8x12/14 Variable Speed Upgrade?

xl97

Newly Enlightened
Joined
Jun 7, 2009
Messages
22
I have read a few posts about people upgrading their 8x12/14's to a Variable Speed Motor instead of the stock motor option that needs gears to be changed in order to change speeds for different tasks/materials.

I am starting a thread to educate myself on this process more specifically..

focus:
motors people have used & recommend
motor prices

what else is needed for this type of upgrade (controller card?...mounting hardware?)

and other special touches/upgrades that go along with this one to make it a 'finished' project (ie: tach/sensor addition?..RPM readouts?..etc)


I am VERY new.. (just got my first lathe as a matter of fact..and am still setting it up/cleaning it)

so Im not looking to jump the gun...just starting a thread/conversation on the topic.. to see if there is a kit? a how-to (besides just pictures), parts list/prices ..total cost something like this runs

so down the line I'll be better educated and understand when Im ready for this.
 
I have read a few posts about people upgrading their 8x12/14's to a Variable Speed Motor instead of the stock motor option that needs gears to be changed in order to change speeds for different tasks/materials.

I am starting a thread to educate myself on this process more specifically..

focus:
motors people have used & recommend
motor prices

what else is needed for this type of upgrade (controller card?...mounting hardware?)

and other special touches/upgrades that go along with this one to make it a 'finished' project (ie: tach/sensor addition?..RPM readouts?..etc)


I am VERY new.. (just got my first lathe as a matter of fact..and am still setting it up/cleaning it)

so Im not looking to jump the gun...just starting a thread/conversation on the topic.. to see if there is a kit? a how-to (besides just pictures), parts list/prices ..total cost something like this runs

so down the line I'll be better educated and understand when Im ready for this.

Here you go - LOTs of pictures to show you how I did it ;)
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=171871

and

http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=193712


- Motor should be $100 or less on Ebay
- Controller (new) was about $40-50 on Ebay

The other thing I would recommend would be a DRO from Shumatech, Shars, etc..

Will
 
Thanks.. I think I actually emailed you the other day asking about mounting scales....etc

I would like to get a Shumatec DRO.. but seems a little out of my league for now.. but would like to get soem scales mounted.. (no mill to make any brackets though) :(

wanted to do the same as you did for the 12" X axis/bed scale.. and then use a vertical 8" scale to mount for the cross slide.. (but not on chuck side. ;)

but again..not worth buying the scales..until I can either buy a set of mounts or figure out a way to mount them.


back to Variable speed.. your post was actually one of the first I read and made me decide I wanted to do it.. (so thanks)

your motor seemed kind of big (at least to me)..anything closer in size? Im not sure what I need to look for in a motor that will for sure work.

also want controller do I need to get? are there differnt kinds? or a specific one to look for?

mounting scales is my first project.. (outside of figuring out what QTCP to get)..

then variable speed motor.

think this is too much for a noobie? in a year or so.. Id liek to convert to a DIY CNC kit of some kind... anything I need to keep in mind for that?

oh..and Id like to keep the power to a 110/120 hookup. I got no 220 in my garage.. is this possible?

thanks
 
Last edited:
Thanks.. I think I actually emailed you the other day asking about mounting scales....etc

I would like to get a Shumatec DRO.. but seems a little out of my league for now.. but would like to get soem scales mounted.. (no mill to make any brackets though) :(

wanted to do the same as you did for the 12" X axis/bed scale.. and then use a vertical 8" scale to mount for the cross slide.. (but not on chuck side. ;)

but again..not worth buying the scales..until I can either buy a set of mounts or figure out a way to mount them.


back to Variable speed.. your post was actually one of the first I read and made me decide I wanted to do it.. (so thanks)

your motor seemed kind of big (at least to me)..anything closer in size? Im not sure what I need to look for in a motor that will for sure work.

also want controller do I need to get? are there differnt kinds? or a specific one to look for?

mounting scales is my first project.. (outside of figuring out what QTCP to get)..

then variable speed motor.

think this is too much for a noobie? in a year or so.. Id liek to convert to a DIY CNC kit of some kind... anything I need to keep in mind for that?

oh..and Id like to keep the power to a 110/120 hookup. I got no 220 in my garage.. is this possible?

thanks


The KB controllers are made for 110V, 220V, or dual (like the one I bought). If you only have 110V, no problem - just get the 110V controller, and of course, get a 90V DC motor instead of the 180V DC motor that I got. A true 0.5HP to a 1HP DC motor would be perfect - just take your time on Ebay until you can find a good, name brand, USA-made motor. I would prefer the 1HP motor, but here are some 1/2HP motors to consider:

http://cgi.ebay.com/New-Leeson-DC-Motor-C42D17FK1C-1-2-HP-1750-RPM-90-Volt_W0QQitemZ170340836458QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item27a91ae46a&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1205|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50

http://cgi.ebay.com/DAYTON-90-Volt-DC-Motor-2M168D-New-Old-Stock_W0QQitemZ320381084181QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item4a98336215&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1205|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50


For the controller, this is a 220V model, but it gives you an idea of what I used:
http://cgi.ebay.com/KB-Electronics-DC-Motor-Controller-KBMM-225-w-SI-6_W0QQitemZ150351217764QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item2301a18464&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=65%3A12|66%3A2|39%3A1|72%3A1205|240%3A1318|301%3A1|293%3A1|294%3A50

Will
 
Thanks for the parts links..

so a motor about $100 (tops)..maybe even score one for less..

maybe used?
http://cgi.ebay.com/Leeson-1-HP-90-...66:2|39:1|72:1205|240:1318|301:1|293:1|294:50

are their certain things I should look for when motor shopping?

DC
90V

anything else?


As far as the controller board?

things to look for to ensure Im even looking at the correct type?

Input 110v
Does it need to have PWM support? (I see some stating that?)
Does it need to say Reversable?

http://cgi.ebay.com/Reversible-DC-M...66:2|39:1|72:1205|240:1318|301:1|293:1|294:50

seems to be too small to handle 110v input...

maybe this one?
http://cgi.ebay.com/DC-motor-contro...66:2|39:1|72:1205|240:1318|301:0|293:1|294:50


so another $25-$50 for a controller card..

what else is needed? (cost wise)

a pot.. (few bucks).. wire, butt connectors or solder heat shrink..

and some helpful members?? =) LOL
 
The used motor listed should be OK for this application.

Of the controllers listed, the first one is not even close to being adequate (remember the input is 110V AC and the output is 90V DC). The second one might work well - but I don't know enough about this particular controller. The KB that I used was fully featured and allowed you to change the ramp-up, ramp-down speed, output power, etc.

You should use Google and study PWM and DC motor drive before buying anything. Better make sure you know what you are doing before you start wiring things up - 1HP and about 10Amps is nothing to take lightly ;)

Will
 
I understand PWM.. (more or less).. as I have wrote code/program for a custom microcontroller that had PWM support and made a PWM supported LED driver.. so I can pulse/ramp up/down the LED itself..

however that was an LED.. and I wasnt sure the same applied to motors..although I don see why it wouldnt..

I guess I'll get to reading.. and see what I see...

thanks :)
 
Awesome. Just concentrate on the driver/controller side of things. I really can't speak any higher about the KB controller I used - totally awesome, great documentation, etc.. Once you get the controller stuff down, you can then get a matching motor in the right voltage/HP range ;)
 
I'll keep an eye out.. does KB make controllers for 110v?

I'll try and search around.. Thanks..

on aside note I finally ordered my QCTP today.. a AxA from LMS.. with a modified compound rest top..

doesnt need any specially machined tool holders is what they said...

but couldnt say 100% that 1/2" tools would center up with it..

but I figure I could use what Ive ordered..and then get a few modified tool holders from lathe master for any/all 1/2' tools?


thoughts?

</ derail > lol
 
I'll keep an eye out.. does KB make controllers for 110v?
Yes, they do, as well as the dual voltage units (like the one I got).



on aside note I finally ordered my QCTP today.. a AxA from LMS.. with a modified compound rest top..

doesnt need any specially machined tool holders is what they said...

but couldnt say 100% that 1/2" tools would center up with it..

but I figure I could use what Ive ordered..and then get a few modified tool holders from lathe master for any/all 1/2' tools?


thoughts?
Don't worry about getting everything perfect on the initial set of tools. Getting the lathe was the easy and "cheap" part. The tooling part of the expenses will never end ;)
 
yeah, as with all hobbies.. the 'fun' never ends.. the more you learn the more you want to do... the more a project costs..LOL

once my tools come in...

its variable speed motor and scale mounting.. and Im done for a while. :)
 
noob alert:

being that Im electronics challenged..

Im assuming I should stay away from any motors that say 3 phase on them?

I have still been kicking around the idea of getting that used one..

but, it being used doesnt give me 100% piece of mind..

and you stated 'OK' in capitals.. as if saying..'meh'.. LOL

what about something from HF:
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=2729
(maybe RPM not fast enough?)

or this/
http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=2098
(2HP too much?)

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/displayitem.taf?Itemnumber=4113
(maybe smaller footprint?)

found some used ones in my area..for $15 bucks! lol

http://milwaukee.craigslist.org/ele/1212290984.html


for a controller board, I found this:

http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2669

thoughts?


thanks
 
Last edited:
The KB controller for a 90V DC motor is the right one, and it is good that it includes a power resistor since that is what sets the power level. Unfortunately the description does not say that power setting the resistor is for, so it might likely be too small - you will then need to buy the right value to match the HP of your motor.

We have been talking about a DC motor and DC controller, but every motor you showed is an AC motor, not the DC motor that we are talking about using for your project. Now, you can also implement the variable speed with a 3 Phase AC motor and a VFD controller, but you would typically need at least 220V AC input. The 3-PH/VFD is definitely a much nicer setup, but also more expensive - I would recommend that you stay with the 90V DC motor and 120V AC controller instead.
 
ahh...thanks I didnt even catch that.. (doh)

so controller good (if I had to buy a new one).. but possibly have to replace the resistor.. (shouldnt be that big of a deal to something like that though)..

I did read it said 350w motors....but nothing about HP..

still keeping my eye out for a cheap new motor.. one of these weeks..I'll find something on ebay. :)
 
hey wquiles-

I happened to be surfing the net for a motor/controller again today (havent re-visited this since last time I posted)

and I ran across this:

http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1967

I was wondering if you could check it out..tell me what you think?

that link is for both the motor and controller

motor alone is this link:

http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=1803


but I cant seem to find anything on what HP is it?
Voltage Current: 90V DC & 0.4A
RPM's: 2000
Reversibility: Reversible

Im not sure what spindle shaft LENGTH should be..or what spindle shaft OD should be

and again..here is link to the controller alone:
http://www.batteryspace.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=2669

it does say this though:
It is suitable for 90VDC motor up to 350W

which I think i 'good'.. optional 115/230 (I need 115)

Item# KBIC-240DS - DRIVE, DC, 120/240VAC, 12A, CHASSIS, 1HP/12A W/HEATSINK, 0.5HP/6A W/O, HEATSINK, 90VDC ARM, E2, 9423
KBIC Series Information

  • 1/100~3 Horsepower
  • 110 or 240 VAC Input
  • Non-Regenerative
  • Chassis (IP00) Type
  • UL, cUL Approvals

controller may be kinda pricey...compared to others/other places?

just cant seem to find a decent motor.. that isnt hundreds of dollars..

tried looking for a Baldor or Leeson 3/4 or 1HP 90v DC perm mag. motor..
 
The controller seems to be the right one for this 90V DC variable speed upgrade. Note that that is basically the same controller that I used, and that you will need to get the correct HP power resistor to match the intended/actual HP of the motor you will be using.

The motor is WAY too small for the job. You need something closer to a 1HP motor. Best to keep looking until you can find a suitable motor, rather than buying too small a motor and have to do it all over again with the "right" motor.
 
Thanks..

I figured the motor was no good.. as it was only listed brand new for about $45 bucks..

but I couldnt find any spec on the HP of the motor.

oh well...

I guess I'll keep my eyes open..and keep surfing ebay every now & again. :)

if there a housing size that is best? also what about the spindle? threaded? keyed? size both length and OD?

thanks
 
Just remember, volts multiplied by amps = watts. 745 watts = 1 hp.

Yeah, there are other things that go into the equation, but that's good enough for ballpark work

A .45 amp motor at 90 volts is only 40 watts, or 1/20 hp. You will want one that draws about 8 amps at 90 volts.

:)

Dan
 
if there a housing size that is best? also what about the spindle? threaded? keyed? size both length and OD?
There is no simple answer for that, since whatever you get you will have to "fit" it to your lathe, and you will likely need a new pulley anyway to fit the new motor (I was able to modify the old one to fit the new motor). The motor mount I was able to bent the old one, so I got lucky on both counts. You just have to basically get the motor and then figure out how to get it "in there". Sounds hard, but it should be fine ;)
 
Top