xre vs xml for throw?

[abinok]

I am using a light with a xre r2 driven at 1A in a 36mm smo reflector. While I have some experience with multi die leds... the p7, I'm wondering if the xml can produce comparable throw with the same.size reflector. I'm looking specifically at the thrunite scorpion v2 with turbohead.

 

[RepProdigious]

I've done an XM-L emitter and driver (shiningbeam) swap on my spear clone and the hot-spot did get bigger. However, because the shear output is quite a bit more my guesstimate is that intensity in the hotspot is still the same. I'd have to say that in a reflector as deep as in the spear results are good as long as you need/like a big hotspot and can live with very reduced runtimes.

 

[jiuong]

If the XML is also driven at 1A then the answer is a definite no. It might be able to have a comparable throw if driven at higher amps.

 

[rickypanecatyl]

I'm sure somebody more qualified will step in here but my understanding is the XP G is ALMOST as good as the XR E and the XM L is ALMOST as good as the XP G IF AND ONLY IF they are all driven to the max. IE An XML can throw almost as far as the XPG in the same size reflector is the XML is driven at 3 amps and the XPG at 1.5 amps and the XRE at 1 amp.

2 problems though - on similar size lights they probably won't drive the XML to the same % of its max as the XRE due to heat reasons and secondly, the XRE will almost undoubtedly appear to throw farther as the less total light wont be as likely to bounce back and wreck your night vision.

 

[abinok]

Makes sense to me. The scorpion v2 starts out @ 3a on high compared to just the one amp on the xre. As the saying goes, quantity has a quality of its own.

 

[tre]

No, a maximally driven XML will never throw as far as a maximally driven XRE in the same reflector. The XRE has a much higher surface brightness (lumens per square meter of emitter) which means the XRE beam is more intense. That higher intensity = greater throw. The only way for the XML to throw farther is to put it in a larger reflector or over drive it to raise the surface brightness.

 

[Napalm]

As the saying goes, quantity has a quality of its own.

:thumbsup:

You can tune and turbo charge all day long, but when the rubber hits the road, there's nothing like more engine displacement.

Nap.

 

[Napalm]

No, a maximally driven XML will never throw as far as a maximally driven XRE in the same reflector.

We all know what happens when you replace an XRE with an XML in a 1xAA EDC light.

But we ain't seen the other side of the story.

Did anyone yet replace the XML in a Fenix TK-41 with an XRE? How did that go?

Nap.

 

[tre]

We all know what happens when you replace an XRE with an XML in a 1xAA EDC light.

But we ain't seen the other side of the story.

Did anyone yet replace the XML in a Fenix TK-41 with an XRE? How did that go?

Nap.

:lolsign: I would love for somebody to try this and see the real world results.

 

[jorn]

No reflector can send out a hotspot that is more intense than the led die actually is. Some pepole find it hard to belive and might say something like: "just make a reflector to focus all those lumens better" or something.. If we made a bigger/better reflector for the xm-l, then the same can be done with the xr-e until we have the "perfect reflector" for both. And the xr-e will still end up throwing further. Since the xr-e has more surface brightness, it will always have the best potential for throw.

The xr-e will throw better but the xm-l will have a bigger hotspot (might be useful), and brighter spill. Imo bright spill is blinding and ruins my ability so see stuff at the far end ot the light's reach. The xm-l will have ~1/3 of the runtime 1 amp vs 3 amp.

 

[abinok]

The light I'm considering replacing has phenomenal throw. It will punch out to 150yds with ease. The sacrifice being that the spill is much harder to use. I have a flip up cover on it with some diffusion film that creates a absolutely smooth wall of light... but its an either/or proposition. I've been as to find plenty of beamshots comparing xpg towers to xml lights, but nothing with the xre. Following the car analogy we can compare sports cars all day long but a good bike will smoke them all...

 

[bigchelis]

Whether its at 1A~2A for the XR-E R2 using the same reflector it will have way more throw then the XM-L.

The XM-L has to be driven at 4A~6A or so, to keep up in throw/Lux to a 2A XR-E in same reflector. I know I tried and tested.

The XM-L is more usefull though and has alot more desirable throw even if its not as much lux. My testing was with Rebel Deep Reflector and Solarforce Masterpiece Reflector on a 2D Mag.

bigC

 

[Napalm]

No reflector can send out a hotspot that is more intense than the led die actually is.

"Intense"? Can you be more specific? which measurement unit are you using to express this?

nap.

 

[jorn]

Lumen pr mm^2 if you want it on a silver spoon. Or call it lux if you want (lumens pr meter^2)
The xr-e is 1x1mm= 1mm^2
The xm-l is 2x2mm= 4mm^2

Does the xm-l put out 4 times more lumens than a xr-e? no? Then the xr-e is more intense.
Just like the sparks from welding is more intense than a match. You can stare at a match, but if you stare at someone welding, ur eyes wil hurt for many days.. That's what i mean with intense.

 

[Napalm]

Lumen pr mm^2 if you want it on a silver spoon. Or call it lux if you want (lumens pr meter^2)
The xr-e is 1x1mm= 1mm^2
The xm-l is 2x2mm= 4mm^2

Does the xm-l put out 4 times more lumens than a xr-e? no? Then the xr-e is more intense.
Just like the sparks from welding is more intense than a match. You can stare at a match, but if you stare at someone welding, ur eyes wil hurt for many days.. That's what i mean with intense.

Your theory is valid for de-domed LEDs with diverging or parallel beam reflectors. Don't forget that you can converge a beam too.

And once you add the micro-lens you're screwing the whole thing pretty much.

Nap.

 

[jorn]

Im not forgetting that.
IF someone was able to make the "perfect throw reflector" for both xr-e and xm-l that coliminated the beams 100%, sending all light staight forwards. (Not that useful in real life, but still it would give the most throw we will EVER be able to get out of those two led's.. )The xr-e would have a 1x1 mm hotspot (with no spill) at all ranges. The xm-l would have a 2x2 mm hotspot at any range.
Since the xr-e has more lumens pr mm^2 It would have more lux (throw).

 

[EnduringEagle]

I know my approach is not very scientific but I just checked some YouTube videos and none of the XML lights throw nearly as well as the XRE or XPG. It seems somewhat night and day.

 

[shane45_1911]

Guys, get a room. :)

We get it, the XR-E will always throw more than the XM-L. You are preaching to the choir here.

 

[EnduringEagle]

Here is an interesting example of XML with much higher lumens being out thrown on the same platform.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JQpTdDAsEkU

 

[tre]

Whether its at 1A~2A for the XR-E R2 using the same reflector it will have way more throw then the XM-L.

The XM-L has to be driven at 4A~6A or so, to keep up in throw/Lux to a 2A XR-E in same reflector. I know I tried and tested.

The XM-L is more usefull though and has alot more desirable throw even if its not as much lux. My testing was with Rebel Deep Reflector and Solarforce Masterpiece Reflector on a 2D Mag.

bigC

We all know what happens when you replace an XRE with an XML in a 1xAA EDC light.

But we ain't seen the other side of the story.

Did anyone yet replace the XML in a Fenix TK-41 with an XRE? How did that go?

Nap.

The Rebel deep reflector is about the same size as the TK41.