When are we going to get a 'new' LED?

[CoolHands]

All the flashlights re pretty similar in performance now - use Cr123's & a Q5? whats the difference between them? Not much :scowl:

Why can't someone make an LED that is very different or make a board that uses far less energy so the LED lasts waaay longer than their competition?

bored :tinfoil:

need some innovation!

 

[LukeA]

Why can't someone make an LED that is very different or make a board that uses far less energy so the LED lasts waaay longer than their competition?

A different LED would require a giant investment and risk by whoever made it.

A board that uses less energy? Do you mean more efficiency, because there's not really very much room for improvement there. Do you mean a board that supplies the LED with less power, but for longer?

 

[dcbeane]

"A different LED would require a giant investment and risk by whoever made it."

CREE is doing this constantly. They are investing mucho $$ into the next LED all the time. As a company they must remain on the bleeding edge of technology or be eaten alive by cheap to manufacture Taiwan etc.

70% brighter greens : (I know still an X-Lamp)
http://www.cree.com/press/press_detail.asp?i=1195568149752


1050 lumens from a cool white single-die!!
http://www.cree.com/press/press_detail.asp?i=1189169857943
This one is a lab event as of now though....and still an X-Lamp but they have more tricks in the hopper ...trust me.:huh:
This LED is aimed at general lighting but perhaps someone will use it for other things as well.

Press Room
Cree Achieves 1,000 Lumens from a Single LED
DURHAM, NC, SEPTEMBER 7, 2007 — Cree, Inc. (Nasdaq: CREE), a leader in LED lighting components, today announced it has demonstrated light output of more than 1,000 lumens – an amount equivalent to the output level of a standard household light bulb – from a single R&D LED. Cree’s achievement demonstrates continued leadership in the development of LEDs that can make traditional light bulbs obsolete.

A single-die LED, driven at four amps, produced 1,050 lumens in cool white and 760 lumens in a warm-white version. Efficacy of the cool-white LED was 72 lumens per watt and 52 lumens per watt from the warm-white device. Both LED versions operated at substantially higher efficacy levels than those of today’s conventional light bulbs. Historically, Cree’s R&D demonstrations generally have been commercialized within 12 to 24 months.

“Cree’s XLamp® LEDs are the best-performing commercially available LEDs, but we won’t be satisfied until light bulbs are obsolete,” comments John Edmond, Cree co-founder and director of advanced optoelectronics. “We’ve worked 20 years to achieve lighting-class LED performance, and we still have plenty of ways to advance the technology further.”

 

[LukeA]

...

I know that manufacturers are always developing new emitters, but they won't take the technology in a completely different direction without a lot of pressure.

 

[this_is_nascar]

All the flashlights re pretty similar in performance now - use Cr123's & a Q5? whats the difference between them? Not much :scowl:

Why can't someone make an LED that is very different or make a board that uses far less energy so the LED lasts waaay longer than their competition?

bored :tinfoil:

need some innovation!

What are you talking about? The latest/greatest technology is being used by those who desire to use it. Your question is similar to someone asking "why doesn't a car maker use something that get 1000k per gallon and uses water as it's energy source? That answer to both questions is, because the technology hasn't advanced to that level yet.

 

[CoolHands]

A board that uses less energy? Do you mean more efficiency, because there's not really very much room for improvement there. Do you mean a board that supplies the LED with less power, but for longer?

yeah - but there must be more efficiency to come? After all, I thought we all believed a couple of years ago that LEDs didn't use hardly any power. That's what we were always told (as members of the public). Now they've got this great performance out of them we realise that actually, they do use quite a bit of power. But, surely they can become more efficient.

Also, what is slightly frustrating is the similarity between different manufacturers with regards to performance.

 

[LukeA]

yeah - but there must be more efficiency to come? After all, I thought we all believed a couple of years ago that LEDs didn't use hardly any power. That's what we were always told (as members of the public). Now they've got this great performance out of them we realise that actually, they do use quite a bit of power. But, surely they can become more efficient.

Also, what is slightly frustrating is the similarity between different manufacturers with regards to performance.

Regulator boards can be as much as 93% efficient. Current LEDs top out at around 40% efficient. There is improvement there.

 

[Bearcat]

Frankly, I'm fed up with overly super bright lights with super short run-times. Give me a reasonable and adequate brightness with a longer run-time.

 

[savumaki]

Nirvana is perpetual motion .

 

[LEDninja]

I bought an elektrolumens Lucidus XR-1 1AA Cree. It is only slightly brighter than my Luxeon L1P but it has 3-1/2 hours runtime.

That is why they make multi-level lights nowadays. Very bright for 1/2 hour or very dim for a day.

 

[Bearcat]

I bought an elektrolumens Lucidus XR-1 1AA Cree. It is only slightly brighter than my Luxeon L1P but it has 3-1/2 hours runtime.

That is why they make multi-level lights nowadays. Very bright for 1/2 hour or very dim for a day.

Right, but the focus today is on how super bright a light is period, not on a reasonable bright light with a long useful run-time light.

 

[Khaytsus]

Frankly, I'm fed up with overly super bright lights with super short run-times. Give me a reasonable and adequate brightness with a longer run-time.

Well that's why there are multi-mode lights... Here's a summary of real world performance from a Fenix P2D on Energizer E2 lithium primaries:

Turbo: 110l for 48m, dropping to about 50l in 7m and nothing in 67m
High: 64l for 160m (2.7h), dropping to nothing in 35m
Med: 32l for 420m (7h), dropping to nothing in 40m
Low: 23l for 1900m (31.7h), dropping to nothing 'soon' after (probably 1-2h really)

I personally use low about 95% of the time, so 32 hours on a $1.62 battery is very reasonable IMO.

 

[Marduke]

yeah - but there must be more efficiency to come? After all, I thought we all believed a couple of years ago that LEDs didn't use hardly any power. That's what we were always told (as members of the public). Now they've got this great performance out of them we realise that actually, they do use quite a bit of power. But, surely they can become more efficient.

Also, what is slightly frustrating is the similarity between different manufacturers with regards to performance.

I really don't understand your point. LED's are head and shoulders more efficient than incans, but we can't get something for nothing, so of course they use power. They make lights that are very bright for a short time, very dim for a very long time, or multimode lights that can do both, and are very efficient at doing it. I mean, take a light like the P3D Q5 and it can blast you with 215 lumens, but can also run at 15 lumens for 55 hours. Pal lights can run for over a year with enough light to navigate in the dark. Show me anything else in those form factors that could do that a couple years ago.

And this keep improving. We are getting the new R-bins, and beyond every couple months now.

 

[Bearcat]

Well that's why there are multi-mode lights... Here's a summary of real world performance from a Fenix P2D on Energizer E2 lithium primaries:

Turbo: 110l for 48m, dropping to about 50l in 7m and nothing in 67m
High: 64l for 160m (2.7h), dropping to nothing in 35m
Med: 32l for 420m (7h), dropping to nothing in 40m
Low: 23l for 1900m (31.7h), dropping to nothing 'soon' after (probably 1-2h really)

I personally use low about 95% of the time, so 32 hours on a $1.62 battery is very reasonable IMO.

Let me clarify, single AAA key-chain lights that are super bright with short run-times on rechargeable batteries.

 

[Marduke]

Let me clarify, single AAA key-chain lights that are super bright with short run-times on rechargeable batteries.

I beg to differ, since lights like the LOD exist. You can get 11 lumens for 8.5 hours, or 75 lumens for 1 hour, your choice.

 

[LEDninja]

coolhands
join date sep 2007
3 months later
bored dec 2007

You should be glad you do not have to wait 20 years for maglight to come out with the magled. And then it turned out to be a luxeon, 1/2 as bright as a Cree XRE P3 bin!!!

We have gone through Cree P3, P4, Q2, Q4 & Q5 bins since last november. It took Nichia over 10 years to go from AS to BS to CS to the just released DS 5mm led. We are living in interesting times.***

Car manufacturers update their models every year.
Computer manufacturers update their models every 6 months.
In the last year some flashlight manufacturers are introducing a new model every 2 months.

C'mon now, how many torches have you worn out in the last 3 months? You don't need a new one until the old one died.

*** May you live in interesting times is an old Chinese curse. It is especially hard on the wallet here on CPF.

 

[Bearcat]

I beg to differ, since lights like the LOD exist. You can get 11 lumens for 8.5 hours, or 75 lumens for 1 hour, your choice.

You are correct, BUT rather than say 75 lumens for 1 hour, how about 50 lumens for 2+ hours? I just think that the brightness is a little out whack with a reasonable run-time.

The LOD Q4 is hard to argue against, but it can be improved.🙂

 

[Marduke]

You are correct, BUT rather than say 75 lumens for 1 hour, how about 50 lumens for 2+ hours? I just think that the brightness is a little out whack with a reasonable run-time.

The LOD Q4 is hard to argue against, but it can be improved.🙂

How about 30 lumens for 3.5 hours?? You won't see much of a different between 30 and 50 anyhow.

And of course lights are being improved, every day. Seems like every couple weeks a brand new light is coming out. Hell, the LOD Q4 was just released, and before too long we'll probably be looking at R2's in a "easter special edition" or something like that.

 

[Lobo]

You are correct, BUT rather than say 75 lumens for 1 hour, how about 50 lumens for 2+ hours? I just think that the brightness is a little out whack with a reasonable run-time.

The LOD Q4 is hard to argue against, but it can be improved.🙂

I really don't get your point here. It's a multilevel, if you want to run it for a long time, use a lower level. If you want bright, you can do that also. It's like having a long running ARC AAA etc, but with the option of REALLY bright. If you want bright for a long time, a single AAA is not the best solution...
Or are you complaining that it doesnt have exactly 50 lumens? :thinking:

Get another light (maybe infinite brightness like LF2, Nitecore, titan etc) that runs at 50 lumens.

 

[WadeF]

You are correct, BUT rather than say 75 lumens for 1 hour, how about 50 lumens for 2+ hours? I just think that the brightness is a little out whack with a reasonable run-time.

The LOD Q4 is hard to argue against, but it can be improved.🙂

Five output modes: 30 Lumens(3.5hrs) -> 11 Lumens(8.5hrs) -> 75 Lumens(1hrs)

Have you looked into the LOD-CE Q4, and other AAA lights, to see what they are capable of? LOD Q4 turns on at 30 Lumens, runs for 3.5hrs. Considering 30 lumens is more than a lot of run of the mill incans are putting out, I would think that's what you'r looking for, enough light to see by, and long run times, from a AAA keychain light.