Your honest opinion on SF M6? (Part 2)
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Solscud007
Flashlight Enthusiast
So for those using Rechargeable 123, im guessing at 3.7v, for the LF HO-M6R; how do you charge so many batteries? just take turns? so three sets of pairs? or do you guys just have a bunch of chargers so you can charge all the batteries at the same time?
Illum
Flashaholic
3 DSD chargers from lighthound usually does it. since DSDs charge these cells at approx 250ma per cell...expect some waiting time.
I have two DSDs, they seem to be adquate. Unless you've completely drained the RCR123As to nothing usually a few hours of sitting after discharge won't hurt...especially if theres a long line of cells waiting to be juiced in front
GreenLED, were you using new batteries at the time of this phonmenon?
I'm not sure as to whether theres a self-discharge issue in my M6 but I do notice that every time I have to use the M6 with primaries I would have a dramatic cell imbalance situation on my hands where usually 4 out of 6 will register around 20% to [no click] on the ZTS while 2 [sometimes 1] will register 80%-100% no matter how many times I check it. Could this be the apparent reason your cells "seem" to self discharge?
greenLED
Flashaholic
Yeah, they were fresh Vartas (at least at the time I put them in the light). I remember playing with the M6 here and there, but not more than 5-10 minutes at the most. I then put the light in storage (locked out), and yesterday when I turn it on, it was dim.
Edit to add:
I just read the replies in the old thread. Sounds like a fluke - maybe a bad batch of cells?
Unfortunately I don't have a batt tester to know if one or more cells went south.
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JNewell
Flashlight Enthusiast
I guess I had the last post before the Part 1 thread got locked - wanted to mention that my M6 does not self-discharge but I have a C2 that does. Haven't figured out whether it's the LA or something else - but it does it with the LOTC locked out...
jumpstat
Flashlight Enthusiast
Best production light from SF for power, design and useability period. Cons is just expensive to maintain (battery costs).
Using 3rd party bulbs and/or rechargeable options don't come close to M6 with MN21.....my 0.002 cents.
Using 3rd party bulbs and/or rechargeable options don't come close to M6 with MN21.....my 0.002 cents.
A M6 running on three 17670 li-ion cells (Fivemega adapter) with a WA1185 bulb has about 1200 lumens for 20-25 minutes. Quite a bit brighter than MN21, comparable runtime and guilty-free lumens. No extensions needed.
The downside might be a shorter bulb life - 10-12 hours, but at $6/bulb it's cheap.
I am just completing this setup.
The downside might be a shorter bulb life - 10-12 hours, but at $6/bulb it's cheap.
I am just completing this setup.
I'm curious if you have tried the 6xRCR123's with the LF HO-M6R bulb? I'm investigating all sorts of options for my M6 and that one looks to be (spec wise, I don't have any yet) about exactly equal to the MN21. It's 700 bulb lumens, figure a 30% reduction to convert to SF lumens puts you at 490. It should be just about indistinguishable from the MN21.
I'm in the process of acquiring all sorts of options so I can determine what my personal "favorite" M6 is. I have a feeling I'll probably settle on primaries and the 2x18650 holder currently under development, but I'm also planning to check out the WA1185 on 3x17670's, the MN61 on 3x17670's and possibly the HO-M6R on RCR123's.. So many options, so few M6's and so little $$.
You can use 3x 17670 li-ions to power this setup. Same output but more runtime and less cells to charge.
The brightness of HO-M6R should be somewhere between MN20 and MN21.
It would be brighter than the MN21 for sure....
That lamp is definitely giving those batteries a work out though. I might be close to tripping the protection circuit of the C cells.I used to actually think the LF HO-M6R was a little bit brighter but of course I was wrong. The M6 that I have that bulb in had a shinier reflector with less texture so it was throwing farther. The overall output definitely goes to the MN21 though, which was evident when I switched bulbs and didn't shine the light so far. The MN21 on fresh primaries is probably closer to 750 lumens (500 is an average) so that has to be factored in as well as the different rating systems.
The advantage to the LF set up is the extended runtime about 35-40 minutes and of course guilt free lumens.
You mean with regards to reliability and such? Output wise the 1185 and 5761 are both impressive. The 1111 is respectable too.
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I scored a FM 3x17670 holder on CPFM today, and I got a bi-pin adapter directly (x2 actually, just in case!) from FM last week so I'll defiantly be trying out the 1185 for WOW factor.
I never thought I'd find a 17670 holder...
Now I need to look into a long-runtime option, maybe a 1331 with the 3x17670 or a MN15 with 2x18650 (or god forbid actual primaries!). Decisions Decisions Decisions!
I never thought I'd find a 17670 holder...
Now I need to look into a long-runtime option, maybe a 1331 with the 3x17670 or a MN15 with 2x18650 (or god forbid actual primaries!). Decisions Decisions Decisions!
ttran97
Flashlight Enthusiast
I scored a FM 3x17670 holder on CPFM today, and I got a bi-pin adapter directly (x2 actually, just in case!) from FM last week so I'll defiantly be trying out the 1185 for WOW factor.
I never thought I'd find a 17670 holder...
Now I need to look into a long-runtime option, maybe a 1331 with the 3x17670 or a MN15 with 2x18650 (or god forbid actual primaries!). Decisions Decisions Decisions!
If you want really long runtime, you should contact milkyspit about getting an LED tower module. 5.5 hours of light (roughly 200 lumen) using 6 primaries. Wow!
Chronos' milkyspit LED tower thread
Illum
Flashaholic
You mean with regards to reliability and such? Output wise the 1185 and 5761 are both impressive. The 1111 is respectable too.
The other disadvantage would be the theretical voiding of surefire repair warranty should a 3rd party lamp detonate due to failed envelope integrity in the bezel, thankfully incandescents such as M6 has no electronics to fry from overhead voltages using lithium so there should be little attainable evidence aside from the blown lamp Surefire can use to tell if lithium ions have been used in operation with the light.
Jumpstat, There has been many threads that asks the question: how bright exactly is the MN21 on high? I believe the MN21 might be outputting close to 1000 Lumens on new primaries. The LF-HO-M6R can easily attain beyond the MN21 on occiasions [I dont normally notice this increase while performing outdoor shots. As for indoors, I can only say the LF-HO-M6R has a slightly bigger hotspot.
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adamlau
Flashlight Enthusiast
This is clearly not the case. In terms of output, an M6 + 1111 off 3x17670 takes out an M6 + MN21 off primaries. An M6 + MN61 off 3x17670 beats up on an M6 + MN21 off primaries, as does an M6 + 1185 off 3x17670. In the case of the 1111 and 1185 (and of course, the MN61), shock isolation is retained to some degree.
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Outdoors Fanatic
Flashlight Enthusiast
Just get a R/C Lipo Charger from Tower Hobbies and charge of a bunch a li-ions simultaniously. www.towerhobbies.com
js
Flashlight Enthusiast
greenLED,
If you have a DMM you can check the resistance of your MB20 battery holder. Remove all the cells and put your probes across the holder. You should read megaOhms of resistance. If you read kOhms, then your holder has got an internal short. Make sure not to hold the probes by the plastic handles, BTW. Don't want to add your conductivity in the mix.
Otherwise, I think the most likely explanation is a bad batch of 123's that decided to self-discharge and give up the ghost.
If you have a DMM you can check the resistance of your MB20 battery holder. Remove all the cells and put your probes across the holder. You should read megaOhms of resistance. If you read kOhms, then your holder has got an internal short. Make sure not to hold the probes by the plastic handles, BTW. Don't want to add your conductivity in the mix.
Otherwise, I think the most likely explanation is a bad batch of 123's that decided to self-discharge and give up the ghost.
greenLED
Flashaholic
:thanks: Jim! I'll be checking and reporting back.
My M6 arrived Thursday, but I didn't get to play with it till last night. I took it outside and aimed it at a tree a few yards away (I live in the city) and pushed the button and...:mecry:I was underwhelmed.
I took it back inside and took out the lamp, sure enough it was the MN21. I put the MN20 in there thinking maybe the lamp was old and went back outside. Same beam.:thinking:
Turns out it really does help quite a bit if you use batteries that aren't at 2.3V/cell unloaded. Upon installing new batteries I was greeted by a powerful burst of photons that nearly knocked me backwards into the street! Now that's what I was looking for!
I can't wait to see this once I get the 1185 and 17670 combo running. I'm going to need to buy some more 123's... My "comfortable" inventory level when all I had were 2x cell lights was 36. That's just not going to cut it should there be an emergency with this beast in my hand...
I took it back inside and took out the lamp, sure enough it was the MN21. I put the MN20 in there thinking maybe the lamp was old and went back outside. Same beam.:thinking:
Turns out it really does help quite a bit if you use batteries that aren't at 2.3V/cell unloaded. Upon installing new batteries I was greeted by a powerful burst of photons that nearly knocked me backwards into the street! Now that's what I was looking for!
I can't wait to see this once I get the 1185 and 17670 combo running.
I'm going to need to buy some more 123's... My "comfortable" inventory level when all I had were 2x cell lights was 36. That's just not going to cut it should there be an emergency with this beast in my hand...
