Cree Optic

Are the cree optics meant to be used behind a lens or can I use them exposed to the elements. The reason that I ask is that I read (in another thread) that the optic surface is easily scratched and should not be touched.
ALSO do you have to use the supplied white holder? Is it more efficient with the holder?
Thanks,
Mike

1st of all, the optic sux better get one of the Cree fitting reflectors, from the shoppe f.e.

* usually the front of an optic can be scrateched, does not matter too much. But NEVER touch it at the back.
* holder makes alining the optic much easier (but still whoever designed that holder is a dork), just placing the optic onto the emitter might work, but how to fix it then?
* no protection from the front, MUST use an additional front cover (thats why using a reflector gets even better)

I would put a bezel between the optic and the elements, as scratches and contaminants could adversely affect performance.

As for the holder, that is the part that's supposed to be bonded in place around the LED. You could use the optic alone without the holder, but you'd have to fab up some means of mounting the optic that preserevs its positioning.

oO

Be aware that a lot of people don't like optics for various reasons and show their prejudices in their recommendations. Both have their trade-offs. The right optic can be very good for some purposes. Like when trying to illuminate a distant object with close objects near your line of sight that too much spill will light up and cause glare dimming your sight of the far object you actually want to look at, you can use a narrow optic with no spill. Optics come in more beam variations than reflectors do, so you can swap out for a flood beam or narrow spot with no spill and anywhere in-between just by changing the optic. I do this with my SF L1 and Minimag all the time.

So on to your questions......
*You should cover the optic with a glass or plastic lens/window JUST LIKE ANY REFLECTOR to keep it from getting damaged. Optics and reflectors are the same in this respect. Smooth front optics CAN be used without a window, may get scratched, but cleaned off OK and still be used. I have one light with an exposed optic and it has been fine so far. They are made of acrylic which is not hard, but not soft either. They can take mild punishment, just take care not to scratch the back while installing it.
*The holder is supplied as an aid that reflectors never seem to have, but also sometimes need, so this is an advantage, not a problem. The outside shape of an optic and reflector are very similar, so an application that needs an optic holder probably also could use a reflector holder (but none exist). Most often, an optic or reflector of appropriate size will drop in to a flashlight bezel and either be captured between the LED and lens (automatically centered if placed on the emitter during assembly), or be captured and centered by the bezel (usually also centered). I have many optics, no holders, and don't miss or need them.

Caution: metal reflectors can cause shorts if soldered connections on the cree pad are not kept low and out of the way. This is not an issue with optics or plastic reflectors.

Ok,
I put the optic in. I really like this, great throw and nice spill. Just what I wanted.
Thanks All,
Mike

If You think the original optic has throw and spill, You would be very surprised to see the truth by using an McR-XRe 16 or 17 mm. Both reflectors are great in the way, that they feature a "seat" for the emitter, perfectly aligning it, just place refli onto led and glue.

I ve done and posted some various beamshots here in this tread:
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/151836
(black vertical stripe at pic is from the rubber band temporarily holding the device)

unfortunately my cam is not able to do anything other than "automatic" at these light conditions, so the difference that is there in reality is not very obvious
My impression of the optic was: no spill at all (better: spill present, but leaving over 180 degrees, light coming even through that white holder. But barely useable spill around the tunnel beam) also not too tight, even when pics look a bit different (can explain more, if You wish).

Once I also thought the optics are better, especially because one can use "broader" ones. But after getting some reflectored lights and being able to compare, that feeling left. Optics are only a bit better inside buildings, or better: at room distances.
Anywhere else most reflector smokes those optics, and one gets used to the beam, even indoors.

PS: but I admit, I do not like totally spill-less beams

My optic was 2.50 through a group buy. How much were your xre reflectors?
Thanks for the info.
Mike

Yello,
I do appreciate your input but, I am just trying to get all my old flashlights up to current LED technology without spending enough, where, I should have bought a completely new light.
Where did you get your reflectors?
Mike

I feel the need to reply again.

yellow said:

If You think the original optic has throw and spill, You would be very surprised to see the truth by using an McR-XRe 16 or 17 mm.

Click to expand...

Often too much spill at the outside with that hard edge where the reflector ends. That often is the brightest thing you see since it is hitting something up close, washing out the distant object you are trying to see.

yellow said:

Both reflectors are great in the way, that they feature a "seat" for the emitter, perfectly aligning it, just place refli onto led and glue.

Click to expand...

All the optics I've seen also center themselves per my previous post.

yellow said:

My impression of the optic was: no spill at all (better: spill present, but leaving over 180 degrees, light coming even through that white holder. But barely useable spill around the tunnel beam) also not too tight, even when pics look a bit different (can explain more, if You wish).

Click to expand...

The best throw (5m center brightness) in those pictures is from an optic... and the pictures don't agree with your statement that there is barely useable spill around the center beam. My experience shows otherwise too. Spill is just closer to the center, fading out toward the outside where it is less useful anyway.

yellow said:

Once I also thought the optics are better, especially because one can use "broader" ones. But after getting some reflectored lights and being able to compare, that feeling left. Optics are only a bit better inside buildings, or better: at room distances.
Anywhere else most reflector smokes those optics, and one gets used to the beam, even indoors.

Click to expand...

I thought the opposite: I though reflectors were the only way to go until I saw some nice optics. Now I think both have their uses. Where people use them most for walking around (shining them at the ground and obstacles in their vicinity) and the best throwing LED smaller than a C-cell Mag, the Striker VG, uses an optic. The two best throwers (@ 5m) in your test are optics.

yellow said:

PS: but I admit, I do not like totally spill-less beams

Click to expand...

The only one I know like that is the Surefire TIR (edit: or old Inova X1), and that has it's uses (I use it for discrete throw - jogging around the neighborhod at night without attracting attention to myself until I want to), and is fine with a diffuser to get the best of both worlds in one light. The Inova TIROS has spill, it just fades away quickly off-center for a useful beam. Even my Striker VG, with a tighter spot with less spill than the Inova TIROS, still has enough spill to navigate by. But I use a nice balanced Fraen in my old ML1 right now both indoors and out. It is brighter 10 degrees off center than any reflector with almost as much throw as the MCR18 it came with.