Amilite T5 Emitter Turns Brown & Lower, More Purple Output

JRNioa said:

I did notice though that my SCC LED in it gradually became more and more "brownish" with just a month of use to the point where the LED output was strong but very purple and wne you looked at the LED with the light off it was brown not clear! I replaced the LED last night with a new 6500K SCC P4 from the shop and the light is white and strong now!

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Mine did the same thing and it explains the lower output I noticed yesterday. Like you said, the actual emitter is brownish and the beam is more purple. Output is also lower. I've been comparing my T5 to an M3 w/ a SSC P4 and the T5 always blew it away. Now they're about the same. :thumbsdow

I hope it's just a bad batch of emitters. The instructions didn't say anything about changing it every month. :shakehead Were you running 3.7v cells?

Anyone else have the same thing happen yet?

Mine did the same thing and it explains the lower output I noticed yesterday. Like you said, the actual emitter is brownish and the beam is more purple. Output is also lower. I've been comparing my T5 to an M3 w/ a SSC P4 and the T5 always blew it away. Now they're about the same. :thumbsdow

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I believe the M3 uses a Cree. The Lumapower Formula1 uses SSC P4. I wonder if the soft dome of the Seoul(silicone) vs the harder dome of the Cree is contributing to this phenomenon.

Steve L said:

I believe the M3 uses a Cree. The Lumapower Formula1 uses SSC P4. I wonder if the soft dome of the Seoul(silicone) vs the harder dome of the Cree is contributing to this phenomenon.

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Left: Lumapower M3 Cree XR-E Right: Lumapower ES M3 SSC P4
[url="http://www.myonlineimages.com/serveFile.aspx?fi=903966"] [/url]

The heatsinking must not be enough, or there is too much current to the LED. The SSC is known to have the phosphor degrade fast when at high currents and high temps...

This is bad news to all SSC torches including my T5 .

Originally posted by Gannz

Left: Lumapower M3 Cree XR-E Right: Lumapower ES M3 SSC P4
<A href="http://www.myonlineimages.com/serveFile.aspx?fi=903966]" target=_blank>

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Very nice! How do the 2 heads compare to each other? Does the SSC have more output(lumens) on high?:naughty: More of a wall of light effect?

Oh no! I love my T5, I hope these are just isolated incidents... If not, I wonder how good Amilite's warranty is.

Gannz, where did you get the Lumapower ES M3 SSC P4. It looks interesting.

Thanx,

Gannz said:

Left: Lumapower M3 Cree XR-E Right: Lumapower ES M3 SSC P4
[url="http://www.myonlineimages.com/serveFile.aspx?fi=903966"]

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Not good at all,

Hmm, looking forward to finding out more about this issue.

One key question for those who have experienced this: Are you running with 3.6/3.7V Li-Ions or primaries?

Perhaps the overdriving with Li-Ions is causing premature damage to the LED. How is the heatsinking in the T5?

It is not clear yet whether 3.7 Li-Ions were being used.

jsr said:

One key question for those who have experienced this: Are you running with 3.6/3.7V Li-Ions or primaries?

Perhaps the overdriving with Li-Ions is causing premature damage to the LED. How is the heatsinking in the T5?

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Likewise curious if this is the case (running with 3.6/3.7V Li-Ions) ...

[edit-added]: On reviewing the Amilite site, I don't see any recommendation against the use of Li-Ion, but I don't see any endorsement of their use either. In my experience, if it's OK to use a cell type a Mfgr. will often tell you so rather than trying to mention every cell you cannot (or should not) use... I wonder if those folks using 3.6v Li-Ions are damaging their lights. I'll be adding a precautionary statement to the review.

jsr said:

Hmm, looking forward to finding out more about this issue.

One key question for those who have experienced this: Are you running with 3.6/3.7V Li-Ions or primaries?

Perhaps the overdriving with Li-Ions is causing premature damage to the LED. How is the heatsinking in the T5?

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I've been running 3.6/3.7v RCR's almost exclusively. The heatsink is very nice and I don't see much room for improvement here...



... except for maybe some more venting (two vents total). It's not solid of course but it is 1mm thick copper.

Steve L, I'll start a new thread comparing the two M3's in the Homemade & Modified forum. I'll PM a link to you.


Rookie, The M3 ES (engineering sample) SSC-P4 is a prototype and one of only a few that LP made w/ a Seoul emitter.

Quickbeam said:

In my experience, if it's OK to use a cell type a Mfgr. will often tell you so rather than trying to mention every cell you cannot (or should not) use...

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Good point.

Quickbeam said:

I wonder if those folks using 3.6v Li-Ions are damaging their lights.

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I think that's what we're trying to figure out. <edit>

Better?

Quickbeam said:

I'll be adding a precautionary statement to the review.

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Thanks.

Originally posted by Gannz

Steve L, I'll start a new thread comparing the two M3's in the Homemade & Modified forum. I'll PM a link to you.

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Thanks

http://www.dealextreme.com/details.dx/sku.1994

This link from dealextreme stated for the new jetbeam MK II Cree.

"Heat problems
The only problem we saw with this great little light is heat, which seems to be a common problem for these little AA-sized high power lights. In our tests with a single Ultrafire 14500 battery, the light heated up to 120'F / 48'C (!) in just 20 minutes on high beam mode (100% output). In fact the user's manual suggests not to keep the light on high modes (>80% output) for more than 10 minutes or it will permanently reduce emitter output -- it will probably damage your hand before it gets to the emitter."

Quickbeam said:

[edit-added]: On reviewing the Amilite site, I don't see any recommendation against the use of Li-Ion, but I don't see any endorsement of their use either. In my experience, if it's OK to use a cell type a Mfgr. will often tell you so rather than trying to mention every cell you cannot (or should not) use... I wonder if those folks using 3.6v Li-Ions are damaging their lights.

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According to whc's reviews/tests at https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/156007:

• Runtime with AW's protected 3.7v high current 750mah RCR123A cell: 19 min 14 sec
• Runtime with protected rechargeable Uniross 600mah CR123A cell: 33 min 33 sec
• Runtime with primary Tekcell 2.9v CR123A cell: After 1 Hour the cell went from 2.9v to 2.49v
• "Can't see much differense, maybe a tad brighter with RCR123A compared to primary CR123A?"

Now, assuming the Tekcell CR123A is the typical 1300mAH CR123A, the 3.0V Uniross' performance jibes with the primary CR123A's performance. But what of the 3.7V RCR? It's actually got 25% more capacity, but gets only 60% as much runtime as the Uniross cell. Then whc notes the T5 isn't appreciably brighter with the 23% voltage boost and one is inclined to ask one's self: Where's all that extra energy going? In physics we're taught you can neither create nor destroy energy (1st law of thermodynamics). So it must be going somewhere. My guess, on reading whc's comments, was waste heat. As we all know: Heat and semiconductors don't play well together. So I, personally, would've been disinclined to use the 3.7V cells.

Sorry for taking the thread offtrack. Thanx Gannz for the info. I hope they eventually make it as a regular option.

Gannz said:

Rookie, The M3 ES (engineering sample) SSC-P4 is a prototype and the only one ever made w/ a Seoul emitter.

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I have been driving three SSC P4 U bin pretty hard in two modded Litefluxes and in my modded Fenix P1 for about two months. All the time used with LiIon 3.7 Volt cells. The Litefluxes have been used extensively on a daily basis for two months and they are driven at +700 mA as they deliver about 8000 Lux. No ill effects so far, they measure the same on my luxmeter after two months. And they get HOT sometimes. The serious heatsink and the output numbers on the Amilite suggests that they are operating within specs for the SSC. My suggestion would be defective emitters.
Stefan

SEMIJim, thanks for the info, I feel a lot better about my T5 now, because I use primaries only.