Anybody reprogram their sleeping habits?

[geepondy]

Here I am still up at 11:00 pm and know it'll be probably at least close to an hour before I go to sleep, yet one way or another, I'll have to be out of bed by 6:30 a.m. I know it won't be easy and possible require multiple hits on the snooze button on the alarm clock. I guess I would classify myself as a night person.

I think at one point I was a day person but I don't remember when. I recall in high school despite no longer having a bedtime curfew of being dead tired by 9:30 and then sleeping like a baby. I think working 15 plus years at second shift turned me into a night person and now despite working days for seven years, can't quite completely get back into the swing. I'll come home from work, dead to the world but gradually revive as the night goes on. Then I'll go to sleep late, have a hard time getting up, somehow make it thru the work day with help of coffee and it's a repeating five day cycle with copious amounts of sleep during the weekend. My health is relatively ok but I gotta think this isn't a healthy lifestyle.

I hear of people being called night people or day people but wondered if anybody has successfully programmed themselves to switch.

 

[jtr1962]

Since your body naturally tends to shift about one hour later each day, the only way to really do it is to go without sleep one night every three weeks or so. Pick a day when you're off the next day, stay up all night, and go to sleep the next day whenever you start feeling tired (but not before maybe 8 or 9). This kind of jump starts your body into a time shift. The problem is long term if you're a night person you'll shift back to your old schedule.

The problem isn't you. It's your schedule. Even in grade school I never could adjust to a day schedule no matter what I did. I'd feel burnt out by the weekend. To be able to get up 6:30 while getting 8 hours sleep requires being sound asleep at 10:30 PM. To me going to bed anytime before 1 or 2 AM never seemed natural. In fact, left to my own devices I go to sleep around sunrise and wake about 2 or 3 in the afternoon. To give an idea of how hard it is for a night person to adjust to a day schedule, all day people need do is visualize having to wake up at maybe 1AM each day. This is probably the dead middle of the night for day people (i.e. those who can happily wake at 5 or 6 AM). Let them do that for a few weeks and see if they sympathize a bit to what people like you or I go through on day shifts.

And no, waking at a time when your body tells you to sleep is not a healthy lifestyle. In fact, the whole idea of shift work isn't healthy but that's another topic entirely. Is there any way at all you can get back on a late shift? Seeing that late shifts tend to be unpopular anyway I can't imagine that it would be a problem. Tell your employer your health AND more importantly your productivity are being affected. The later is no lie. When I was on a day shift repairing taximeters I might fix four or five meters in the time from 8AM to 1PM. After returning from lunch at 1:30PM, I often fixed eight to ten meters in the last 3 hours of the workday. That's about 3 times the productivity of my morning hours. On the plus side my horrible morning productivity usually meant regular overtime.

 

[Carabidae]

I know how you feel, I would consider myself a night person because I naturally tend to stay up late, but I enjoy having that time for myself, so I make myself a day person. Currently I work days 3 days a week and nights 2 days a week and it's tough to go back and forth, but in the past I went from night shift to day shift and it can be tough. I found several things that help. One thing is exercise, especially lifting, but exercise in general. Your body wants to rest to rebuild especially from lifting and I found myself sleeping like a baby, but I'm sure aerobics helps too. Another thing that might help to get to sleep is reading in bed, it worked against me in college, but now it helps me wind down and get sleepy. One important thing is the caffeine. Caffeine has a half life of 6 hours, so try to only drink it in the morning and try to stay away from coffee, tea, or sodas after say 3pm. If I drink a soda after 6pm, it will keep me up late. I think one of the important things is maintaining a constant bed time and wake time regardless of the day of week, but let me know if you figure out how to do this, because for the life of me, I can't not stay up late weekends and not sleep in either. I like to go out too much and do to many things on the weekends. Like jtr1962 said you also have to get about 8 hours of sleep, average for a person is 7-8 hours, sometimes more and sometimes less, but everyone's different. I guess you just have to see what works for you. Good luck

 

[greenlight]

If you can't sleep enough at night you NEED a nap. I sleep about 4 hrs at night, a couple more if I'm lucky. I'm awake at the crack of dawn regardless of the time I went to sleep. I don't know if I've ever slept past 7 am. I even put blackout curtains up to help me get a couple extra hours of sleep. It helped for a while but I took them down and now I get up early again.

My problem stems from years of working at night and trying to get some rest before the next night shift. I didn't handle it well, and now that I don't do it as often I'm suffering from the forced time acclimation

If you're lucky you can figure out your 'natural' time schedule and try to conform to that.

 

[LuxLuthor]

Use drugs to reprogram. World travelers deal with it all the time. :kiss:

 

[LEDninja]

When CPF was slow last 2 years, I discovered there were the least # of people on between 3 and 6 AM EST. I went to sleep early 7pm right after the early evening news. Usually I wake up around 4 AM and browse CPF until the sun comes up or CPF starts to slow down.
Now that CPF is fast again the hours I sleep are all over the place.

For me a sluggish CPF promotes a regular if oddball sleeping schedule. Ahh the bad old days!

 

[bitslammer]

Ambien or Lunestra folllowed by Provigil. Big Pharma has all the answers.

Really if you listen to the commercial you will have to answer yes to the questions: "Do you ever have trouble...." or "If you ever feel ..."

 

[LuxLuthor]

For some people, Melatonin works, for others 50-100mg of Benadryl. If those don't then various prescription(s) will kick your *** right into the next dimension of unconsciousness.

 

[jnj1033]

I also have difficulty sleeping from time to time. Exercise and optimal timing of caffeine intake have been mentioned and are good suggestions. I can't comment on chemical sleep aids, as I've never tried them. They might be worth considering. Here are some other things that work for me:

It is difficult for me to sleep if my mind is too "wound up." The internet is way too stimulating for me. So are novels; I've stayed up all night reading before. YMMV. You need to find an activity that you enjoy, but which is relaxing and will help you unwind. Mine is Solitaire, Scrabble or Monopoly on my Pocket PC. Ideally, you should go to bed up to 30-60 minutes before you want to be asleep, and do your relaxing activity, which you can put aside when your eyelids start to get heavy.

I have certain deep breathing relaxation techniques I do, similar to the way people breathe in yoga. You inhale slowly and deeply through your nose, filling your lungs as much as possible. When you exhale, do it slowly and completely. You may not need to inhale again right away; I find it very relaxing to wait a few seconds between breaths until I need to breathe. I don't torture myself; I just wait until my body decides it's time for more air.

Once you've become aware of your breathing, try this: Each time you exhale, pick a part of your body to become aware of. Spend one or two breaths on the top of your head, then move to your face, then your neck and shoulders, and so on until you have reached your toes. Just by thinking about each of the muscle areas in your body, you will become aware of tension you didn't even know you had, and as you become aware of it, you can let it "drain away." Take your time and enjoy this; it's amazing how much you can unwind and relax this way.

I also have a mental exercise I do to literally "bore" myself to sleep. It's similar to the way a boring lecture or sermon tends to put people to sleep. PM me if you want and I'll explain it.

I learned in a psychology class about one study where people were isolated from regular day/night cycles, i.e., no sunlight. They got to sleep when they felt like it and wake when they felt like it, and control the all the lights in their individual environments. The idea was to find out what kind of day/night cycle the human body prefers. Interestingly, after about two weeks of adjustment, most of the people in the study were on a 25 hour day/night cycle.

Also, being a "day" or "night" person has been linked to biological factors, like chemicals cycles in the brain. A lot of night people force themselves to be day people in order to be in sync with the rest of the world, but they are less efficient than they would be if they could do what is natural for them.

Good luck adjusting.

 

[js]

geepondy,

I so, so feel your pain! I too am naturally a night person. And I specifically have requested 2nd shift here at the accelerator, which is 4 pm to midnight. That's such a great shift to work.

Unfortunately, even if I am working an evening rotation, there are some day shifts in front of the 7 or 8 evening shifts, and sometimes I get stuck with the day shift 10 days in a row, in a day rotation. I actually think I now prefer the graveyard rotation to the day now, because at least that is 10 graveyards in a row, and then I do another 10 after 4 days off, so I get into a groove and get pretty good sleep and have amazing dreams to boot.

Anyway, lately it's been harder than ever for me to get up at 7 am. One day I felt literally sick, like as sick as if I had a bad flu or something, only with no flu symptoms. It was terrible. The worst wakeup experience ever.

What can be done? Well, if it were me, and I were stuck on the day shift forever, I would . . . (sit down, this suggestion is going to be very painful) . . .

. . . wait for it . . .

give up coffee.

OUCH! I know, I know, it's an impractical suggestion probably. But honestly, if you go off caffine you will sleep better, and earlier, and waking up early will be more manageable, if still very unpleasant. I actually did this once and it worked for me, but that was back before I started having to work about a month of graveyards every 3 months. I need coffee to allow me to transition from days or evenings to graveyards. It makes it SO much easier. Plus, I just love coffee. I love the taste of it. I love the smell of it. I love the effect of it. Love it.

So, assuming you don't want to give up coffee, the next most effective approach is to take a siesta. When you get home, go to bed. Sleep as long as you like. If you're like me, this will turn out to be about an hour. Then stay up to your normal 1 AM or so. An afternoon nap should make getting up earlier easier.

Other ideas are the following:

1. EAT BREAKFAST. Eat a real breakfast, not just coffee and pastry, but eggs and fruit and bread and so on. And take a multivitamin, or a B-complex.

2. Force yourself into a regular schedule. Go to bed and wake up at the same time no matter what. This will help.

3. DON'T EAT BEFORE BED. Don't even eat 1 or 2 hours before bed. Go to bed on an empty stomach.

4. Don't hit the snooze button multiple times. Put the alarm clock on the other side of the room and FORCE yourself to get up at the first alarm. Believe it or not, long term, this will help.

5. EXERCISE. Make sure to get regular exercise. It will help you sleep better.

And, for those times when you need something more to help you sleep, melatonin works very well for some people. Or chamomile tea, or even better (in my case) thyme tea, maybe with some sage added even. Not the most pleasant tea, but not bad, and it works.

Honestly though, I like jtr's suggestion best of all: get off the day shift. Make a change. You're not a morning person! And forcing yourself to be one is just plain going to be unpleasant even in the best of cases.

My mother can't understand why I dislike getting up so early. She, and many others, just don't effing GET IT. It's not that I'm a lazy slug who just needs to discipline himself. Screw that. I attended the GD U.S. Airforce Academy for a while. I know what discipline and getting up early is all about. And there have been other times in my life when my job required me to be a day person. I did what I needed to do. I followed a discipline. And, hey, getting up early still SUCKED.

I laughed out loud when I read jtr's suggestion that these people should try getting up at, say, 1 AM time and time again and see how that effing feels.

It's so funny too, 'cause one of the things my mom can't get over is that I don't really mind the graveyard shifts. And it's pretty easy for me to switch my schedule around to stay up all night. I just drink 20 oz. of coffee at 11 PM and listen to music and it's not that hard. Then I just go to bed at 8:30 AM when I get home and sleep till about 3 or 4 PM. I can do that. Because I do have willpower and discipline. That was never the issue.

The simple fact is that I AM NOT A MORNING PERSON. Period.

And neither are you, geepondy. Get off the damn day shift if you can at all manage it.

Good luck, and keep us informed!

 

[Monocrom]

I've always been a night person. At one point, I wrote all of my High School papers starting at 11pm. And often finishing by 3am.

There's definitely an internal clock everyone has that controls one's Sleep / Wake cycle. And when you work 2nd Shift or especially 3rd Shift, that clock gets all F-ed up!

I speak from experience. My last job was 3rd Shift, and so is my current one. Been working 3rd Shift for over a year now. Most days, I'm exhausted by the time I get to work. It's gotten to the point where I often take a nap during my break. When I wake up from it, my body often times will mildly shake all over. (That can't be good). Over the weekend, I go to bed at a normal time. But that usually means I'm awake for about 28 hours straight before going to bed Friday night.

There's a reason why those who work 3rd Shift typically get paid a bit more than equivalent Morning Shift employees. But the compensation just isn't worth it, and typically is quite small. I'm using my 3rd Shift job as a stepping stone for a better one, within the company. That's the only reason I haven't quit.

But yeah.... Human beings were never meant to work the Night Shift on a regular basis.

 

[PhotonBoy]

Exercise is the best solution to your problem.

However, in a situation where I need to desperately get some sleep, I take a couple of AC&C tablets (generic brand) which are also called 222's. Unfortunately, I think these are only available in Canada and other countries outside the US. These contain codeine, caffeine and ASA (aspirin). They're commonly used for back pain, toothaches, minor surgery, severe headaches, etc.

They are available over the counter, but you need to ask the pharmacist for them. They usually ask you: "Have you taken these before?" Answer: "Oh yes, no problem."

Some people are allergic to codeine, so take only 1/2 a tablet to start; if you have a reaction, don't take any more.

Within 15 - 45 minutes of taking a couple, you can confidently crash and sleep like a baby for about 4 - 6 hours.

You should practice restraint using these - they contain aspirin, so you can do your stomach a lot of damage (through bleeding) if you take them too often.

From wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Codeine

"In Canada, codeine can only be sold over the counter in combination with 2 or more ingredients, which has resulted in the prevalence of AC&C (aspirin, codeine, and caffeine), and similar combinations using acetaminophen (paracetamol) rather than aspirin."

 

[cave dave]

I had a professor once who did reasearch on jetlag and he said one of the most important things to reset your internal clock is your eating times.

So along with sleeping on a regular schedule you should eat on a regular schedule too. If you want to shift an hour shift your eating too.

Also the bedroom should only be used for sleep and sex. No TV, no reading, no computer in there, nothing that stimulates the brain.

 

[MedusaOblongata]

The problem isn't you. It's your schedule. Even in grade school I never could adjust to a day schedule no matter what I did. I'd feel burnt out by the weekend. To be able to get up 6:30 while getting 8 hours sleep requires being sound asleep at 10:30 PM. To me going to bed anytime before 1 or 2 AM never seemed natural. In fact, left to my own devices I go to sleep around sunrise and wake about 2 or 3 in the afternoon.

This is me exactly, always has been. I don't feel energetic or productive until it gets dark, regardless of the time I wake up. I don't feel tired at night until 4am or later, regardless of the time I woke up, or how much sleep I've had. I am never ready to wake up before noon, regardless of how long ago I went to sleep. I've been fighting my body to conform to the rest of the world's schedule ever since I started going to school as a little kid, and have never had much success.

When I was in college I refused to sign up for any class that started before noon. Now I work for a law firm and, even though I got them to allow me to work 10am-7pm (rather than 8am-5pm like everyone else), it's still hard, and I'm late a lot, as I always have been in the mornings.

I've tried multiple alarm clocks set at slightly different times in different parts of the room, setting the clock ahead, and anything else I can think of. Nothing seems to make much of a difference.

And for me, this is a chemical free phenomenon. No significant alcohol, caffeine, sleeping pills, etc.

I haven't been able to find a night job that pays well at all. It's all gas stations, security guards, convenience stores, etc.

I wish I had an answer. Instead I've got a problem.

 

[woodrow]

I feel you pain. I have always been a night person. Its even worse when you go to church and a uninformed minister quotes how Jesus got up early in the morning to pray. I just wish they would flip over a few more pages and read how He also prayed through the night. They rarely mention that though.

Good luck. Besides a rubber mallet to the back of the head, I know of no good way to really change my sleep schedule...its 2:15am now:sigh:

 

[geepondy]

I heard on the radio this weekend that daytime/nighttime living habits may be gene related but I forgot the source.

If I could just sleep thru the night when I do fall asleep I'd be better off instead as I've posted before I'll often wake up in the middle of the night and staying awake from anywhere from a half an hour or sometimes the remainder of the night.

 

[richpalm]

Been a night person ever since I was born... I get tired when it gets light out. When the birds start singing the circuit breaker in my head trips and off to bed.

I do my best between 2300-0400. Any old radio restoring, flashlight mods, computer work, etc. get done the best during the night. I like the quiet and most of all, no interruptions.

I'm not working any more but when I did, night shift was the best thing that ever happened to me.

Rich