What's wrong with this HID bulb?

[KevinL]

The saga continues..... I managed to remove the bulb and ballast thanks to the very detailed instructions here: http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=217959

Thanks CPF, at least you guys came thru for me in that aspect.. lovecpf

I'll get straight to the point: What's wrong with this HID bulb?

The vendor is offering me a replacement bulb, or a refund. Should I take my chances with the replacement now that I'm able to disassemble the light? What concerns me is that I could be out shipping two ways (inbound and back to them) on a refund.



The ballast ain't too pretty too - lots of paw prints and definitely not mine. Bulb is glued to the ballast.

Do excuse the craptacular photography, I'm stressed out, short on time and blasting away with a popup flash instead of breaking out my nice off-camera lighting kit (that's how I do the CPFMP sales pics )

 

[mvyrmnd]

It looks like the return wire is not only missing its ceramic shield (and bent), it's discoloured from overheating....

I take it it's no longer working?

 

[KevinL]

It looks like the return wire is not only missing its ceramic shield (and bent), it's discoloured from overheating....

I take it it's no longer working?

I think the return wire is meant to be that way to reduce beam artifacts. The manufacturers of this light take it off or never put one in the first place.

You're right, it isn't working. What happens when I try to strike an arc is that it lights up briefly and then goes out.

HID dangerously overdriven? Wouldn't surprise me if these guys were using a cheaper bulb and overdriving it.

 

[mvyrmnd]

You're right, it isn't working. What happens when I try to strike an arc is that it lights up briefly and then goes out.

That sounds more like a ballast/power supply issue...

This is what happens to HID bulbs when driven too hard

 

[KevinL]

That sounds more like a ballast/power supply issue...

This is what happens to HID bulbs when driven too hard

Thanks. Looks like my HID is still well, mostly intact.

I've managed to disassemble the whole light and I've figured out that the construction is reasonably resilient. Basically the alu shell only exists to hold the whole assembly together, it is not an electrical path. The ballast and the bulb mate together directly.

I've requested a replacement bulb/ballast assembly from the vendor since it's glued together, so I figure this should work.

The pack looks intact to me, charges up ok and the voltage is correct.

 

[Oztorchfreak]

That sounds more like a ballast/power supply issue...

This is what happens to HID bulbs when driven too hard

I have just put a thread up at CPF.


http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=296470


It regards getting the head off my cheapo HID torch.

I can't get the head off by unscrewing the head out all of the way.

It comes to an abrupt stop at the end of its travel.

Any ideas on removing it to get to the bulb to centre it properly as it has a horrible beam.

 

[KevinL]

I have just put a thread up at CPF.


http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=296470


It regards getting the head off my cheapo HID torch.

I can't get the head off by unscrewing the head out all of the way.

It comes to an abrupt stop at the end of its travel.

Any ideas on removing it to get to the bulb to centre it properly as it has a horrible beam.

Dude, chill

I feel like s$#t too, but life goes on. I'm making the most out of a bad apple too. The dealer's already agreed to exchange my bad ballast once I mail it back to them - and fortunately mailing JUST a ballast is much cheaper than the whole light.

I reiterate this thread for disassembly pics.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=217959

Don't attempt to unscrew the WHOLE head (which I tried too). Get a cloth and grip the part with fins in your left hand, hold it steady and don't let it turn. Then grip the part ABOVE the sign "Not for diving" on your light (mine doesn't have it.. thankfully!). Unscrew the top part.

It is a bit like the Maglite where the bezel unscrews, and then the lens and reflector will come out. You will be able to reach the bulb.

Exercise caution! HIDs are high voltage devices and I wouldn't want to see anybody else getting shocked.

I agree with you the beam is ugly. What am I doing about it....naah, it's beyond hope!

Seriously though, it is prettiest in ceiling bounce mode. Makes a great room light. If you are able to find a high-temperature Pyrex GLASS diffuser you might be able to turn it into a great flood. Make sure it can withstand operating temperatures!

I'll have my revenge on this HID though.... my Flamethrower Project will kick its butt and solve both beam and batteries (nine XP-Gs and a LiFePO4 powertrain based on REAL A123Systems cells).

 

[Oztorchfreak]

Dude, chill

I feel like s$#t too, but life goes on. I'm making the most out of a bad apple too. The dealer's already agreed to exchange my bad ballast once I mail it back to them - and fortunately mailing JUST a ballast is much cheaper than the whole light.

I reiterate this thread for disassembly pics.
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=217959

Don't attempt to unscrew the WHOLE head (which I tried too). Get a cloth and grip the part with fins in your left hand, hold it steady and don't let it turn. Then grip the part ABOVE the sign "Not for diving" on your light (mine doesn't have it.. thankfully!). Unscrew the top part.

It is a bit like the Maglite where the bezel unscrews, and then the lens and reflector will come out. You will be able to reach the bulb.

Exercise caution! HIDs are high voltage devices and I wouldn't want to see anybody else getting shocked.

I agree with you the beam is ugly. What am I doing about it....naah, it's beyond hope!

Seriously though, it is prettiest in ceiling bounce mode. Makes a great room light. If you are able to find a high-temperature Pyrex GLASS diffuser you might be able to turn it into a great flood. Make sure it can withstand operating temperatures!

I'll have my revenge on this HID though.... my Flamethrower Project will kick its butt and solve both beam and batteries (nine XP-Gs and a LiFePO4 powertrain based on REAL A123Systems cells).

Thanks for the help.

I just tried holding the finned area and twisting the top ringed area only.

Man that thing is tight.

I can't budge it.

I think I will have to use the vice with cloths and an oil filter removal type wrench to get this sucker moving.

In the photos posted by IMSabbel I can't see the bottom heavy finned area anywhere after disassembly.

I can see the smaller ringed area that holds the front glass on removed.

I should hold the cog-like fins behind the smoother area.

Then I should try to turn the very front ringed area.

Have I got it?

The torch pictures by ImSabbel show he has an Orange Peel reflector, mine is a smooth reflector.

What type is your reflector?

 

[KevinL]

I think he got to yet another stage of disassembly.

You're right, you should hold the fins below "do not dive", because those fins and the 'do not dive' round part are the same piece of metal. The metal piece with the three rings around the top is where it comes apart.

Mine's a smooth reflector. If all else fails to resolve your beam quality, you can remove the reflector (it will fall out just like a Mag reflector) when you open the bezel. Then you can mod the reflector with whatever means deemed appropriate. Normally for LED mods they say spray it with Krylon, but I don't know how well it will hold up under heat and temperature.

 

[Oztorchfreak]

I think he got to yet another stage of disassembly.

You're right, you should hold the fins below "do not dive", because those fins and the 'do not dive' round part are the same piece of metal. The metal piece with the three rings around the top is where it comes apart.

Mine's a smooth reflector. If all else fails to resolve your beam quality, you can remove the reflector (it will fall out just like a Mag reflector) when you open the bezel. Then you can mod the reflector with whatever means deemed appropriate. Normally for LED mods they say spray it with Krylon, but I don't know how well it will hold up under heat and temperature.

So the split will happen between the top of the warning circle above the "not for diving" area and the front three rings area at the front.

I will wait until morning to get into the garage to hold the finned area in a padded bench vice and then try and turn the front three ringed area.

Thanks for the advice.

I nearly bought the Tacticalhids version of this torch.

Do they spend more money on better quality components?

I wonder if their batteries have the same self-discharging problems as mine did eventually?

I had the battery problem right from the start.

The dealer in Melbourne sent me another battery but it had the same short runtime and self-discharging problem.

He no longer stocks this brand of HID.

That says it all about Teking brand HIDs and many other cheapo HIDs out there.

Did you have any battery problems?

I just wonder how widespread these HID quality problems are?

My beam is adjustable, crappy flood to a tighter crappy unfocussed ringy spot!!!

I can see there is an overlap of rings that do not line up in the beam pattern against a wall.

Long live my Stanley 35W HID, at least I can change the SLA battery whenever I need to and not rely on proprietary battery tubes full of unreliable Lion 18650s.

 

[KevinL]

Someone posted a brilliant idea what to do if we are ever fed up to death with the HID.....

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=296482

I love his concept. Here's going to be my design if I ever try it:

Der Wichtel high efficiency buck driver, either two SST-50 (trying not to exceed 5A on the stock battery pack), or four Cree MC-E wired 2S2P to halve the current. MC-E is 2.8A max, I will feed it 2.5A. It should all be good. Individual MC-E should have all 4 dies in parallel.

Get one of the brilliant modders in CPF to cut a plain old copper or alu disk of suitable size, and drill a large hole in the middle for wires. With a lathe, this is not going to be too difficult. I've gotten them to do this before in the past (and it sparked a revolution with all the multi-emitter Mag sinks).

As for the power contacts, salvage them off the ballast and/or design your own. Remove ballast, substitute with hollow plastic pipe to maintain the same height and hold the battery pack in position.

It's good to have a contingency plan so at least this whole mess will not be a writeoff

 

[KevinL]

So the split will happen between the top of the warning circle above the "not for diving" area and the front three rings area at the front.

Yessir, you got it!

If you see IMSabbel's thread you'll notice the part with the 3 rings detaches. I can't hot link his images (it would be rude not to mention the rules), but if you search for the part where he mentions "Also notice the bezel being not that badly manufactured." the picture below that shows what it looks like detached.