Found an old friend!

[so2315]

When I started out as a LEO, I bought a Surefire 6R light. It had the battery that you had to pull out, and hook up 2 wires to recharge it. I sold this to a friend around 1992-93 when I bought my Streamlight Stinger. The Stinger seemed just as bright, but recharging was so much easier than the 6R.
Anyway, my friend did something to the battery where it leaked a bit inside, and he threw it in the closet for a couple of years. He gave it back to me, and I cleaned the inside out with some baking soda and a toothbrush. The only battery acid was a couple of spots, and they came right off. Light looks almost like new!
What I am asking is this: Does anybody know if I can use more of the 123 batteries to fill up the extended tube of the 6R, or do I need to take the body extension off and convert to a 6P? Do they make decent rechargeable batteries for these now days? And finally, I just ordered a Fenix P3D last week before he gave me the Surefire, what kind of LED head can I get for cheap and be comparable in brightness to the Fenix? I see someone on E-Bay has a 200 Lumen Cree head for the Surefires.
I am a newbie to the flashlight forum, and any help would be appreciated as I can't see as good as I used to when I got hired, so I need a brighter light!!

 

[Dadof6]

I have no idea how to answer your question, but wanted to welcome you to the forum. Lots of good people here.

 

[Valolammas]

I'm not a Surefire expert so I don't know anything about the 6R, but basically, your battery and rechargeable options boil down to two things: 1) type of bulb (voltage) and 2) how much room there is inside the light. #2 determines what kind and how many cells you can use, so start with that and then consider your bulb or LED conversion options. What kind of lamp assembly does the 6R use, btw, is it a P60? What's the internal diameter and length of the battery tube?

Take a look at this thread, even if you want to convert it to an LED. It's an excellent guide to li-ion cells and how to use them, and many of the same issues will come up, even if some LED drop-ins are more forgiving in terms of input voltage (some of them can take 3.6 to 9 Volts, which allow you to use almost any rechargeable solution that will fit into the light).

 

[so2315]

The 6R light is basically the original 6P, but with an extra screw on body extension of 2.5 inches. I can unscrew this and put the switch back on the main body and it is an original 6P light. It has the P60 bulb in it. I was just wondering if I can add some more 123 batteries to take up the 2.5" body or if I should just convert back to a 6P? If I go 6P, do they make rechargeable batteries for them and what is the best drop in bulb for this??

 

[DM51]

The P60 is a medium-power 6v lamp-assembly (bulb). You can power it with 2 x CR123A primary (3v non-rechargeable) cells, which should last ~1 hour.

If you try to power it with rechargeable 3.7v Li-Ions, the LA will blow because of the higher voltage. You could use a P61 high-power LA for increased brightness, but again this is 6v so you can only use 2 x CR123A primaries with it - and it will run the batteries down much faster.

Depending on the exact length of the extender (you say it is 2.5 ins) the light may be able to take 2 x 17670 Li-Ion rechargeable cells, in which case you could use a high-power 9v lamp assembly like a P91, or Lumens Factory EO-9. You would see a startling difference in output with this set-up.

If you have any CR123A cells, try fitting 4 of them in the light with the extender on, just to see if they fit. DO NOT SWITCH ON, THOUGH - this is just a test to measure size. If they do fit, this means you will be able to use 2 x 17670s and a 9v LA.

If they don't fit, there are still rechargeable options which don't use the extender - 2 x R123 Li-Ions and a Lumens Factory SR-9 LA would be a good combination.

 

[yellow]

I also got my 6R almost at the time You mentionned,
never used it too much, as I switched to 8X and 9N rather soon - because the cells are crap compared to the ones for 8X/9N (8X/9N much brighter and longer running but just a tad bigger)
and this has not changed - no use to work with rechargeable NiMhs/NiCads of this size.
With the extension the light is just a tad too long for three CR123s but 4 wont fit in.
Therefore I have modded the 6P body to accomodate a single 18650 and built a Cree with Flupic driver into.
Thats THE light!

Those dropins have some positive treads in here, get one You like (on/off or a multistage one)
Power it with a 17650 or mod the body for the 18650 --> 2+ hours @ 1 A to the emitter, burns everything in this size class into ground.

 

[DM51]

Good input from yellow there, and you may decide to go for the Cree option. Hard to argue with that, except, well... a Cree is a Cree is a Cree, and they are all pretty much the same, giving you about 170 lumens (~110 torch).

With an incan setup you can get at least double that.

If, as yellow says, the light + extender is too short for 2 x 17670 Li-Ions, you could use 2 x 17500s and a dummy (which you could make yourself to the right size). This would run the Lumens Factory EO-9 lamp, which will give you 380 lumens (~220 torch).

I emphasise that yellow's LED solution is equally valid - it is bright and has excellent run-time - but I'm just representing the "incan" point of view here!

 

[yellow]

I'm sorry with that statement...
DM51 is right, there are quite some incans that are brighter.

I always think of an original setup (offering something like 1 hour runtime on 2 CR123s)

there is the possibility to get a Leef-Body for Your light. These are ready for 18500 (or 18650) 1, 2, 3 cells (depends on model). Way safer than having the original body bored out.

 

[so2315]

I also got my 6R almost at the time You mentionned,
never used it too much, as I switched to 8X and 9N rather soon - because the cells are crap compared to the ones for 8X/9N (8X/9N much brighter and longer running but just a tad bigger)
and this has not changed - no use to work with rechargeable NiMhs/NiCads of this size.
With the extension the light is just a tad too long for three CR123s but 4 wont fit in.
Therefore I have modded the 6P body to accomodate a single 18650 and built a Cree with Flupic driver into.
Thats THE light!

Those dropins have some positive treads in here, get one You like (on/off or a multistage one)
Power it with a 17650 or mod the body for the 18650 --> 2+ hours @ 1 A to the emitter, burns everything in this size class into ground.

I guess I am at a loss when you said the body modded to accommodate a single 18650. I do not know what an 18650 is, is it a battery or bulb? I am completely new here. I just got a Fenix P3D CE and that is about as bright as the Surefire 6P. If I was to keep it as a 6P, how bright can I get it and how do I do it? (with drop in parts) Better to go Cree LED 200 Lumens or is there a brighter Incan??

 

[DM51]

I guess I am at a loss when you said the body modded to accommodate a single 18650. I do not know what an 18650 is, is it a battery or bulb? I am completely new here. I just got a Fenix P3D CE and that is about as bright as the Surefire 6P. If I was to keep it as a 6P, how bright can I get it and how do I do it? (with drop in parts) Better to go Cree LED 200 Lumens or is there a brighter Incan??

An 18650 is a Li-Ion rechargeable battery. The sizes are not too difficult. The first 2 figures are the diameter, and the second 2 figures are the length, both in millimeters. Ignore the last zero – it just means it is a cylindrical cell.

A 17xx0 cell is obviously slimmer than an 18xx0 – and only 17xx0 sizes fit in Surefires.

A Cr123A primary is 34mm long and 16mm diameter. The Li-Ion rechargeable cell that size should be called a 16340, but just to make things awkward it isn't – it's called an R123 (or RCR123, or other variations – all beginning with an 'R' though).

2 x CR123As will occupy the same space as 1 x 17670. 3 x CR123A are the same length as 2 x 17500. Etc, etc, etc.

As you already have a useful LED light in your Fenix P3DCE, I would very much urge you to keep this Surefire as an incan. If you want to use it as a 6P, without the extension, I would suggest 2 x R123 Li-Ions and a Lumens Factory SR-9 incan LA (220 bulb lumens, ~150 torch).

This will be brighter than any Cree drop-in option, and it will give you a different kind of light (better, IMO). You could maybe sell the extender on B/S/T, then with the proceeds visit AW for some cells, and Lumens Factory for an SR-9 LA.

 

[so2315]

Thanks for the advise, explanation sure helped!! Looking at the Lumens Factory site, would the EO-9 380 lumens bulb work in this 6P? I see it say's 9V, but I wonder what the run time would be with the 2 123 batteries.

 

[Mike 208]

You may want to consider obtaining an A19 adapter and turning your light into an 9P. You'll have to remove the existing adapter, and replace the lamp with a P90 or P91 LA.

 

[DM51]

Thanks for the advise, explanation sure helped!! Looking at the Lumens Factory site, would the EO-9 380 lumens bulb work in this 6P? I see it say's 9V, but I wonder what the run time would be with the 2 123 batteries.

I wondered if you would ask that! Those 380 lumens of the EO-9 look quite tempting, don't they?

The answer is that this lamp draws too much power for the small R123 cells. Every cell has a rated capacity in milliamp-hours (mAh) which is the amount of current it can deliver over 1 hour.

The rate at which this current is delivered is given in 'C', where C is a simple multiplier. Example: if the battery discharges from full to empty in 1 hour, the rate has been 1C. If it drains in 30 mins, the rate was 2C. 2 hours = 0.5C. Etc, etc. The same applies to charging rates.

The rated capacity of an R123 is 750mAh. Under load this will drop to ~600mAh. 1C for this cell is therefore 750mA, or ~600mA under load. 2C would be 1,200mA (1.2A) under load.

To stay within safety limits and to avoid damage, Li-Ion cells should be discharged at no more than 2C. They can take higher currents in short bursts, but not for protracted use. When choosing a bulb, this 2C figure must be born in mind, and if you look at the specifications of Lumens Factory LAs, you will see that the EO-9 would demand 2A, which is >3C, ie far too much. The SR-9, which I recommended above, draws 1.2A, which is on the 2C limit. Having said that, I sometimes use an HO-9, which draws 1.5A, for short bursts. It is spectacular on fully-charged cells, but it soon turns rather yellow as the cells run down (and it isn't doing the cells much good).

There is a fairly simple way of determining whether a given set-up is within safety limits – the time it takes to discharge the cells. If they empty in under 30 mins total run-time, the discharge rate was obviously >2C and was therefore too high. The SR-9 should give you ~30 mins on 2 x R123; the HO-9 would give you ~20 mins. To be safe, stay with 30+ mins. Your cells will be damaged if you drain them at too fast a rate, and their cycle life will shorten drastically.