Calling all appliance experts: Is this a good refrigerator?

[LukeA]

yes, but...I already mentioned what the advantages of gas are...so just want to add you can probably cut the cost in half by; running it in a lower temperature place, and using a smaller model, btw when I got mine several years ago, when they were cheaper with no icemakers or lights, the next couple smaller models used the exact same cooling units, and where I am I have to keep the temp control turned way up to keep the milk from icing most of the time..which makes the smaller units excellent for 90F plus climates.
and yup I have a co2 monitor, the gas range and oven burn far more gas than a fridge though ..( it never has registered anything above 0 ppm..)

None of those compromises are acceptable for this scenario.

I hope you mean a CO meter. A CO2 meter would be fairly useless...

 

[BB]

By the way, CO (carbon monoxide) alarms need to be replaced about every 5 years... The majority of the sensors are basically a battery who's output voltage in proportion of CO present in the air.

What it the typical carbon monoxide detector life? How long will a CO alarm last?

A First Alert® carbon monoxide detector life span is warranted for 5 years. After 5 years any detector should be replaced with a new CO Alarm. Alarms may have an actual life span that is shorter due to environmental conditions and may need to be replaced sooner. Test them weekly and if a problem arises while still under warranty, please call for a replacement. Batteries should be replaced as needed for those alarms requiring them.

From the always reliable Wikipedia:

There are three types of sensors available and they vary in cost, accuracy and speed of response.[5] All three types of sensor elements typically last from 3 to 5 years. At least one CO detector is available which includes a battery and sensor in a replaceable module. Most CO detectors do not have replaceable sensors.
...
Biomimetic
A biomimetic (chem-optical or gel cell) sensor works with a form of synthetic hemoglobin which darkens in the presence of CO, and lightens without it. This can either be seen directly or connected to a light sensor and alarm.

Electrochemical
A type of fuel cell that instead of being designed to produce power, is designed to produce a current that is precisely related to the amount of the target gas (in this case carbon monoxide) in the atmosphere. Measurement of the current gives a measure of the concentration of carbon monoxide in the atmosphere. Essentially the electrochemical cell consists of a container, 2 electrodes, connection wires and an electrolyte - typically sulfuric acid. Carbon monoxide is oxidised at one electrode to carbon dioxide whilst oxygen is consumed at the other electrode. For carbon monoxide detection, the electrochemical cell has advantages over other technologies in that it has a highly accurate and linear output to carbon monoxide concentration, requires minimal power as it is operated at room temperature, and has a long lifetime (typically commercial available cells now have lifetimes of 5 years or greater). Until recently, the cost of these cells and concerns about their long term reliability had limited uptake of this technology in the marketplace, although these concerns are now largely overcome.

Semiconductor
Thin wires of the semiconductor tin dioxide on an insulating ceramic base provide a sensor monitored by an integrated circuit. CO reduces resistance and so allows a greater current which if high enough will lead to the monitor triggering an alarm. The power demands of this sensor means that these devices can only be mains powered.

And here is more than you will ever want to know about CO detectors (lots of good information--except useful stuff like brand name / model of detectors that failed testing). From the long PDF file (free to download):

The final period is that in which the detectors literally "wear-out". The causes of wear-out are numerous, including sensor drift, exposure-related degradation, and the depletion of chemical reagents. If the sensing technology is sufficiently well matched to the application and the detector well designed, this period occurs beyond the lifetime required by the consumer.

From the above report, it appears that a minimum of 3 year lifetime is assumed (required?) by the UL standard. And given that the popular battery backed units use chemical based detector (fuel cell / battery like detector)--it is pretty apparent that a limited life is all that can be expected...

Also from the report, if you have a very low relative humidity (approaching 5%), then no current CO detector (as of 2002 report date) will work to specification. 50% RH most detectors will reliably detect dangerous amounts of CO...

In the end, after reading around--I would not trust a consumer CO alarm with my life. They are not reliable and one is much better served by ensuring that CO producing devices are never inside the home (generators, cars idling in a garage)--and that if you have 20+ year old furnaces and/or concerns about any gas/oil/fuel burning indoor vented appliances, that you have them checked out by a professional.

From some numbers that come up in Google--home based CO poisoning deaths (excluding people dying in cars from CO) are around ~170 per year, and around ~50 of them are associated with running a generator in/around a home.

-Bill

 

[TedTheLed]

None of those compromises are acceptable for this scenario.

I hope you mean a CO meter. A CO2 meter would be fairly useless...

a thousand apologies. please inhale all the co2 you like. hopefully
someone else with an interest in refrigeration will, perhaps, find my remarks useful.

 

[Cydonia]

A knowledgeable old repair guy told me that contemporary "quality control" for ALL appliance manufacturers is -- uniformly -- a far cry from what we once could buy. Hence, to varying degrees, it's almost all crap. Modern hi speed manufacturing of lots of stuff (from refrigerators to guns) emphasizes hi-volume/low cost production methods -- PERIOD. I guarantee you that your next frig will NOT last 30 years!

Yes I am afraid so. Most of the "best" products rolled off the factory floors many decades ago.
Our "progress" has mostly been in cutting corners and creating obsolescence and new exquisitely complex failure modes

Good thread.

An alternative: I furnish fridges in my rental properties when the renter doesn't have their own. I've consistently been able to buy 2/3 year old good fridges for $200-400. Just have to look around the repair shops.

Also, our Community College teachs appliance repair. They receive nonworking appliances, repair and resell them, usually for the cost of parts. They've also repaired several of mine just for parts costs.

That's what I would do too. Best not to spend $1250 on a new fridge in these times. You'll be kicking yourself black and blue in a few years wishing you saved the money... :duck:

 

[jtr1962]

We ordered the new fridge yesterday. Delivery is scheduled for Friday. On the advice given in this thread we went with a 5 year extended warranty. I figure if it doesn't break within 5 years then it's not a lemon. I hope we're not kicking ourselves a few years down the road.

If anyone is interested in our old refrigerator please let me know by early Friday otherwise the delivery people will be taking it away. No need to pick it up by Friday if you're interested but I have to know by then. I'll be happy to hold it until you can arrange pickup. As I said in the first post, it'll keep food cold until the fins start icing up. That usually takes at least a week, and then you'll need to turn it off for a day or so to defrost it. However, for uses where you'll only be running the fridge sporadically for a week or less, it'll be perfectly fine. And if you know how to put in a defrost heater, it can be a perfectly serviceable primary refrigerator. The compressor still seems to be in pretty decent shape.

 

[jtr1962]

Bad news-it didn't fit due to the hookup for the water projecting out about 1/2". Even without that, the delivery people didn't want to go down the back steps and up the basement steps into the kitchen (this is the route where I determined a unit which measured 28.5" with the doors off would fit). Basically then we're now limited to what fits through the other door going into the kitchen (i.e. a depth of 26" with the doors off). In terms of features and so forth, this isn't a whole lot. Rather than spend a lot of money and basically end up with a less reliable version of what we already have, I've decided to see if it's possible to put in a new defrost heater on our existing refrigerator. Can anyone help? The model is Frigidaire F-170T-7.

On another note, why aren't smaller models with all the high-end features made?

 

[LukeA]

Bad news-it didn't fit due to the hookup for the water projecting out about 1/2". Even without that, the delivery people didn't want to go down the back steps and up the basement steps into the kitchen (this is the route where I determined a unit which measured 28.5" with the doors off would fit). Basically then we're now limited to what fits through the other door going into the kitchen (i.e. a depth of 26" with the doors off). In terms of features and so forth, this isn't a whole lot. Rather than spend a lot of money and basically end up with a less reliable version of what we already have, I've decided to see if it's possible to put in a new defrost heater on our existing refrigerator. Can anyone help? The model is Frigidaire F-170T-7.

On another note, why aren't smaller models with all the high-end features made?

I find it hard to believe that a half inch made it not fit. Modern fridges need to stand off from the wall at least an inch for airflow.

 

[jtr1962]

I find it hard to believe that a half inch made it not fit. Modern fridges need to stand off from the wall at least an inch for airflow.

It would have fit in the spot we have for it. The problem was it couldn't physically make it through any of the doors going into the kitchen due to that extra 1/2" depth. The widest door going into the kitchen is a bit over 28.5". Without the water hookup it would have made it (barely).

Back to square one.

 

[jtr1962]

The conclusion to this saga is that I managed to figure out how to remove the defrost heater and install a new one. It wasn't that hard once I analyzed it. A few screws and tabs which I didn't see earlier keep the evaporator in place. Once they're loosened the evaporator lifts up enough to fit in a new defrost heater. After a week the old fridge has been defrosting just fine. I also cleaned it up like new while it was out of service.

So not quite a new fridge, but it only cost me a $30 part. Sure, we'll get a new fridge eventually but not now. Hopefully the compressor will last a few more years and they'll have more suitable models for us by then (i.e. a little smaller but with all the high-end features). I'd love a solid-state (peltier) refrigerator but I don't think that's going to happen within 5 years or so.

This Samsung is close but no cigar. It's too tall for the spot we have, but at least it would have fit through the door, including the narrower 26" door. And it's only $850 at BestBuy. But besides being too tall I read from some sources that it has a less than stellar reliability record.

 

[LukeA]

i.e. a little smaller but with all the high-end features

They're getting nothing but bigger.

 

[reptiles]

refrigerator manufacturing today

I have my grandparents Frigidaire in my basement - it has survived dozens of refrigerator changes in three generations of our kitchens. It was made in 1939 according to a plate on the back. As far as anyone remembers, it has never required service.

It has been running on "vacation" mode since the late 70's and is just used for backup and party supplies. It is only opened a couple times a month.

I do defrost the freezer every year or two, manually.

I find it very odd that I have a 70 year old appliance happily humming along in the basement while the units upstairs are replaced every 7-12 years or so.

Cheers,

Mark

 

[BB]

You might want to check its power usage with a Kill-A-Watt meter...

I would not be surprised if it was taking $15 a month (or more) in electrical power.

A simple energy star fridge would be in the $3-$5 a month range...

If it is an air conditioned space--in the summer it would cost you even more.

-Bill

 

[reptiles]

You might want to check its power usage with a Kill-A-Watt meter...

I would not be surprised if it was taking $15 a month (or more) in electrical power.

A simple energy star fridge would be in the $3-$5 a month range...

If it is an air conditioned space--in the summer it would cost you even more.

-Bill

Always a good idea, but the compressor on the antique rarely runs when set to "vacation" so I'll test it, one of these days.

=Mark