I've tried to warm up to LED, but I keep returning to Incan....

Tonight, I stopped off at Sears to return my defective 1 watt PR base bulb, and ended up putting that store credit towards a Dorcy K2 Luxeon 2 CR123a light, i'd never used a K2 based light before, and the 120 lumen brightness number (which I'm sure is *wildly* optimistic) looked tempting

So I got the one with the least off-center emitter (really crappy QC there, Dorcy, every one of these lights had an off-center emitter), I figured I could open the head and at the very least re-center the star, maybe eventually use the body of the light as host for an LED swap, maybe to Cree or Seoul.....

I got in the car, opened the packaging (clam-packs are no match for my Spyderco Tasman Salt hawkbill knife, BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!), unscrewed the tail-cap and dropped the batteries in, the flashlight body has nice thick aluminum walls, very solid feeling construction, aside from the off-center emitter (really, Dorcy, what *were* you thinking here....), it feels well built, the belt clip is annoying, and if I keep it, it'll be the first thing I cut off with my Dremel

I hit the switch (damned reverse-clicky, GRRRR, *hate* reverse-clickies), and the light sprung to life, the hotspot, as expected, was a little smeary, but not bad at a distance, and since this light has a smooth reflector, it's clear it was designed for throw

The spot of light was reasonably bright, about as bright as my Lighthound Cree drop-in, but the LH drop-in has a far smoother beam pattern, the Dorcy had a very "Mag-like" hotspot with a smeary hotspot with a small hole in the middle, however it *does* throw nicely

I tried to open the head, but it seems sealed, probably with some red Locktite, not sure if this light is a keeper though, it has decent throw and a decent brightness, but I just can't get past the smeary hotspot and off-center emitter (Bad Dorcy, BAD, no treat for you...), the fact that I can't easily get inside the light to fix it is another point against it, however it should be easy to mod once I get it open (IF I get it open)

Another nail in this light's coffin was when I compared it against my A2 Aviator, I know it's not fair to compare a high-power "120 lumen" smooth reflectored LED light optimized for throw to a "50 lumen" (actually around 75 lumens or so) LOP reflectored light designed for a smooth, balanced hotspot.....

Imagine my amazement when the A2 Aviator performed almost as well in raw lumen output (the Dorcy's hotspot *was* slightly brighter, but more blotchy) as the Dorcy, the biggest difference was that the A2's beam was more *USABLE*, no rings or holes, no blotchy hotspot.....

The Dorcy's beam looked cold and sterile (and quite honestly, a little greenish when compared against the A2's incan) and gave objects a truly eerie "ghostly" appearance, yes it was *illuminating* the subject, but it made the subject look vaguely unreal

The A2's beam was warm and inviting, very natural looking, and I could see a lot more of the area *surrounding* the target, the slightly more floody bias of the A2 was clearly apparent here, the Dorcy threw a "laser-like" beam, illuminating the subject, and subject only, the A2 illuminated the target *and* surroundings

The more I think about it, the more I realize I'm slowly migrating back to incandescent, it's just a more natural, satisfying light, my general EDC is a combo of the A2 and an E1e, when illuminating the dark interior of a Mac Pro case, I now grab the E1e instead of the Fenix L0P-SE or L2T w/ CR123A body, the light isn't as "glary" off the tops of the capacitors and other shiny surfaces on the logic board, when I need to truly "Reach Out and Touch Someone", I reach for either my P61'ed G2, or my MagCharger

I still EDC LED's for their efficiency, long runtime, and durability, but I actually *use* my incans.....

strange that it took that mediocre Dorcy K2 to make me realize I'm more of an Incan guy..... I like both kinds of light, don't get me wrong, LED's *ARE* cool, I'm a techie, and LED's hold an appeal for me for their technical merit, but when I need to get the job done, nothing beats a brightly glowing tungsten wire.....

For most indoor use, I prefer LEDs. The look whiter than my incans, even the mighty A2, the whitest of them. Plus mult-brightness levels!

Outdoors, the comments about ghost lights and eerie are spot on. Things look flat, and browns blur together. That's where incans prove their superiority. When I know I'm going to be doing something outdoors and need a light for anything besides close up, I'll grab an incan. Perhaps I should start EDCing the A2.

BTW, two excellent siglines you have there, MacTech.

Same here. I love the compactness and runtimes of LEDs but I too find myself reaching for the incans.

LEDs usually win the indoor wall hunting contest with its higher color temp "whiteish" beams. The incans on the other hand win the outdoor hunt with their throw and rendition.

EV_007 said:

Same here. I love the compactness and runtimes of LEDs but I too find myself reaching for the incans.

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+1. The incandescents are just more pleasant to use.

I don't know. I tried to use a new G2 the other day and bleh, I just can't stand that yellow-brownish light. I think as long as you get a good tint in a LED, they look better than incans, but thats just my opinion. I hear the A2 is very nice though since its regulated. I've came VERY close to buying one. Just picked up an L6 instead...

i have an old model E1 with a lumens factory 40 bulb thats always in my pocket. i use this light more than any other. my A2 is my real go too light if i am out and about after dark. i do keep a Fenix LOD on my key ring but i favore the incandescent light.

I like both. Depends on the task at hand. I've really appreciate the regulated incan's from both SF and Lighting Pro. There is,for me, something comforting about the old skool illumination, from a quality incandescent, that even the mighty Cree can't compare to. By the way, those Spyderco Salts are one of the best values on the market for a practical working knife. Jmho.Ymmv.

Yep, the Salts are *awesome* knives, and the claim about them being completely rustproof is totally true, i proved it....

i've been performing corrosion tests on Spyderco knives over on the Spyderco forums (i go by MacTech there too)

my last test involved my Salt 1 sitting in hypersaturated salt water in a 2.5 gallon fish tank with glass lid, the salt water was created by dissolving *ROCK SALT* in water until it could no longer dissolve any more, i then used an ultrasonic fogger to create a highly corrosive *SALT FOG*, the Salt withstood *TWO WEEKS* in the fog chamber, not a speck of rust, nothing

by means of comparison, a mundane "stainless steel" Sheffield hawkbill (found at the Home Depot) started showing visible spotting in a *half hour* and actual rust spots in an *hour*, total time to failure was under 1 hour, it's *that* corrosive, and the Salt series just shrugs it off....

back on topic, i'm pretty sure that unless i can get the head of the Dorcy open , it's going back to Sears as a return, very, very unimpressive

KDOG3 said:

...I tried to use a new G2 the other day and bleh, I just can't stand that yellow-brownish light...

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My G2 does not have a yellow-brownish tint.

after a short lived passionless affair with leds i have come back to my first love-incans after a really wild fling with the beautiful regulated A2.who cares about long runtimes and indestructible bulbs-beam quality is all! what i dont understand is why arn`t there loads of regulated incans around?gc.

The E1E I bought is probably going to be LED'd to up it's functionality as an EDC. I'm hoping to get longer run time and multiple brightness levels.

However, the G2 I just got and love is going to stay incan. I have the Lumens Factory HO-9 lamp on the way to replace the stock P60, and am going to use AW's RCR123 cells.

I have ordered a cree drop in module for the G2 simply for comparison. If I like it I will probably buy another G2 to house it.

I also prefer LEDS even though I was bought up using Incands

golden_creature said:

what i dont understand is why arn`t there loads of regulated incans around?gc.

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Cost? Efficiency? Reliability? Bulky? :shrug:
That's why I use Li-ions whenever possible

I also prefer LEDS even though I was bought up using Incands

Mactech, by comparison to your experience:
I have a Nuwai ALX-253L. It's a regulated LuxeonV light that runs on 3xCR123 or 2x17500. I was able to buy a hand picked WWOS star from B/S/T. So I have a 5W light that is one of the better performing LED lights out there period... I'm sure there are Seoul P4 Ubins putting out more light around here, and a few lucky Xbin owners who can still compete with the P4.... but realistically speaking, my Nuwai gives a good feel of what an LED can do, and has what is considered *perfect* tint. The beam pattern is perfect (i've spent a lot of time tweaking to get it there). It doesn't have the infamous LuxV donut, just a nice wide round spot with a nice smooth transition to spill beam.

having said all that, I STILL prefer my incandecent lights in most cases. I keep the LuxV around because it runs for almost 2 hours, so for some situations, it may be the only thing still running.

Another interesting observation I made while in a CAVE a couple days ago... The wide spectrum incan light, has a very powerful calming effect while in those tight spaces. The LED headlamp just made it feel more eerie. I'll bring plenty of incandecent light any time I go caving. Makes the trip enjoyable. rather than spooky.

Greetings!

When I consider this question, it depends on what I'm using the light FOR.
For shop work, walking around the house at night, reading, and use in the car I prefer LED lights.
For camping, hiking, and walking around the neighborhood, I prefer Incandescent.

Best wishes,
Bawko

MacTech said:

opened the packaging (clam-packs are no match for my Spyderco Tasman Salt hawkbill knife, BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!),

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Hell yeah, I love mine too.

I have preferred very warm tinted LEDs ever since I did a little comparison of a bunch of my lights outdorrs in wooded area. I had a wide array of LED tints and my A2 for comparison. The V1 tint light was best (Lucky Q3) followed by an unknown warm tint in my Striker VG. My Luxeon lottery winning Jet-1 is very bright and very white, but made grass, dirt, rocks, and foliage pale, indistinct, and run together.
Incans are still much better in misty weather too. I took my T-bin FireFly camping and compared it to my A2 trying to see the opposite bank of a lake. They seemed about the same lumens and throw in clear weather and short distance, but the LED reflected back ALL the moisture/mist in the air obscuring the distant target, while the A2 reflected far less letting me see what I was pointing at better.
I compared it to my HDS B60 later and had the same result. The Striker VG was (at the time) the only LED that could illuminate further in all weather.
I love LEDs too, but I will always have a G2 or better incan or two at my disposal for all conditions.

MacTech said:

...my last test involved my Salt 1 sitting in hypersaturated salt water in a 2.5 gallon fish tank with glass lid, the salt water was created by dissolving *ROCK SALT* in water until it could no longer dissolve any more, i then used an ultrasonic fogger to create a highly corrosive *SALT FOG*, the Salt withstood *TWO WEEKS* in the fog chamber, not a speck of rust, nothing
by means of comparison, a mundane "stainless steel" Sheffield hawkbill (found at the Home Depot) started showing visible spotting in a *half hour* and actual rust spots in an *hour*, total time to failure was under 1 hour, it's *that* corrosive, and the Salt series just shrugs it off....

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Looks like your salt test is doing it's job of providing an adequate comparison if you got a blade to rust, but to really test rust resistance, you need to add temperature. I work in automotive shocks and the salt spray test we use is run at elevated temperature (80 deg C) to accelerate onset of corrosion. We have paints that test out to 600 hours (25 days), but chrome plated rods only last 96 hours. Just an FYI on testing. I may have to look into getting one of those Spyderco Salts.

I love incandescents but the runtime and bulb life is killer. I suppose I am opposite from you, you could try looking into gel filters, I was thinking to get a warmer tint a thin yellow orange filter would be nice.

I'm not that much of a purist when it comes to my flashoholism. I'm just happy as long my light is bright(that includes regulation), runs long and don't break. So LED is clearly the way to go for me. But I totally understand all you incan guys, incans are far from dead yet.