When is a Hybrio not a Hybrio?

[Mr Happy]

Answer: When it is branded by UltraLast?

I got 4 Hybrio cells that came with an UltraLast charger, only these cells don't look the same as the regular Uniross Hybrios that are sold in separate packaging.

Here is what a Uniross Hybrio looks like:

And here is what an UltraLast Hybrio looks like:

Now the Uniross Hybrios look just like Eneloops, and they perform like Eneloops too.

However, these UltraLast cells are something different. In appearance they look rather similar to the Powerex Immedion cells: a valley around the outside at the positive end and a small round button.

I put them onto the C9000 for a discharge test out of the package and they started out at 1.16 V. When finished, the measured capacities at 400 mA were 943, 1035, 1086, 1016 mAh. Those are the lowest as-purchased readings of any LSD cell I have seen.

I have not done any more testing on them yet, so I can't say any more until I do.

The batteries were not the only disappointment in the package -- the charger disappointed too, but that's another story...

 

[VidPro]

When is a Hybrio not a Hybrio?

well of course, when its a cheap knockoff sold on e-bay (or amazon, or dx or china or . . .) for really cheap and it isnt even an LSD cell, let alone of the capacity stated.

i always have to wonder , if some battery someone is discussing is from that deal place, or e-bay, or whatever, is actually the real battery, because the differences are all the difference in the world.

"yes it SHOULD perform like this", "but you have to have IT first to determine that", the knockoff china clone doesnt count

 

[Mr Happy]

Except in this case, these are genuine fakes, not counterfeit fakes.

UltraLast is a brand name of the North American Battery Company (NABC), which was acquired in 2006 by Uniross, who own the Hybrio trademark. They even show the real Hybrios on their web site: http://www.nabcorp.com/whatsnew/

This is probably a case of the marketing department thinking they can sell a different product, call it the same name, and nobody will know the difference.

 

[VidPro]

how do you know they arent fake?
i saw fake ones being sold on both e-bay and amazon, , , , i was Tempted to buy them even.

 

[Mr Happy]

They came with an UltraLast charger in retail packaging from Fry's. If the whole package of charger and batteries is really not a genuine UltraLast product, then I have a story to tell to the California consumer protection people...

 

[VidPro]

They came with an UltraLast charger in retail packaging from Fry's. If the whole package of charger and batteries is really not a genuine UltraLast product, then I have a story to tell to the California consumer protection people...

frys huh, well its surely a good thing you tell your story SOMEWHERE, imagine the number of people you can save from buying them.

and 96% of them dont have any way to even check for capacity, other than , "hey its dead again, ok charge it back up".

luckily frys will take a return no questions asked, just stand in line for 3-4 hours

and thanks to you, i am no longer tempted, i came here just to relieve myself of such temptations.

 

[Mr Happy]

Well I might be returning the charger at that, since the claimed "90 minute" charger actually takes about 3 hours to charge the included set of 2000 mAh cells. When you get the charger out of the sealed packaging it says on the back "charging current 800 mA x 4". Calling it a 90 minute charger is a blatant LIE. I've a good mind to contact the California Attorney General's office.

 

[VidPro]

I've a good mind to contact the California Attorney General's office.

will they stand in the return line for you

 

[Mr Happy]

I have to find out what the consumer laws are in California. In the UK for a comparison, there is the Trade Descriptions Act, which makes it illegal for traders to misrepresent what they are selling. If they make false claims or provide false descriptions of a product they can be prosecuted and fined.

 

[VidPro]

they have consumer laws like that here too, if its misrepresented its sold at wally marf, Flies , or home Deperto, or any large corporate establisment that pays more money to lawyers, than employees

http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/index.shtml
The FTC's Bureau of Consumer Protection works For The Consumer to prevent fraud, deception, and unfair business practices in the marketplace. . . . anytime its big enough to justify an increase in our yearly budget . . .

 

[Fallingwater]

well of course, when its a cheap knockoff sold on e-bay (or amazon, or dx or china or . . .)

Actually, the Eneloops and ReCyko cells sold on DX are genuine. They are not a good deal though, for some reason they cost much more than in stores (even around here).

 

[Ray_of_Light]

You can easily differentiate LSD from non-LSD cells with a memory o-scope. If you apply an heavy load (say about 5 Amps to a 2000 mA/h AA cell), the LSD cell will show voltage delay while the non-LSD will not.
Use a 0.18 Ohm 5 W resistor as load, take a shot with the O-scope of a known LSD and a known non-LSD while you connect the resistor. Make then your comparisons.

Regards

Anthony

 

[Hooked on Fenix]

This wouldn't be the first time Ultralast did false advertising. Have you seen their "3.0 volt" RCR123As? They are unprotected 3.7 volt cells. They fried my first Inova X5 due to their false advertising. Their lithium and alkaline batteries are a joke too. The alkalines have about 7/10 the power of one of the top three brands. Take them back and buy cells from a good company. Try eneloops. They are the only LSD cell that claim to work well in cold weather. I've tried them as low as 15 degrees F and they worked fine.

 

[Mr Happy]

This wouldn't be the first time Ultralast did false advertising. Have you seen their "3.0 volt" RCR123As? They are unprotected 3.7 volt cells. They fried my first Inova X5 due to their false advertising.

That's interesting. I was in Fry's and someone in the battery aisle picked up the UltraLast pack of 2 RCR123A's plus charger. He said, "Hey, that's neat. I have a flashlight that eats CR123A's and it's really expensive. I could use these instead." I mentioned he should be careful as RCR123A's are not always a drop-in replacement for primaries, but he pointed to the pack and said, "Well look, it says they are 3 V on the description, what could be the problem?"

As far as Eneloops go I don't need convincing about that. I have many of them and think they are excellent.

But I will say that the genuine Uniross brand Hybrios with the brightly colored red, green and black packaging are the real deal. They are only $9.99 in Fry's and they perform just as well as Eneloops.

 

[Curious_character]

I bought four Ultralast primary lithium cells for my camera at Fry's a while back. One was DOA, another nearly so, and the remaining two lasted a lot shorter time than good quality cells. I won't be buying any more cells of any kind with that junk brand.

c_c

 

[MattK]

This is easily explained; Uniross, which now owns NABC/Ultralast has their LSD batteries contract manufactured and they changed factories about 6-8 months ago.

Flash back about 1-1.5 years ago and only 2 factories made LSD batteries; Sanyo and the factory that makes LSD Duracells, OLD Hybrios (with green at top), our LSD Titaniums and a few others.

Now the LSD technology is more widely disseminated so it's more competetive and there are less capable factories making them - so there are lower quality, less expensive LSD's on the market. Uniross has switched their manufacturing to one of these plants to lower costs - or more likely to maintain a lower costs as in the past year the factory direct cost of NiMh batteries has increased about 50% due to raw materials cost increases, energy costs and currency fluctuations.

So; both batteries are 'real' Hybrio's but one battery is simply better than the other. If you want the superior quality battery you must buy; OLD Hybrios, Titaniums, Eneloops or Duracells.

 

[UnknownVT]

This is easily explained; Uniross, which now owns NABC/Ultralast has their LSD batteries contract manufactured and they changed factories about 6-8 months ago.
Flash back about 1-1.5 years ago and only 2 factories made LSD batteries; Sanyo and the factory that makes LSD Duracells, OLD Hybrios (with green at top), our LSD Titaniums and a few others.
Now the LSD technology is more widely disseminated so it's more competetive and there are less capable factories making them
If you want the superior quality battery you must buy; OLD Hybrios, Titaniums, Eneloops or Duracells.

Many thanks for that useful information -

Even a BIG name like the Duracell may have variations -
their Pre-Charged (LSD) are Made In Japan (re-badged eneloops) and Made in China - please see -

Duracell Pre-Charged Rechargeables - Buyer Advisory

 

[jzmtl]

Well I might be returning the charger at that, since the claimed "90 minute" charger actually takes about 3 hours to charge the included set of 2000 mAh cells. When you get the charger out of the sealed packaging it says on the back "charging current 800 mA x 4". Calling it a 90 minute charger is a blatant LIE. I've a good mind to contact the California Attorney General's office.

Well not really, it's packed with cells that's only 1000mah so they aren't lying, it'll charge in 90 minutes.

 

[UnknownVT]

Well I might be returning the charger at that, since the claimed "90 minute" charger actually takes about 3 hours to charge the included set of 2000 mAh cells. When you get the charger out of the sealed packaging it says on the back "charging current 800 mA x 4". Calling it a 90 minute charger is a blatant LIE.

Actually the UltraLast ULINOV2 charger seems smart and well spec'd - being independent channels with LCD indicator for each channel(?)

How much did you pay for the combo at Fry's?
The lowest price I could find (without shipping) was $19 - (Froogle search on UL-INOV2 sorted by low price)

Which seems like good value, as long as the "new" UltraLast Hybrios perform OK........
and up to now all LSDs seem to have performed well - with only minor differences for most practical usage - the most significant difference that I found, which affected my use, was the higher voltage maintenance of eneloops and reputed for the original Uniross Hybrios.

My guess is that the 90min claim may be for AAA NiMH batteries which are normally 700-1000mAh - so 800mA makes it C/1.25 - 1.1C

The UltraLast UL-INOV2 charger seems better spec'd than the Duracell Power-Gauge charger.......
possibly cheaper, and supplied with LSD batteries (caveat as long as they work properly)

 

[Mr Happy]

Yes, on paper the spec for the ULINOV2 is OK since it does have a 12 V adapter, a USB input, a refresh function and a three step progress gauge for each channel. However the 12 V input only provides the reduced USB charging rate.

I just have a bad taste in my mouth about the deceptive packing, so I am not disposed to like it.

It could be argued that the 90 minutes applies to AAA cells, except that both the outer packaging and the included instructions say it charges in 90 minutes when using the cells supplied in the package. This doesn't really leave any wriggle room since I've timed it and the cells in the package take over 3 hours to charge.

It also feels very light and fragile and plasticky, not at all solid and durable. In contrast the Duracell charger feels bulletproof.

The cost was $19.99 plus tax, and it did come with 4 LSD cells, although I don't believe they are very good ones. I would rather have the "Eneloop" Hybrios with the colorful labels.

Yeah, for twenty bucks I haven't lost much, but I generally prefer to feel happy about my purchases and not feel deceived. I now wonder if the "30 minute" charger I passed up in preference to this one is actually a "one hour" charger, in which case it would have been the one I wanted. But since I apparently can't trust UltraLast to label their packaging accurately I have no way of knowing, and no desire to go through Fry's product return hoopla any more times than necessary to find out.

[Edit: No, now I remember it the "30 minute" charger only has two channels, not four.]