Hallelujah! A reasonable religious discussion.
Mind you I'm still wearing a nomex suit as I gingerly creep out from under my rock.
I have to agree with almost everything here. And as long as it stays civil there is no reason it can't be talked about here in the off topic section. One does have the right not to read it which I choose to exercise rather then get all angry about something I know I won't be able to debate civilly because I'm backed into a corner by a zealot.
Whether they are wearing pointy hats or sitting in a pulpit wearing a suit telling me that I'm going to Hell directly contradicts the book that they both claim to be following. You know the old "Judge not lest ye be judged"
I was brought up fundamentalist. My grandfather was a minister (one of the few that concentrated on enriching ones life as opposed to Hell and Damnation). My grandmother on the other hand I could swear was the model for the church lady on Saturday Night Live. Not that she was bad or intentional about it. But she was so judgemental as to be pretty unapproachable by the very people that needed to be reached out to. Also the particular denomination I was in was quite against the RCC and there were many an Easter and Christmas sermon on how wrong it was adopting those pagan holidays as religous holidays. Needless to say that pretty well wipes out most of the rest of Christians too. Which is pretty lame considering that all these disparate groups are reading the same book.
Anyway my experiences and own readings have left me especially wary of organized religions and people that proclaim their beliefs too loudly. I have trouble calling myself a christian anymore because of all this and I prefer spiritual. Whether it is Christ of Buddha or Mohammed or Yahweh that one looks to it seems that every major religion more or less boils down to "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you", the triumph of good vs evil, and living your life to the fullest.
Rothandir, no offense intended, but I find biblical proof to be pretty nebulous. There are just too many things open to interpretation, selective reading, creative paraphrasing, and taken out of context. And just about every priest, minister, false prophet, or con man has done it to prove why you should follow their particular belief. Besides if I remember my lessons correctly the bible does tell you to question and not take mans word for it. Of course that got me into trouble for not just blindly following along. Please don't call me on the particular verse since I don't remember for sure or have a concordance (I think that's what it called) to look to. And I totally agree it's the zealots and extremists of every religion that have really screwed it up for a lot of people.
Wits End, good post. I'll admit your signature raised some red flags with me but that was well reasoned and that was a decision you made for raising your own family. I have to respect that. Even though I do have issues with organized religion I do have my kids in a christian school and I strive to highlight the good things that are there and keep their minds open and questioning, but also to not just blindly follow.
MicroE, just so I don't completely hijack your post I would have to say that Harry Potter is overall a champion for good.
Whew. That was a lot. This thread struck several chords at once and I waxed way philosophical. Hopefully I did not offend anyone.