First post: Why buy a light that takes odd batteries ?

[wreckless1]

As a newbie .. I'm curious why anyone would want ,,or even why a manufacturer would make a flashlight that takes hard to find battery and not work with rechargables.? :confused:

 

[GreySave]

Depends upon what you need. As a volunteer for a number of emergency services I need lights that can sport high power and / or extremely long run times on a case by case basis, and that can sit for an extended period unused without worrying about leakage or weakeng of the cells while the light is stored. I also like the small and lightweight 123A cells as they are easy to carry as spares even if I have to use a backpack or just what I can pocket carry. With primary cells I know they will deliver and that I can change them out quickly and easily. Rechargeables will not work in the field for what I do.

Two of my primary carry lights are a SureFire LED Defender and a LX2. The LX2 is used to some extent almost every night. Because the TIR optics are so efficient even on low power I only change batteries in them one to three times a year. So that is $6 to $18 over a full year. That's not too bad.

I do use rechargeables in lights around the house when I can and for exercises when I have a fair idea how long I will need them.

 

[dss_777]

As a newbie .. I'm curious why anyone would want ,,or even why a manufacturer would make a flashlight that takes hard to find battery and not work with rechargables.? :confused:

Define "hard to find".

If you're talking about CR123A's, I think they are quite reasonable in cost (~$1 each) and very available with a bit of planning.

Ultimately, the performance of the lights they power far exceeds the alternatives, IMO.

 

[JCD]

As a newbie .. I'm curious why anyone would want ,,or even why a manufacturer would make a flashlight that takes hard to find battery and not work with rechargables.? :confused:

Mass to volume and power to volume ratios of some "hard to find" cells (e.g., CR123A cells) exceed those of alkaline cells. That means lights can be made smaller and brighter. Lithium cells handle heat and cold better than alkaline cells. Lithium cells have a much longer shelf life than alkaline cells.

Rechargeable cells aren't well suited for weapon mounted lights. Primary cells only need to withstand the recoil forces for one discharge cycle, but rechargeable cells are expected to last hundreds of charge/discharge cycles. Real tactical lights are typically manufactured with the expectation that some will be mounted on firearms.

Also, many commonly used rechargeable cells were never meant to be available directly to consumers by the manufacturers. Thus, some of the more reputable large manufacturers (e.g., SureFire) do not officially support use of rechargeable cells in their lights, even though they often can be used with little or no modification.

 

[MrBenchmark]

1. Welcome to CPF! :)

2. Some military / law enforcement operations buy batteries like CR123A cells in huge volume. If you get the batteries you use at work FOR FREE from work, wouldn't you want a light that uses them?

3. How can I put this delicately? The common Alkaline AA cell have issues:
a. They handle low temperatures badly
b. They aren't great in high discharge continuous use operations.
c. They store less energy than a CR123A
d. They have a bad reputation for leakage.

For casual usage, for someone who isn't willing to procure more exotic types of cells, AA batteries are obviously the way to go. They are common, they are cheap, and if your life doesn't depend on them working, (and most people's will not) they are just fine.

Originally, an incandescent surefire light using CR123A's was a fraction of the weight, and had higher output than a D cell based maglight. If you had to carry the thing on your person all night, wouldn't you prefer the smaller, brighter light, even if it took "odd" batteries? That equation has changed quite a bit thanks to LEDs and you can now get really pretty decent performance from AA batteries + an LED flashlight. Still, lotsa people have lights that use CR123A's, a lot of these batteries are made, and if you know where to buy them, they are inexpensive. And they offer better output and runtime than even lithium AA batteries. (Actually the last CR123A's I bought on sale were CHEAPER than lithium AA batteries, although higher than alkaline AA batteries.)

 

[John_Galt]

I can purchase CR123 at the same price as Energizer ultimate Lithium AA's locally: Surefire brand 123's in a 2 pack for $5, or a 4 pack of Energizer Li AA's for $10.

Ordering online in bulk actually makes it cheaper for me to use a 123 cell based light than a AA based light, if using primaries is a must. Otherwise, I use Ni-MH rechargeable's for my AA lights.


Check your local Loews store, they usually have 3pcks or SF123's for $5 near the flashlights section. Some stores actually used to carry a few Surefire lights. Stay away from the camera sections of stores, as they usually tend to charge a kidney apiece for CR123's, as do most drug stores...

 

[bansuri]

"Why buy a light that takes odd batteries?"

They only seem odd at first.
Just like your first puff off of a cigarette or your first drink of alcohol; they're only odd at first.
Eventually they'll seem normal and you'll wonder how you ever got by without them.
Or you could stay straight and save yourself a ton of money.
I'm trying to switch back to AA and AAA, it's hard to do, especially if you peruse the boards, but I'm working on it.
Maybe Henry will make a 1xAA light someday, then I will truly be able to kick the habit.

But I guess to answer your question may be: To get the light you want regardless of battery type.

 

[325addict]

When we're talking "odd batteries", for me it takes at the very least a CR2 to fall under that description. CR123As are available anywhere, have an enormous energy density, are lightweight, can handle large currents continuously, and will have a storage life of 10+ years.

Not enough to convince you? We'll talk again in two years, when you've had your first expensive light RUINED by leaking AA Alkies....:whistle:

Timmo.

 

[HarveyRich]

I like the charging speed of NiMH precharged AA or AAA, such as Eneloops and they are relatively easy to find. However, for pure power/mass ratio, li-ion batteries can't be beat despite the fact that they have to be handled carefully and the smaller ones are unprotected.

The hardest for me to find are the 10180 and the 14250 batteries which run just a few flashlights. However, (assuming you are willing to endure the wait), I love my Lummi Wee, which takes the 10180 batteries. Brightness to size is the critical factor here and it's worth looking for the batteries on the internet to have such a tiny powerful flashlight available.

 

[325addict]

When I remember right, AW sells both the 10180 and the other you mentioned. Just look for his sales thread of "protected Li-ion batteries".

Just checked out for you, he sells:

- 15266 ( RCR2 ) 350mAH --------- $4.50 each
- 10440 ( AAA ) 350mAH ---------- $4.00 each
- 14270 ( 310 mAH ) -------------- $4.50 each
- 14250 ( 300 mAH ) 1/2AA -------- $4.50 each
- 10280 ( 180 mAH ) -------------- $4.50 each
- 10180 ( 90mAH ) ---------------- $4.50 each

* Shipping is $1.50 ( for up to 4 batteries )

and this is the complete thread:

http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=200812

Timmo.

 

[mrcandyman]

Personally, I was a bit iffy about getting new batteries in a non-standard size, but I must say the 18650 cell is exactly what I wanted in a battery. Perfect runtime for my needs coupled with high power lights, perfect size, easy to charge and maintain. The cost wasn't that bad either. Not the cheapest in the world, but much cheaper than, say, an RC Lipo battery of the same size

 

[RepProdigious]

Best reason to start using 'strange' batteries:

Your other half wont be tempted to steal em from you, put them in the most awkward appliance and then forget about it...... I almost lost some brand new eneloops that way, they ended up in a remote and in one of those neck massager pillows.... *GEEZ*

Luckily the only thing she has that fits a 16340 is a flashlight :twothumbs


And 18650 are just BRILLIANT cells! I like em size-wise and because they come from such a competitive market they get better and better faster than any other cell!

 

[sol-leks]

I think alot of us start out feeling this way, I know I did. However, as others have mentioned these "odd" batteries aren't being used for fun and giggles, they are being used because they perform really well. CR123's are pretty easy to find now and are cheap online. You do get screwed buying them in stores usually though. It is pretty rare though that I personally am forced to buy a battery out of the blue, carrying spares isn't too hard or stashing a few in the car and at work.

Your point is not without merit though. This is why many of us do carry backup lights or own backup lights that use AA's or AAA's. It's not like anyone just owns cr123 lights.

 

[mcnair55]

I think alot of us start out feeling this way, I know I did. However, as others have mentioned these "odd" batteries aren't being used for fun and giggles, they are being used because they perform really well. CR123's are pretty easy to find now and are cheap online. You do get screwed buying them in stores usually though. It is pretty rare though that I personally am forced to buy a battery out of the blue, carrying spares isn't too hard or stashing a few in the car and at work.

Your point is not without merit though. This is why many of us do carry backup lights or own backup lights that use AA's or AAA's. It's not like anyone just owns cr123 lights.

A + from me what Sol-leks says,in total harmony with his thoughts on this one and nothing to add as he has taken the words I would have used.

 

[Niconical]

As said by dss 777, define hard to find. A quick email to Kevin at batterystation and I have a box of 50 CR123A on the way to me at about the same cost per cell as alks in my local store, and I don't even have to move away from the PC.

Having said that though, I'd never want only one type. The only lights I use and am interested in take CR123A, but I still have a pair of the Quark mini AA. Personally I think even the most dedicated Surefire/CR123A fan should have at least a simple AA in the collection, Quark mini AA, Fenix E20, something along those lines.

 

[jp2515]

Not enough to convince you? We'll talk again in two years, when you've had your first expensive light RUINED by leaking AA Alkies....:whistle:

Exactly! No matter what happens, alkalines will leak. Don't think so? That was my though process too until I had batteries that leaked in 2 of my lights. Rechargeables and CR123s for me! :D

 

[DM51]

Welcome to CPF, wreckless1.

Your post is more to do with Battery types than the lights that use them, so I'm moving your thread to our Batteries section.

 

[pinchia]

I think CR123 quite reasonable for flashlights.
It has long shelf life. Another great thing is it doesn't leak like Alkaline batteries.

 

[kramer5150]

As a newbie .. I'm curious why anyone would want ,,or even why a manufacturer would make a flashlight that takes hard to find battery and not work with rechargables.? :confused:

In reference to the AA size...
Alkalines leak, no matter what brand, how old, or how new they are. They should be avoided in any light you want to keep. Just because it hasn't happened to you personally, does not mean it doesn't happen. In the Duracell and Eveready warranty, they offer full $$$ back for any product their cells destroy. Even they admit/know their product is destructive and prone to fail.

As for the smaller AA size...
NiMH and Lithium primariy AA is the way to go in the commonly available AA size. But the 1AA lights do not (yet) outperform 1xCR123 counterparts, and the 2AA lights do not (yet) outshine 2xCR123. Its not till' you get into the 3xNiMH size that these lights start to match the lumen output of the multi-CR123 designs.

I suspect this latter condition is only temporary. As newer more efficient LEDs are developed, forward voltages are going to drop and 1AA and 2AA designs will improve.

 

[brainy1000]

I think alot of us start out feeling this way, I know I did. However, as others have mentioned these "odd" batteries aren't being used for fun and giggles, they are being used because they perform really well. CR123's are pretty easy to find now and are cheap online. You do get screwed buying them in stores usually though. It is pretty rare though that I personally am forced to buy a battery out of the blue, carrying spares isn't too hard or stashing a few in the car and at work.

Your point is not without merit though. This is why many of us do carry backup lights or own backup lights that use AA's or AAA's. It's not like anyone just owns cr123 lights.

Correct!
It's my opinion that (for example) CR123As are more reliable than AAs or AAAs, however there are other aspects to ponder. Here where I live 123As are very hard to find and consequently very expensive, purchasing them online (dealers in my own coutry) is a masochist exercise in burning money and worst of all, importing them in big packs is, in terms, a forbidden practice, because the Customs will heavily tax them. So, being objective, with only one exception, my lights are AA or AAA ones, which, of course, are very, very well adequated for my needs. So, the practical aspects win, in my case.