Any 2xCR2 lights on way?

[Swedpat]

Because of the introducing of these different nice CR2 lights I wondered about how it would be with a 2xCR2 light. I think it would be a very interesting configuration, especially with the new high effiency LEDs available today.
Imagine for example a Fenix TK12 or Olight M20 but in a smaller package. I find such a flashlight attractive. Anyone heard about if there is any 2XCR2 light on way?

Regards, Patric

 

[daf3m]

Have you ever used two cr2+spacer into a TK12 on max?get yourself 30 min of runtime.How acceptable can this be?Flashlights must be dealt like tools and not toys.

 

[Ragiska]

coleman makes a 2xcr2 light.

but if you really want such a form factor, 1xAA is already just about it.

14500 or AA is a tad thinner and a hair shorter than 2xcr2

 

[Swedpat]

Have you ever used two cr2+spacer into a TK12 on max?get yourself 30 min of runtime.How acceptable can this be?Flashlights must be dealt like tools and not toys.

Using two CR2 you will get far more than 30 minutes regulated runtime at for example 200lm with the newer LEDs. I don't understand what you mean with considering that as a toy. In this case the singel CR2 lights also are toys. Quark Mini CR2 actually provides 40 minutes at 180lm. A 2xCR2 "tactical" light at 180lm for 80minutes I would like.

coleman makes a 2xcr2 light.

but if you really want such a form factor, 1xAA is already just about it.

14500 or AA is a tad thinner and a hair shorter than 2xcr2

Compared to the best 1xAA 14500 two CR2 still has much more energy. And the CR2 are available as primaries. It will be slightly longer but I think a 2xCR2 light can be an interesting alternative anyway.
I Will take a look at that Coleman.

Regards, Patric

 

[daf3m]

Using two CR2 you will get far more than 30 minutes regulated runtime at for example 200lm with the newer LEDs. I don't understand what you mean with considering that as a toy. In this case the singel CR2 lights also are toys. Quark Mini CR2 actually provides 40 minutes at 180lm. A 2xCR2 "tactical" light at 180lm for 80minutes I would like.

My PD20 Q5 runs for 40 minutes on a single cr2.It's a 3 watt small head/reflector flashlight ,and nothing more.Far away from "tactical".
On the other hand my TK11 R2 is more "tactical" for 3 reasons: better throw due to 5 watt led ,bigger head/reflector and more running time.Not to mention that its size is perfect for an average human palm.
CR2 is about 500mh (i think-edit:750 ,1/2 of cr123s).Using two CR2 instead of CR123 you get not more 40 minutes of runtime.If this was a toy ,it would be a decent runtime.But tacticals are not toys..they are tools.

 

[papajoe]

I have the Coleman 2CR2 Max (Walmart - $24). I'm pleased. Actually, I want another one and can't find it locally, I may have to order it online as I suspect they're being dropped from inventory. Joe-Public doesn't understand CR2 batteries and doesn't like the price.

The 2CR2 Max is well built, good beam, the tail switch feels solid, etc. It could be said that this lamp is a budget light, but, on the other hand, there aren't many available 2CR2s, eh? I'd buy another, in fact, I'm gonna . . .

:thumbsup: Joe

 

[Swedpat]

My PD20 Q5 runs for 40 minutes on a single cr2.It's a 3 watt small head/reflector flashlight ,and nothing more.Far away from "tactical".
On the other hand my TK11 R2 is more "tactical" for 3 reasons: better throw due to 5 watt led ,bigger head/reflector and more running time.Not to mention that its size is perfect for an average human palm.
CR2 is about 500mh (i think-edit:750 ,1/2 of cr123s).Using two CR2 instead of CR123 you get not more 40 minutes of runtime.If this was a toy ,it would be a decent runtime.But tacticals are not toys..they are tools.

4Sevens CR2 are stated at 900mAh which is 60% of CR123. According to the runtime of a 2xCR123 light with 90min runtime it would be 54 minutes. But the later LEDs have a significantly better effiency. I have not measured the runtime of my Quark MiniCR2 but it's claimed for 40 minutes. That will be corresponding to 80 minutes for the same output using 2cells.
Tactical or not, I don't want to define a "true" flashlight after it's runtime or size. If Quark Mini CR2 isn't a toy (I don't think it has to be, though ALL flashlights more or less are for a flashoholic) a 2xCR2 light will not be either because the only reason that it is a 2xCR2 light.

Regards, Patric

 

[Ragiska]

Using two CR2 you will get far more than 30 minutes regulated runtime at for example 200lm with the newer LEDs. I don't understand what you mean with considering that as a toy. In this case the singel CR2 lights also are toys. Quark Mini CR2 actually provides 40 minutes at 180lm. A 2xCR2 "tactical" light at 180lm for 80minutes I would like.




Compared to the best 1xAA 14500 two CR2 still has much more energy. And the CR2 are available as primaries. It will be slightly longer but I think a 2xCR2 light can be an interesting alternative anyway.
I Will take a look at that Coleman.

Regards, Patric

1x14500 will stomp any 2x15270's, and primary 3v cells do exist in AA size.

cr2's really suck for power density vs other cells. their only real benefit is when 1xcr123 is a tad to big and you want even smaller. going bigger makes no sense, especially when there are other choices FAR better suited for the same size.

 

[Swedpat]

1x14500 will stomp any 2x15270's, and primary 3v cells do exist in AA size.

cr2's really suck for power density vs other cells. their only real benefit is when 1xcr123 is a tad to big and you want even smaller. going bigger makes no sense, especially when there are other choices FAR better suited for the same size.

I don't know about 15270, only thing I can refer to is the common AA and 14500, according to what I read one of these cannot reach the energy level of two CR2 cells. When I compare the size of my 4Sevens CR2 to the CR123 I think that the energy dense is equal.
Anyway I think rejecting 2xCR2 lights because of AA/14500/15270 is like rejecting 2xCR123 lights because of the possibilty of 18650. Or?

Regards, Patric

 

[Ragiska]

the casing size is set, so two smaller cells vs one larger cell of the same volume, the larger will have a superior energy density since less space is taken up by packaging.

any way you look at it, 1xcr2 excels in ONE category: size. if you want two of them, it excels in NOTHING. it's virtually the same size as 1xAA, which in respective chemistries, will outdo 2xcr2 in EVERY category, and still offer the greater versitility of beig able to run a common cell size and chemistry if desired.

 

[Swedpat]

the casing size is set, so two smaller cells vs one larger cell of the same volume, the larger will have a superior energy density since less space is taken up by packaging.

any way you look at it, 1xcr2 excels in ONE category: size. if you want two of them, it excels in NOTHING. it's virtually the same size as 1xAA, which in respective chemistries, will outdo 2xcr2 in EVERY category, and still offer the greater versitility of beig able to run a common cell size and chemistry if desired.

I compared two of 4Sevens CR2 to one Duracell NiMh 2650mAh AA cell. Together the CR2 cells are ca 4mm longer than one AA cell. According to the stated information two CR2 together contains ca 70% more energy than the Duracell NiMh cell. I don't find this bad energy dense. What would be better choice if one want primaries?
Alkalines will not work good at high drain, and though lithium 1,5V AA will, the voltage is too low. Or am I wrong?

 

[Ragiska]

short answer, you're wrong. even an L91 has more than 2xcr2's, and a cv3 cell even more. remember, the smaller the cell, the less it can deliver under an equivalant load vs a larger cell of the same type.

both high cap nimh and 14500 both store more energy then 2x15270's, even being slightly smaller.

I'll say it again, there is ZERO benefit in the 2xcr2 size. you'll have an 1xaa sized light with less power and runtime, and less than half the power type options.

if you really want a 2xcr2 sized mini type light, get the AA mini and use a 14500.

 

[Swedpat]

Hi again,

Just a list of specs I found of these batteries:

1x14500: 0,9Ahx3,7V=3,33Wh
2x15270: 2x0,8Ahx3V=4,8Wh
2xCR2: 2x0,9Ahx3V=5,4Wh

Are these specifications faulse?

Or are you saying that despite the higher Wh of the 15270 and CR2 options they cannot provide the same current as one 14500 battery, and still cannot put out the brightness as one 14500?

About primary 14500, can you recommened a dealer?

Regards, Patric

 

[Ragiska]

at the loads we are talking about, yes, those numbers are incorrect.

edit:
2x15270 is closer to 3Wh at best, 2.2Wh on high mode
2xCR2 is closer to 3-3.8Wh
a split crv3 cell (AA sized CR123 type cell, 14500 primary) is 3.5-4.5Wh

 

[Illum]

1x14500: 0,9Ahx3,7V=3,33Wh
2x15270: 2x0,8Ahx3V=4,8Wh
2xCR2: 2x0,9Ahx3V=5,4Wh

Assuming AW protected 14500s, that would be 0.75AH, dunno about 15270, CR2s, while being 0.9AH will sag at the current levels needed...due to their capacity they may exhibit voltage sagging more dramatic than its cr123A brother. Generally speaking using OCV as the basis to determine capacity is nice, but be prepared to realize that the actual runtime will always be shorter than projected runtime before loss during conversion

EDIT: Ragiska's got it

 

[Swedpat]

Thanks for the info!
Well, I understand that may be the explanation there are no 2CR2 lights offered by Fenixstore/4Sevens.

 

[papajoe]

You know, when I posted above about the Coleman 2CR2 Max, I hinted to its low sales figures. In fact, I think Coleman has pulled it out of inventory as well.

This post has confirmed what I had previously suspected - the CR2 is a.......well, to be blunt......the CR2 is a loser.

I love this forum. Thanks for the worthwhile debate and excellent information. lovecpf

PS I'm keeping flashlight

 

[Wiggle]

Anyway I think rejecting 2xCR2 lights because of AA/14500/15270 is like rejecting 2xCR123 lights because of the possibilty of 18650. Or?

Regards, Patric

CR123 x 2 is not completely replaceable by 18650 cause there are no (that I know of) primary cells in 18650 format. The closest I've heard of is 2 x CR123 in a fancy wrapper. AA is a ridiculously common primary cell which also has very respectable rechargeable options. The only advantage I could see to CR2 is that buck circuits are usually more efficient than boost circuits and thus there could be better efficiency than 1 x AA.

 

[Let It Bleed]

If there are any 3v AA size primary lithium batteries, I would be interested in that. Seriously, I've wondered why they can't or won't make 3v lithiums in all the common sizes. I know one reason is num-nuts using them in the wrong application. But if they gave it a completely new name and didn't put AA anywhere on the package, I would think the problem would be mostly avoided. There will always be some people who will find creative ways of being stupid.

I think the 2xCR2 has some merit. There are many who want nothing to do with li-ions. Therefore if 14500 cells are taken out of the equation, I would think 6v instead of 1.2v - 1.7v might appeal to many. If CR2 and 123 are the only 3v lithium primary cells out there, then I would like one. I use li-ions, including 14500, but I also have more flashlights in more formats than I actually need. Plus if it would also run on RCR2, then all the better.

Granted I don't know all the technical specs of different batteries and how they perform in particular formats, but I don't see why 2 x CR2 would be useless. The CR2 does seem to have gained in popularity recently, so who knows. :duh2:

 

[Ragiska]

If there are any 3v AA size primary lithium batteries, I would be interested in that. Seriously, I've wondered why they can't or won't make 3v lithiums in all the common sizes. I know one reason is num-nuts using them in the wrong application. But if they gave it a completely new name and didn't put AA anywhere on the package, I would think the problem would be mostly avoided. There will always be some people who will find creative ways of being stupid.

they do, try reading this thread, posts 8, 12, 14