5x C Li-ion and Osram 64440 IRC-50W

[cernobila]

OK, would the above outfit work? From "LuxLuthor's" tables it shows; 21V, 5.5A, 6700 lumens, bulb life 4.8 hours. I admit, not a very practical light but impressive in show and tell......Would this need two clicks to start up?

 

[Aircraft800]

OK, would the above outfit work? From "LuxLuthor's" tables it shows; 21V, 5.5A, 6700 lumens, bulb life 4.8 hours. I admit, not a very practical light but impressive in show and tell......Would this need two clicks to start up?

The Max. Continuous Discharge Rate is 5A, so you may never get it to start with that kind of rush in current, possible with MANY clicks I suppose....

Maybe with some kind of soft start

 

[mudman cj]

AW C cells usually start the 5761, but depending upon the resistance of the particular set up, may require multiple clicks. But this is at about 5.5 Amps. Your proposed configuration would not deliver 21V to the bulb due to voltage sag and losses, so the bulb would only see about 18V and therefore the current would be more like 5.0 Amps. Therefore, it should start up with one click.

Don't take my word for it though. It has been done before.

 

[cernobila]

AW C cells usually start the 5761, but depending upon the resistance of the particular set up, may require multiple clicks. But this is at about 5.5 Amps. Your proposed configuration would not deliver 21V to the bulb due to voltage sag and losses, so the bulb would only see about 18V and therefore the current would be more like 5.0 Amps. Therefore, it should start up with one click.

Don't take my word for it though. It has been done before.

I will most likely use the C Maglite with appropriate extender to fit 5 cells and all fivemega parts required.......even if it would be 18V still would give 4221 lumens to start with. (thanks lux) Has anyone made one of these? I wonder what is the beam quality from the "Osram 64440 IRC-50W" bulb.

 

[ampdude]

I'm thinking a 6C Mag with one of the AW extenders might be the right length.

 

[zehnmm]

OK, would the above outfit work? From "LuxLuthor's" tables it shows; 21V, 5.5A, 6700 lumens, bulb life 4.8 hours. I admit, not a very practical light but impressive in show and tell......Would this need two clicks to start up?

I have done exactly this. How? Mag 4D, with a Modamag D extender, kiu socket, boro lens, FM dual mode reflector, a homemade spacer to make up the distance needed, an 8 1/2 x 11 piece of paper rolled up to generate a simple "holder" of sorts, and of course, 5 of AW C-lions. I will say it did not work all that well, as I had to have multiple clicks to get the light to turn on. It could be that my connections were not totally 100%. Darn light was bright as all get out. I figure that when it was on, I was getting something like in excess of 3000 torch lumens (using the 65% factor) at or near the start, say, with 17.5volts to the bulb; toward the end, at about 15.5 volts, it was still getting an estimated 1990 torch lumens. By the way, while you might get as much as 3.7V per bulb at the start, or 18.5V, that will last only a little bit. 3.1 to 3.5v per battery is what I figure for the c-lions. I agree with mudman cj in that you will not get 21V to the bulb.

I did not do runtimes, but my estimates show about 30 min. of run sequences of 1 to 2 minutes each. I never did do a run over 5 min. and did it ever get hot!

What is interesting about this setup is the computation of lumen hours. At 3000 - 2000 torch lumens, or an overall 2500 avg. over a run sequence, running for 30 min., you get 1250 lumen hours. This is intriguing. Comparisons: ROP low for 1 hr. = 300; ROP hi for 30 min. = 300; M6 with MN15 at 200 lumens for 2.5 hrs. = 500; Mag 64610 at 1300 torch lumens for 23 min. = 571; Mag64623 at 2541 torch lumens for 10 min. = 424.

Have not tried to do any more with this, as I have been satisfied running my 64610 in a 3D+extender with 4x c-li-ions and an AWR hotdriver instead. This setup runs for over 25 min. with 1300 very white torch lumens. Because of the color temp of the 64610 it appears in my eyes to be almost as bright as a 64623 or even the mighty 64625 on 11 AA cells. To be honest, I could not tell the difference between my 50W 64610 beam color and the IRC 50W color. One reason is that the 64610 design spec is temp of 3400, compared to 3000 for the 64440. Even drastically overdriven with 5 cells, the IRC bulb still is a bit less than the 64610 with 4 cells. Moreover the 64610's cost $2.50 each versus the 64440IRC at $8+.

In closing, I should like to say that I am planning my next hotwire indulgence with D-lions in mind. If you could get a max capacity of 5 amps or better out of a D-lion, that means if it can handle 2x loads, or 10amps, the potential is there to run some pretty bright bulbs for at least 20 min. Example: you might be able to get 1 hr. out of a 50w bulb drawing 4.5 - 5.0 amps in a theoretical D-lion setup. This gets really interesting to think about. If all you want is a retina-searing light to run for short bursts (bump in the night, etc.) this could be a very good alternative to $300+ HID lights. As an example, you could configure a 4D setup for $200 - $240, including 4 D-lions. (body, metal reflector, glass lens, 4 batteries, kiu switch mod)

Regards to all.

Steve

 

[LuxLuthor]

OK, would the above outfit work? From "LuxLuthor's" tables it shows; 21V, 5.5A, 6700 lumens, bulb life 4.8 hours. I admit, not a very practical light but impressive in show and tell......Would this need two clicks to start up?

This is the benefit of using an IRC bulb. Because it has that infrared coating to reflect the IR heat back to the filament adding to its "glowing==>lumen output" you can drive this bulb with amps that are right at the AW C Li-Ion PTC cutoff. I'm not sure that all of the PTC's have that extra allowance up to 5.5A Some may cut out at 5.2A....so you will perhaps continue to have tripping off cells, beyond the initial firing up.

Normally that multi-click strategy with AW's Li-Ion PTC is to deal with the initial spike, followed by a running current of <5.3Amps. These types of scenarios are why people use unprotected Li-Ions, or the new safe Emoli, A123 cells.

 

[cernobila]

This is the benefit of using an IRC bulb. Because it has that infrared coating to reflect the IR heat back to the filament adding to its "glowing==>lumen output" you can drive this bulb with amps that are right at the AW C Li-Ion PTC cutoff. I'm not sure that all of the PTC's have that extra allowance up to 5.5A Some may cut out at 5.2A....so you will perhaps continue to have tripping off cells, beyond the initial firing up.

Normally that multi-click strategy with AW's Li-Ion PTC is to deal with the initial spike, followed by a running current of <5.3Amps. These types of scenarios are why people use unprotected Li-Ions, or the new safe Emoli, A123 cells.

Even though this is now theoretical due to the fact that I can't get any C size Li-ions, but if I can in the future, would the "AW's V2 Mag C Incan Driver - Soft Start & Multi-Brightness" unit fix the problem?

 

[mudman cj]

AW's incan driver would allow the C cells to start with one click. So would an AWR hotdriver or JimmyM's NTC softstart. Sometimes all it takes is a bit of resistance, as in undoing resistance mods one at a time.

In support of Lux's comment, I have recently come across some reports of AW C cells that have lower than average startup current limits, so even if this build works for some it may not work for everyone without some sort of extra work/expense.

 

[cernobila]

AW's incan driver would allow the C cells to start with one click. So would an AWR hotdriver or JimmyM's NTC softstart. Sometimes all it takes is a bit of resistance, as in undoing resistance mods one at a time.

In support of Lux's comment, I have recently come across some reports of AW C cells that have lower than average startup current limits, so even if this build works for some it may not work for everyone without some sort of extra work/expense.

From the above mentioned softstart units, other than the AW, which others have the multi-brightness capability. I think this is not a bad idea, would make the light more useful on the lower settings as well as gaining longer run times.