Dear Surefire, please bring back HA III Nat, knurling, and flats

[souptree]

Just hire back PK.

THIS. How they ever could have let him get away is completely beyond me. They should have tripled his salary.

I love my old SureFires, and there are still a few old ones I'd like to track down someday, but I barely track their new offerings anymore.

 

[Monocrom]

I'm glad I bought all the L1 lights, my favorite SF.

Yup! Still have my Milky-modded L1.
Very first single CR123 powered light to hit 200 actual lumens.
(Took SureFire another 9 or 10 months to release the first production light capable of that.)

 

[Melson]

@Carrot, thank you for providing the answer this thread needs and the proper letter to Surefire!

My very first "Wow that's bright!" light was a Surefire. I would love to buy a Surefire product again that wows me.

 

[Mags]

@Carrot everything you said is true, but isnt surefire already doing exactly that? What with their "Dual fuel" series (I lol'd, only for sf that'd be a headline feature) and their branded usb charged 18650s? As you pretty much explained there just isnt enough room for 18650s and Surefire's flats while maintaining the same form factor, I just see all future sf's to look like their Furies, thicker and more round. I dont find the scarcity or lack of industry development of the 16650 to be that troubling, and the lower current is fine as I dont care for more than 400-500 lumens in the e/l/aviator series form factor but that's just me, I guess I'd take form over performance, though personally I hate how lately max lumens and performance are mentioned so interchangeably. I'm still impressed to this day when I pick up my smaller flats surefires, they just handle great and Id love to buy a modern sf that has the same feel. I dont like the edc series as much, they just dont feel right, the e1/2/dls are okay.


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[ampdude]

Just hire back PK. He'll fix it.

In all seriousness we need proper rechargeable support. 18650 is the correct and obvious choice, lest I need to remind anybody that the original U2 had native 18650 support and second revision ones had a removable plastic sleeve to step down to 16mm diameter CR123As.

18650 is the norm everywhere else and has been for years. 18650 cells are in every laptop battery that hasn't switched over to Li-poly flat cells. 18650 cells are in every teenager's vape pen. 18650 cells are used in all of the Tesla S cars. 18650 cells are used in nearly every battery bank. It's a standard, and it's not going to go away any time soon because it's a good size relative to human hands for items handled by humans.

I would normally tolerate 16650 (which I do use) but there is one manufacturer (Sanyo) that still bothers to make them, and only one company (Keeppower) that still wraps and protects them. I don't even want to get into capacity wars but the 16650 is positively anemic at 2500mAh with a 2C max discharge rate. From March til June this year, 16650s were scarce whereas you could still find 16340 and 18650 just about anywhere online.

I think saying the early U2's had "18650 support" is stretching it a bit. The early U2 bodies were made just wide enough to allow an unprotected 18650, which were generally at the time pretty slim in diameter compared to the 3400 mAh protected monsters we have now. Probably closer to the diameter of a protected AW 17670 type cell. I could be remembering this wrong, but I don't remember there being any factory Surefire sleeves that came with U2's. Some people said it, but it didn't seem plausible to me and I never saw one like that, whether Luxeon 5 or Seoul emitter. There were aftermarket options, some of the earliest I remember being the UBH kit so you could sleeve an 18650 light and use CR123A's with no rattle. Surefire tightened up the tolerances later on in the run so that the U2 would only accept CR123A's. I have a later U2 that won't even come close to accepting an AW protected 17670, or 17500. All of the older E-series two flats, two cell bodies will accept protected AW or Keeppower 17500's and 17670's just fine with even a little bit of rattle! Same with the Vital Gear lights as well. 17mm rechargeable cells were very popular for quite awhile, I'm surprised they don't seem to be nearly as popular these days.

Surefire tightened the tolerances up on many of their bodies in the mid to late 2000's. If anything batteries are moving to smaller form factors. 18650 is a good battery size, but I'd rather have my legacy Surefire system with CR123A primaries that I can rely on for serious things, and last forever, and use 16mm or 17mm rechargeables for free lumens or general use. I never did understand the whole 16650 thing, but then most of my lights will accept 17mm rechargeable cells and IMR16340's have been available for a long time and serve my rechargeable needs in two cell flashlights with tighter spec bodies. Otherwise I'll use the different variations of 17mm cells for my rechargeable needs.

 

[WarriorOfLight]

The early U2 bodies were made just wide enough to allow an unprotected 18650, which were generally at the time pretty slim in diameter compared to the 3400 mAh protected monsters we have now. Probably closer to the diameter of a protected AW 17670 type cell. I could be remembering this wrong, but I don't remember there being any factory Surefire sleeves that came with U2's. Some people said it, but it didn't seem plausible to me and I never saw one like that, whether Luxeon 5 or Seoul emitter.

I have a few Surefire U2 lights, one of them is a very early one. The serial# is in the low 2000 range if I remember correctly. This light works perfect at least with older 18650 cells. I never checked 3500mAh cells, therefore I do not know if it will fit. My U2 did not have a sleeve. I have two Luxeon V U2 flashlights and both works perfectly with a 18650 cell and both do not have this sleeve. There should also be some late models with Lux V having a body that has a smaller inner diameter
The SSC P4 Models of the U2 does not have the capability of the 18650 usage. From what I know there are no early models that had a diameter that makes it possible to use 18650 cells.

Btw. the U2 bodies are compatible and are interchangable, also Kroma / Kroma MILSPEC Bodys are fitting. But the Kroma lights also does not have 18650 capable bodies. At least I never saw someone saying this was ever existing..

 

[DayofReckoning]

16650's are great for those Surefire's that won't fit an 18650. I ran a 16650 in a Kroma and it fit and functioned perfectly.

 

[novice]

Carrot, thank you for sharing all that.

ampdude, I have 2x U2 lights that will take older 18650 cells (AW 2600 mAh protected). One of the bodies had the plastic sleeve glued in. I must have bought the tube separately and swapped parts with another gen2 U2. In any event, I followed another CPFer's advice, put the battery tube in a baggie, and put it in the freezer (and forgot about it for awhile). All I needed to do after that was to wedge in the tip of my index finger, give it a quarter-twist, and the tube came right out, on my finger. Saved it as a future potential sleeve.

I would love to have an A3 Aviator that would take 2xLi-ion cells. Even 2x14500 would be an improvement over the 2x AW protected 16340 cells that I sometimes use now (with a Koala ring). Bonus points if it would take a larger diameter cell than the original A2.

 

[ampdude]

Yea, I believe the A3 was in the prototype stage at one point and I'm guessing the lamp would have been designated MA03.

It would have been nice to see along with an E3e w/ MN04 lamp assembly.

 

[forstersun]

Totally agree.
The old knurling and flats, so beautiful, IMHO.