 40 watt fluorescent bulbs showed 292 lux.

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Here's a few of the lights and their readings - a full score by light is at the end of the post.

Surefire LX2 on high...
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Check out this little guy...
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Now you may know that the Haiku XP-G is my absolute favorite light. If you don't, there's a review over here that shows how I feel...but seeing this light's result compared to lights that are twice as large or 5 times as large was amazing.

Interestingly, the Jetbeam M1X was far and away the brightest, but the lux meter literally dropped like a rock after I turned the light on (2 freshly charged 18650s) - on at 240 lux but quickly dropped off and after less than a minute had fallen to 214 and was still dropping. In contrast, the Haiku came on at 109, dropped to 108 then locked in at that level. I waited a minute - granted, a longer wait and it may have started to drop, but the regulation seems to be amazing. It was running on a NOT freshly charged AW RCR.

The chart below is a simple Excel chart showing the ratings plus comparisons relative to ambient light, then all the other lights compared to the Haiku on 'High.' Since I've added the Haiku XR-E in a different session I question its results. I tried my best to duplicate the circumstances, but who knows?
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I won't offer any commentary on this - it should speak for itself.

Now, some readers of this post may be unwilling or unable to pay a premium for such a light - everyone understands this - especially if you base your position strictly on 'lumens' and cost. However - if you search and search for that "holy grail" of lights (as I did) and keep trying new ones, you'll probably end up here eventually anyway and realize that the price is reasonable, especially considering that you can get most or all (or sometimes more) of your money out of a Gizmo should the need to sell it arise.

And while you own it, you'll experience a level of craftsmanship and quality that is, unfortunately, rare in these days of mass production and extreme price competitiveness. My profession is marketing and sales, and I understand these pressures.

But, as I've said over and over,

"I have still discovered a remarkable pleasure and satisfaction in the 'KISS' philosophy of flashaholism. All the concerns about lumens, blah blah, pale in comparison to the satisfaction of owning a simple, durable tool that just plain works - every time you need it.

Don's lights do that better - at least for me - than any of the others I've tried or use."

And hopefully this test shows that the lights also provide real world, useful levels of lighting.

And that's all I have to say about that....

:D lovecpf
 
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Nice job!

With only your eyes as a judge, what would be the smallest difference you would be able to notice?

Just for kicks, you may want to try and angle the meter away from the ceiling, or prop up a diffuser of some sort (handkerchief or something) over sensor to minimize the effect of the lights with tighter hotspots. I noticed that when doing ceiling bounce tests, lights with tighter, longer throwing spots will almost always seem brighter in the immediate area, but the corners of the room are affected less.
 
If you want the post in reviews I can move it there. Just gimme a call (PM) :D
Nice post btw :thumbsup:
bernie
 
Very good information and once again your detailed contributions to the CPF community are first rate.

I know that you recently parted with your XR-E Haiku but it would have been interesting to pair up the two in this experiment "in a shootout" so to speak.

Thank you and boy is that XR-U a zinger ;).
 
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Very good information and once again your detailed contributions to the CPF community are first rate.

I know that you recently parted with your XR-E Haiku but it would have been interesting to pair up the two in this experiment "in a shootout" so to speak.

Thank you and boy is that XR-U a zinger ;).



I second that and another great post Dan! :thumbsup:
 
Thanks for sharing. Your measurements of the 3S driver levels are very consistent with mine.

The "integrating ceiling" method for comparing relative lumens levels of multiple lights or levels is actually amazingly accurate.

Any idea how the XR-E original Haiku levels fall compared to the XP-G?
 
Thanks for sharing. Your measurements of the 3S driver levels are very consistent with mine.

The "integrating ceiling" method for comparing relative lumens levels of multiple lights or levels is actually amazingly accurate.

Any idea how the XR-E original Haiku levels fall compared to the XP-G?

That's great - thank you - I had not seen your post and how perfect that the percentage figures low/medium/high are almost a match.

As for the XR-E - ARRGGHH! :banghead:

I actually sold it to a CPF brother member last week. Wish I had done this test beforehand...of course, if any CONUS member wants to ship theirs to me, I'll be only too happy to do the comparison...:naughty:

Thanks for sharing your results! Very interesting.

Dan
 
Nice job!

With only your eyes as a judge, what would be the smallest difference you would be able to notice?
Tough question to answer, but as far as 'lighting the room' all the lights did a pretty good job, at least the ones that were within a similar range.

Just for kicks, you may want to try and angle the meter away from the ceiling, or prop up a diffuser of some sort (handkerchief or something) over sensor to minimize the effect of the lights with tighter hotspots. I noticed that when doing ceiling bounce tests, lights with tighter, longer throwing spots will almost always seem brighter in the immediate area, but the corners of the room are affected less.
Great idea. My intent was that the meter not be pointed directly at the harsh spot on the ceiling, so hopefully the hotspots were minimized somewhat, but I like your idea. Next time I'll try that! What the next experiments will be are hopefully the same routine in a much larger room - and - I'd like to build an integrating sphere (of sorts.) Even had a wild idea of using a cheap Styrofoam cooler with strategically placed foam...

Oy...what is it about this hobby! :D
 
Run4jc-
In the interest of science, or at least lumens, I'll send my Haiku XR-E to you for a few days. Shoot me a PM with your mailing address, and I'll get it off. Thanks for all the time and effort!
 
run4jc,

Thanks, I was just wondering because I'm trying to figure out generally what the smallest percentage gain in lumens most people can detect. I'm thinking in back to back testing where the time between the lights is small, 25-30% seems to be about right.

In the case of your testing, I'm thinking that there is a difference between the Haiku and the LX2 on high, but barely noticeable. The low on the Lunasol27 and the low on the Haiku however would be easier to tell apart.

Of course I could be WAY off, and just spouting nonsense that bucks known, scientifically verified, human response. :D
 
Dan- PM received, but i still need your address!;) Take all the time you need, the resulting info is well worth putting a few travel miles on the Haiku. I'm sure it won't mind, having come to the east coast from Hawaii! This will just be a day trip to hang with some friends... :p
 
Follow up - "Real World" Haiku XP-G Light Output comparisons

UPDATED - added the Haiku XR-E - thanks, Greg!

Couldn't help myself - ordered a 16 inch smooth foam sphere and plan to build something at least resembling an integrating sphere. Inspired by this post. It's just fun - and very interesting.

Meanwhile, I wracked my feeble brain trying to come up with something that might function in such a manner as to diffuse the light and give an evenly lit area that my meter could read.

What you see below is as close as I could come - at least until the sphere is built. It is a canvas 'tent' - roughly 3 feet long, 2 feet wide and 2 feet high. It has an opening in the back and flaps in the front. Placed the sensor for the meter inside and put a white card in front of it so that it could not read the hot spot shining on the back wall of the tent. Now, granted, this is not scientific nor anything approaching an integrating sphere, but with each light aimed at the same spot, it gives good RELATIVE readings. Slightly different group of lights than before - sold my LX2 and didn't include the E2DL - but hope to do a full round up of all the lights I currently own, plus a kind CPF member is shipping his Haiku (XR-E) to me for testing, too.

Here's the set up:
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And here are the resulting readings. By now you know that my favorite is the Haiku XP-G....so much so that I now own both a standard and a bead blasted version. The chart below shows the ratings relative to the mean of all the ratings, as well as relative to the Haiku.

It is worth noting - the Jetbeam M1X and the Surefire 6P hosting an SST-50 drop in, both on freshly charged AW cells, just drop like rocks right after turn on. My meter is reading lux, and the drop is around 1 per second. Amazing - and the drop was continuous from turn on until I turned them off. NONE of the other lights did that - and the McGizmos locked in on their readings and never budged.

Leads me to comment that there's more to consider (always) than just the lumens readings....flashaholics know this better than I - but the REGULATION of these lights is what amazes me. Surefire does a good job with it - the little Nitecore does a good job - and Don does an outstanding job. FWIW.

As always, hope this is helpful to someone! I sure enjoy doing it...
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lovecpf ;)
 
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Thank you, "kind CPF Member!!" It'll be handled with care and tested thoroughly and shipped back with DC and insurance.

As mentioned in my last post, I ordered a 16" foam sphere and plan to build a testing sphere...hopefully it'll come quickly. Either way, I'll send your light back asap -

Thanks again!

Dan
 
Thanks for the update :twothumbs

Looks like the Haiku XP-G has is quite precisely 50% more output compared to the original XR-E.

I have the original Haiku and I'm going to stick with it. Considering how log-based our vision is, anything less than double the output is not worth considering an upgrade. Definetely worth it for someone buying his first Haiku though.
 
I agree with you....in fact, I had a difficult time believing what the meter was telling me. Considering the type of test - first an "integrated ceiling" test then my make-shift light diffuser, I'm thinking that perhaps the difference in such a smaller environment shows up more than any difference in real world use. Basically to me, day in day out, the XP-G 'looks' the same as it relates to throw distance - it just lights a much larger area.

This post confirms that.

Make no mistake - I love the XR-E version - I've regretted selling mine and should a deal pop up on B/S/T I may have to pick up another one. It's still my second favorite light....with the XP-G holding the #1 position.

Thanks for the comments! Very thoughtful..:thumbsup:
 
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