Surefire 6p Rechargeable Option???

[stuartgmilton]

Hey guys,

This seems way expensive to me!!

http://www.opticsplanet.net/surefire-rechargeable-kits-batteries-chargers-kr2-bk.html

How would you guys convert the 6p to rechargeable.

At the moment I have the original bulb, and am pleased with the output. SO I plan on sticking an LED in and then using rechargeables to extend the burn time but hopefully keep the output similar or better. But definately I want rechargeable.

Stu??

 

[CM]

I'd get a 3.7V D26 lamp assembly and a 17670 Li-Ion cell to drive it with. It's the easiest solution and is more "modern" than using Ni-Cads.

 

[RobertM]

I'd get a 3.7V D26 lamp assembly and a 17670 Li-Ion cell to drive it with. It's the easiest solution and is more "modern" than using Ni-Cads.

x2

You should really give this post a read too, you'll learn a whole lot about proper rechargeable setups:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=161536

Robert

PS- :welcome:

 

[zx7dave]

+1 for what CM said...www.lighthound.com has all your needs covered...

 

[mdocod]

Read that link, and treat your 6P as a 1x17670 or 2xRCR123 host.

Almost everything in that link will be relevant, except where you pick out an LED module.

As for which LED module you want to use... You have a lot of options and different options will give you different results with different battery configurations.

1. You can pick a 3.7V (often listed as ~2.8-4.2V modules) specific module, that will ONLY work on a single li-ion cell. This will give you the best performance in your 6P in a rechargeable configuration, but will not be backwards compatible with CR123s as backups. In this case you'll use a PROTECTED 17670.
2. You can pick up a pair of protected 3.7V RCR123s, and use them with a buck regulated module, (usually listed as ~3.7-9V, 3.7-13V, or 3.7-16V etc etc)... This setup will operate fine on either the 2xRCR123 or 2xCR123 cells.
3. You could use the same buck regulated module from Option "2" and use a single protected 3.7V 17670 to power it. This will dramatically increase your runtime, at the cost of output. Such a setup will run for 2-4 hours depending on the module, with gradually diminishing output as it runs... Surprisingly, output when doing this is still decent enough, probably still brighter than the P60 it's replacing. Some modules drop further out of regulation than others when doing this. In my experience, I can say that a general rule of thumb for this option is, if you want the most runtime from it, use a 3.7-13V or higher voltage rated module, if you want close to maximum output from this setup, pick something that caps out at 9V for rated input voltage. The ones that cap out around 9V seem to run in regulation right down to ~3.8V, whereas the higher voltage modules drop out of regulation below ~5V.

 

[stuartgmilton]

Cheers guys, Its given me plenty to read through tonight!!

Thanks, Stuart

p.s. Just stuck my 6P on my bicycle helmet and received abuse because I was blinding people this morning.:twothumbs

 

[Justin Case]

I would get a Malkoff M30, rated at 1V-5.5V, driven by a single 17670 Li-ion rechargeable. Can also be driven by one RCR123A, one CR123A, or even two AAs. In the 6P, you'd have to use a spacer to use a single RCR123A or CR123A, or a different body to accommodate two AAs. You could also get an 18650-sized Leef body if you want more runtime vs using a 17670.

 

[stuartgmilton]

Hey thanks guys,

Thats a stunning thread on rechargeable cells.

In the compatability area, I don't find anyone using rechargeables with the standard bulb. Although I plan on upgrading, what would the burn time/output be like using a 17670? with the standard incan?

Cheers,

Stuart

 

[Helmut.G]

It's not possible to run the standard buld on rechargeables.

 

[Justin Case]

Driving a SureFire P60 with a single 3.7V 17670 Li-ion cell gives light output somewhat lower vs. if you used two primary 123A cells. Light output isn't bad, but it is clearly less. Same result with a P61 lamp assembly.

I don't have any data on output vs runtime when using one 17670, though.

You could get a Lumens Factory EO-4 3.7V, 190 lumen lamp and drive that with a single 17670.

 

[Justin Case]

It's not possible to run the standard buld on rechargeables.

Yes it is possible. I have done it using one 17670 cell. I haven't tested it for a long time, nor tried long, continuous runs (just 1-2 sec bursts). But it does work, though at somewhat reduced light output vs using two 123A primary cells.

 

[Helmut.G]

Yes it is possible. I have done it using one 17670 cell. I haven't tested it for a long time, nor tried long, continuous runs (just 1-2 sec bursts). But it does work, though at somewhat reduced light output vs using two 123A primary cells.

I should have said "It's not possible with the normal output". Running the bulbs with one Li-Ion will work, but with reduced output as you said and with a lower color temperature. Also it might be bad for halogen bulbs that require a certain temperature for their chemical process, but I don't have any real knowledge about that, I guess the bulb will last longer being underdriven even without the halogen stuff working.

 

[mdocod]

Incans are already inefficient, under-driving them makes matters even worse.

P60 normally runs at about 5.8W, power consumption on a 17670 would drop to about 3.9W, but with less than half the output. Instead of the stock 65 lumen rating, It would run more like 30 lumens. That's about a 40% loss of efficiency.

The reason you don't see any configurations listed for the P60 on rechargeable cells, is that there is no combination of lithium rechargeable cells that will properly drive a P60.

The P60 or P61 can be driven fairly well on 4 NiMH or NiCD cells The KR2 conversion kit is just a NiCD stick of cells. Dollar for dollar and size for size, more runtime and performance can be achieved through li-ion conversions.

Eric

 

[stuartgmilton]

Cheers guys,

Again, most helpful!

 

[dudemar]

While the KR2-BK from Surefire gives great light, it makes the 6P MUCH too long and heavy for a light of its caliber.

 

[Justin Case]

Incans are already inefficient, under-driving them makes matters even worse.

P60 normally runs at about 5.8W, power consumption on a 17670 would drop to about 3.9W, but with less than half the output. Instead of the stock 65 lumen rating, It would run more like 30 lumens. That's about a 40% loss of efficiency.

In my limited observations, the output was noticeably greater than that for a 3P, which is 30 lumens, but somewhat less than the output from a 6P driven by two 123A primaries. The 17670-driven P60 certainly was not excessively dim. I was surprised, but that's the reality.

However, as I caveated before, this was a very brief test, just to see what would happen. Thus, I have no data on output vs run time. As the 17670 discharges, its voltage will continue to drop. At what point the P60 output does become R30-like or dimmer is the question. Nor do I have any data on how the output holds up under continuous discharge. But for my single data point, light output was acceptable for at least ten 2 sec bursts.

 

[kramer5150]

Hey guys,

This seems way expensive to me!!

http://www.opticsplanet.net/surefire-rechargeable-kits-batteries-chargers-kr2-bk.html

How would you guys convert the 6p to rechargeable.

At the moment I have the original bulb, and am pleased with the output. SO I plan on sticking an LED in and then using rechargeables to extend the burn time but hopefully keep the output similar or better. But definately I want rechargeable.

Stu??

So your goals are longer run times than the Stock P60, and equal or greater Lumen output.

Shouldn't be too hard to top that.

I would go the 17670 route. Protected AW 17670 cells and a WF-139 should get you started. Its just easier not having to worry about the added complications of a 2x16340 setup. Especially now that the M30 and other quality 3.6V modules are so readily obtainable. The drawback to that is that many will be more than double the Lumen output of the P60... so it might be too much light for you, if you find ~60 Lumens perfect. AFAIK Gene does not make an M30L version, although if you call him he might be willing to do a custom job for you (he's been known to do such things for CPF members). Just let him know you only want ~60-80 Lumens, and you're not looking for a retina burning setup.

If you are on a tighter budget there are other 3.6 Volt modules available, surf the P60 drop in sticky above for more ideas.

Personally I am very happy with my 2x16340 setups. I like how I can top off a pair of cells in ~5-15 minutes in the morning before work. I can do a full charge in about 1:15 (from completely dead to fully topped). For me, the shorter 16340 run times don't matter because I just reload cells on the job, and I always carry backup cells in my belt pack. FWIW, I get about 45 minutes on a pair of 16340 cells with my various DX modules at their highest settings.

So... you should be aware that a 17670 cell needs a good 3.5-4 hours to top off from a full discharge, using a 450 mah charge rate (WF-139 for example).

Its a nice problem to have... so many choices.

 

[metlarules]

I would get a Malkoff M30, rated at 1V-5.5V, driven by a single 17670 Li-ion rechargeable. Can also be driven by one RCR123A, one CR123A, or even two AAs. In the 6P, you'd have to use a spacer to use a single RCR123A or CR123A, or a different body to accommodate two AAs. You could also get an 18650-sized Leef body if you want more runtime vs using a 17670.

If you already have a 6p you wouldn't need a different body to use 2aa.
You would need a 1-cell extender. I think Surefire calls it an a-22. Lighthound also sell a 1-cell extender under the Solarforce brand that is 7 bucks. Then get yourself a sleeve for the battery tube(PVC?)that has an internal diameter that will fit aa batteries and your good to go.

 

[Bullzeyebill]

If you already have a 6p you wouldn't need a different body to use 2aa.
You would need a 1-cell extender. I think Surefire calls it an a-22. Lighthound also sell a 1-cell extender under the Solarforce brand that is 7 bucks. Then get yourself a sleeve for the battery tube(PVC?)that has an internal diameter that will fit aa batteries and your good to go.

Surefire A19, and if you want a 17500 size extender use the Surefire A14.

Bill