Law enforcement

[Rumeye]

So I've been using a cheap LED flashlight ($20) which served its purpose for two years but its on the fritz. I am in fairly urgent need for a replacement and want a decent tactical light - obviously the cheaper the better.

These are my priorities for a light

1. Good flood/decent throw - I work in a big city so its mostly close quarters for me.
2. Tactical UI - Momentary on/fully on switch at rear. I don't really like the side switch for intensity and like the secondary button at the rear. Intense on first but not necessary.
3. Batteries... I don't really know anything about them but rechargeable. AA's would be best because I can get them from work or I'll buy rechargeable 123A's if they exist.
4. Price
5. Less than 6" in length and durable. IPX8 water resistant rating is nice.
6. Just a nice feature would be lower lumens for writing at night - I don't really know but I hear people complain about PWM so maybe I should avoid this?

Choices I like so far (rated):

1. Klarus XT11 (800 lumens now I think? but 600 lumen model is $15 cheaper)
2. Jetbeam PC25
3. Fenix TK22 (too expensive at $100 around here)

I live in Canada if that makes a difference for suggestions. Thanks guys! -Shawn

 

[Rumeye]

I've also just found the Olight M22 warrior light, pretty good too.

 

[madecov]

Hard to beat the XT11, I have one and use sometimes on the duty belt.

 

[TheVat26]

Welcome. Fellow LEO. I have (3) Klarus lights and like them all. RS11, XT2C (470 version, my favorite of the three), and an XT2A. I would go with the XT11 with Eagletac 3100 mah protected 18650. 123's put out a little more lumens at th expense of runtime. Self built has a great review. Going gear has a good bundle sale.

I also work in the city and the XT11 is more than enough light. I havent used the 800+ version yet, but the 600 version throws 160+ yards with enough power to effectively distinguish a target clearly at 100 yards. Simple, tactically correct interface and goes to high every time. No mode memory to trip you up when you need light NOW. The switch is very light, your thumb won't tire when using momentary function a lot. The mode switch is a lot lower than the main and you won't confuse the two. You can activate the main switch from any angle. Yes it has pwm, but its not noticeable. If cost is an issue, then the 600 version will be plenty. The only fault with Klarus' lights is the pocket clips. They hold well, but offer very little flex and may break if dropped. Every part if the light is superb, minus the clip. Holds in the SAP pocket very well though.

The 820 will be a bit brighter and run a little bit longer, but will no way put the 600 one to shame. The initial cost may seem like much, but the performance will blow you away, and your safety is worth the cost.

If you really want aa, a 2AA light like the Streamlight Pro Tac 2aa (favorite 2aa light in my collection) has great runtime and power on 2 nimh's, but not quite enough punch to be a primary IMO. It ran 3.5 hours on high with no noticeable dimming using eneloops. Ran another hour at 50%, then at 4.5-5 hours went to low mode.

 

[hkenawy]

i suggest you get 2 seperate lights a primary that starts at high with no other modes and a small secondary that has a low mode for the other tasks

 

[Rumeye]

Thanks for the help with this one guys.

I think I'll still with the Klarus - it's good to hear first hand info about the light. I also read the review recommended. It was pretty helpful, I just need to get over the price lol

Thanks for the recommendation on the batteries too. Protected ones aren't as dangerous for charging? I don't know anything about 18650s and I'm fairly lax when it comes to taking care of batteries!

 

[Rumeye]

i suggest you get 2 seperate lights a primary that starts at high with no other modes and a small secondary that has a low mode for the other tasks

Thanks for the suggestion. I've thought about this too. I'll grab a small one to clip on my shoulder eventually I just keep forgetting lol

 

[Mr. Tone]

I always have 3 lights on me when I am on duty at night. I carry an Eagletac G25C2 MK II in neutral white on my belt and have an Eagletac SX25L2 in neutral white in hand. I just bought those two to replace the Lumintop TD15X neutral white(belt) and Thrunite Catapult V3 neutral white that I have been using the last couple of years. I also have in my pocket a L3 Illumination L10 with Nichia 219 which is a small 1xAA twisty light. I am well equipped for illumination.

Once you go with a rechargeable li-ion light it is hard to got back to AA format. You can get so much more power with 18650 vs. AA and better runtime possibility, too, on the lower modes. I will give you links to the lights I have so you can see some reviews for yourself.

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...2xCR123A-RCR)-Review-RUNTIMES-VIDEO-BEAMSHOTS

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-(2x26650)-XM-L2-U2-Review-RUNTIMES-BEAMSHOTS


These Eagletac's are designed with LEO's in mind and they also have smaller format AA type lights. Streamlight and Surefire also have some AA format lights now as do a lot of other manufacturers. There are a lot of good choices out there, good luck!

 

[Wiggle]

I'd suggest looking at Quark Turbo QB2A

2*AA
Just about 6" long (a smidge over)
Simple UI (program your desired low and high and then loosen or tighten head to pick, very nice and simple)
Has a bit of throw to it but should still be great at close range
True momentary operation

If you set this light up at 205 lumens on the high and 4 lumens at the low you've got a good setup IMO.

One thing that is important to consider that I've realized since I live in a city is that you are probably better off with a lower lumen light that is punchier (ie more throw) than a monster XM-L flooder. In small reflector sizes you aren't going to get much throw from an XM-L and cities have so much background light that even powerful flood lights don't penetrate like you'd expect them to.

Also I notice you mentioned rechargeable CR123 as an option (aka RCR123). If you are going to go the route of li-ion rechargeables I strongly recommend you hop right over RCR123 and go to 18650 cells instead. 18650 offers alot more available energy especially under higher loads and depending on the light, usually has a much more graceful low battery response. Almost all 2*RCR123 lights will leave you in the dark without warning.

Not to overwhem you but it's important to realize that Li-ion really has a much higher power density than AA, 18650 is the best li-ion cell currently available:
AA holds about 2.4 Wh of energy (a Sanyo Eneloop)
RCR123/16340 holds about 3.0 Wh of energy (typical 3.7V 800 mAh cell)
18650 holds about 12.5 Wh of energy (newest Panasonic 3400 mAh based cells)

As you can see, you would need about 5 AAs or 4 RCR123s to equal the energy stored in one 18650. 18650 has the benefit of having a voltage very close to the typical voltage required at the LED, usually producing more efficient drivers.

 

[Rumeye]

I

One thing that is important to consider that I've realized since I live in a city is that you are probably better off with a lower lumen light that is punchier (ie more throw) than a monster XM-L flooder. In small reflector sizes you aren't going to get much throw from an XM-L and cities have so much background light that even powerful flood lights don't penetrate like you'd expect them to.

Thanks for the good information.

I hear what your saying about a flood light, but what would be better with a lot of background light? I typically use the lights for clearing houses, buildings or looking into cars.

You guys have certainly convinced me to use a rechargeable 18650's, so I'll stick with a light that supports these.

 

[Wiggle]

Thanks for the good information.

I hear what your saying about a flood light, but what would be better with a lot of background light? I typically use the lights for clearing houses, buildings or looking into cars.

You guys have certainly convinced me to use a rechargeable 18650's, so I'll stick with a light that supports these.

Before you make the call on 18650s be sure you visit the batteries forum and read up on on the safety and proper handling of these cells. They are generally quite safe provided they are treated correctly but you need to be aware.

But yes single 18650 lights IMO are a great sweet spot between size and performance and you have many choices.

To get adequate throw and punch in a smaller light I'd be inclined to get an XP-G/XP-G2 light. It is hard to focus the XM-L/XM-L2 and get much throw in a smaller reflector unless you go custom (like one of vinhs overdriven, de-domed P60 modules).

 

[Mr. Tone]

Thanks for the good information.

I hear what your saying about a flood light, but what would be better with a lot of background light? I typically use the lights for clearing houses, buildings or looking into cars.

You guys have certainly convinced me to use a rechargeable 18650's, so I'll stick with a light that supports these.

The way that those performance criteria are measured needs to be explained to help you a little more. Candela, candlepower, and lux are all terms used to describe the highest intensity of light at a given point and distance. These figures are most commonly referenced at 1 meter distance or calculated back to that distance. This is the measurement describing how bright/intense the hotspot(center) of the beam is. You need to see a light that has an ANSI standard and know what the candela rating is so you can have a useful frame of reference.

The term lumens is used to describe the total amount of light coming out of the flashlight. More lumens does not always equal more candela in the hotspot and often can mean less. There are many variables here regarding this relationship, far too many to talk about in this thread. Let me give you an example. Imagine you have two flashlights with all things being equal including candela but let's say one had double the lumens(500 vs. 1000). The one with the higher lumen output would not throw farther in the hotspot but the spill light be brighter and illuminate a little further.

Most of the manufacturers that have a suitable duty belt light now use either a Cree XP-G2 or XM-L2 LED. The XM-L2 at it's max drive current will put out more total lumens than the XP-G2 at it's max current. With all else being equal, though, the XP-G2 will produce a tighter and brighter hotspot. That is because of brightness at the source(LED) and it's ability to be focused. The XP-G2 will have a spill that will seem less bright vs. the XM-L2 but the hotspot of the XP-G2 will seem brighter.

Maybe I am making you more confused than ever but I hope not!

Another way to help with the lumens thing is to shine a light up at the ceiling. A light that will light up the whole room more than another has more lumens. With candela a light that seems to illuminate farther than another has a higher candela. A great example of high candela but very little lumens is a laser. The brightness of that little dot is super intense but if you aimed a laser at the ceiling it would do little to illuminate the room.:candle:

 

[Rumeye]

You guys are killing me with info lol but it's all good to know. I really enjoy making an informed decision.

So, for a custom lens, is this a hard mod to do? Or is an XP-G2 just the better solution? If it is an Xp-G2, whats comparable to the Klarus XT-11?

I want something that can light a room easily without having to pan. That's why I thought the XM-L2 would be the best choice.

Wiggle, ill check out the battery thread tonight after the kids go to bed. I can pay more attention then lol

Thanks Mr. Tone for the heads up. I thought all the measurements were just different terms for the same thing. Just a marketing gimmick is what I expected!

 

[stienke]

You are a Canadian so take a look at Armytek XP-G2 lights , perfect long lasting flashlights and the are based in Canada!

 

[Rumeye]

You are a Canadian so take a look at Armytek XP-G2 lights , perfect long lasting flashlights and the are based in Canada!

Thanks Stienke! I like the Predator pro v2.5. I didn't know they were Canadian made either.

The light looks like it's got a lot of good features. My only issues are the UI with the twist head to change outputs and it's $100 without batteries!

Looks like the light would last forever though :s Tough decision.

 

[Mr. Tone]

You guys are killing me with info lol but it's all good to know. I really enjoy making an informed decision.

So, for a custom lens, is this a hard mod to do? Or is an XP-G2 just the better solution? If it is an Xp-G2, whats comparable to the Klarus XT-11?

I want something that can light a room easily without having to pan. That's why I thought the XM-L2 would be the best choice.

Wiggle, ill check out the battery thread tonight after the kids go to bed. I can pay more attention then lol

Thanks Mr. Tone for the heads up. I thought all the measurements were just different terms for the same thing. Just a marketing gimmick is what I expected!

The XM-L2 will give you the most "room lighting" effect and a wider spill than the XP-G2. The newer XM-L2 lights that have 1.5" head diameters all give pretty good throw and around 800-1000 lumens. My Eagletac G25C2 MKII has a little more than 20,000 candela and has an XM-L2 in it. It has impressive throw for something that size and gobs of output. It lights up a whole room, that's for sure!

Armytek is in Canada and has models with both the XP-G2 and also the XM-L2. They also make models in cool and neutral(warm) white. This is a personal preference thing but I have to have neutral white lights. They do not give that blueish tint that makes things look unnatural and ghostly. However, some like cool tints and more power to them but I like the more natural looking light from neutral white LED's.

 

[Wiggle]

The Predator 2.5 Pro is a great light (I have one myself and it's one of my favs) but due to the XP-G2 emitter and very deep reflector it is more of a compact thrower than a general use light. It will penetrate very well and provide a very intense spot (30-40 kcd) but it may not be ideal for illumination of things less than 20 feet away as it is quite focussed. It is most well suited from 20 to 200m IMO. Don't get me wrong, it'll work up close, and has modes for all lumen needs but you may find the beam is a bit tight for comfort at those close distances.

Their XM-L2 equivalent may be more appropriate and due to the deeper reflector it actually gets a pretty good mid-range throw out of the XM-L2 emitter. I suspect it performs similarly to the M22 Warrior, you'd want to decide which build/UI you like more between those two lights.

As Mr. Tone indicated, some of the newer, aggresively driven XM-L2 lights with slightly larger reflectors are getting pretty good throw as well. 20 kcd is a very respectable throw and should perform well even with background city light.

 

[Rumeye]

Well, I think I'm going to get the XT11. The UI and two buttons on the rear sell it for me. The price is good and I think(hope) it will be enough for work.

Thanks everyone for the great advice and suggestions.

Now, any good places to buy from that ship to Canada? Or even stores in the Toronto area would be good.

 

[TheVat26]

Good call with the XT11. I live in California and pretty much buy everything from going gear. They will guide you on the best batteries and charger (probably eagletac 3100 or 3400 mah protected and a nitecore i2). Advise you are an Leo or cpf member for 10% discount. I am not 100% sure on their policy to shipping batteries out of USA so definitely call them first. Good luck, be safe, and I bet you'll love working at night with a quality light. Btw, clearing houses indoors with the xt11, it puts out so much even wide light it will seem like daylight. Just be mindful of mirrors when clearing bathrooms and bedrooms to minimize reflection.

 

[Meatybacchus478]

I only use Surefires for duty use. An R1 and a Lumamax LX2.

Ive tried many of the Chinese and cheaper brands to no avail.