Help choosing Shotgun light

Mercaptan

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Oct 16, 2007
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Well, the stock is a Magpul MOE stock, run off a Mesa Tactical Enidine recoil buffer. The TPS has a slot for AR-15 style receiver extensions, and therefore stocks.

Well, it depends on what you want to run for your light. My carbine has the Malkoff M60 (standard ~250 lumens), but for the scattergun I'm more preferential to medium light output and more flood. Blinding oneself with too many lumens is a possibility indoors, in darkness.

Different tools for different jobs I suppose.
 

ARA

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Jun 24, 2009
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Yes i agree, you need different configurations for different scenarios. I guess the shotgun being more of a CQB weapon would suffice with a more floody beam as compared to a thrower.
 

ionizedsky

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Dec 30, 2008
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Yes i agree, you need different configurations for different scenarios. I guess the shotgun being more of a CQB weapon would suffice with a more floody beam as compared to a thrower.

Stick to the M60 for your Shotty, even in a room clearing situation you will find that the M60 has more than enough side spill. I don't like the M60F as a room clearing module (don't get me wrong it would work fine), it just is to diffused imo for tactical level light. If you so desire a floody beam with good light I would go with the M60MC-E but you will need to run either x2 Primaries or x2 rcr123s due to the battery regulation, and that M60MC-E is a little bit of a vampire so make sure your always got fresh ones in before you go to bed.
 

boats

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Oct 30, 2009
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Our club runs Tac Shotgun matches often a dark stage. Most of us put our regular Hand held flashlight on the mag tube with a mag tube clamp just skewing the existing clamp sideways for the match. 1 inch light like the Surefire G2 is about the same size as a mag tube. Cheap and easy solution. Very few keep a light mounted all the time. Too much stuff hanging off the gun slows you down and upsets the guns balance. Be aware that a light attached to the shotguns barrel or mag tube will change it's zero, enough to miss small close targets, re-zero after you have installed the light. This advice is for matches, only objective is to win and the targets can't shoot back.

On the beam, most indoors situations are short distance. 10 yards would be long 7 more the case at our club or in most homes. Plenty of light wide spread is what you want. No hot spots either. There is a strong tendency when shooting with a flashlight to try to center the lights hot spot on the target when what you want is the guns sights on target. Our club shoots a lot of flashlight stages indoors, beam thrown by a 6P or G2 Surefire is about right. Too much light can be a negative it can light up the gunsmoke and cause a "screen" like high beams on your car on a foggy night. Often times I will have to hold my light up at neck level and shoot Pistols one handed to avoid the smoke. Found this out the hard with with My U2 Cranked all the way up one match. Totaly obscured.

Home defense I can't recomend weapon mounted lights. To use one You have to point a loaded gun at targets that have not been identified. Could have unintended results, lots of cases were someone excited pulled a trigger by mistake. I use a G2 Surefire with the combat ring same one as in matches. Light up the possible target and if required to shoot then bring the gun to the target with the light in my hand. This is the method required by IDPA in pistol matches. Weapon mounts are not allowed. I could see a reason to use a hand held light with a weapon mounted light though. Use the hand held for searching and identification, go to the tube mount light when it's time to shoot. If so I have seen nothing better that Surefires forearm. Neat clean and mimimum upset to the guns balance.

If a person is Law Enforcement or Military this opinion does not apply. However a private citizen defending himself or home has a requirement in most if not all jurisdictions to identify a real threat before shooting. Basic safety rule is don't point a gun at anything you don't intend to destroy.

Boats
 
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Patriot

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Nice post Boats. :thumbsup:

As I started to read each paragraph I thought I was going to be in disagreement with you but you kept qualifying each statement. I've a huge fan of mounted lights used in conjunction with a free light.

Nicely thought out.
 

boats

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Patriot our club shoots most matches indoors and it's easy to run dark stages. Just have to flick a switch. We hold a indoor regional match in March were you shoot 5 full stages as many as 6 targets 2-3 rounds each with no ambient light at all just what you hold in your hand. You have to reload move from target to target clear jams anything with only your light. We have all learned a great deal about what works and what will not.

Our shotgun matches don't use IDPA rules we shoot them under USPSA rules that allow weapon mounted lights and while held outdoors often times will build a simple "shooting house" that's totally dark. Weapon mounted lights rule here. It's a better way to hit targets in the dark. Couple of guys use the Surefire forearms and they work very well. Just there is not enough competition shot dark with the Shotgun to justify the expense for me. Sticking the hand held on works good enough.

Boats
 

ARA

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Jun 24, 2009
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Well to give you guys my perspective, first i'm not LEO, military or based in the US. The primary reason for me to get the forend light was that i found handling shotgun mounted lights let alone a handheld light with a shotgun a pretty difficult if not an awkward task. The forend makes it a bit easier, agreed its pretty expensive but then i take my security very seriously and if this gives me an edge then its worth it for me atleast. YMMV

Second since apart from my spouse nobody lives with me hence any other person besides us in the house is an intruder and as per the local laws i am entitled to use deadly force if i feel my life is under threat. The way i look at it, any intruder is a legitimate target under my roof, as the onus to determine wether the intruder is armed or not is not my problem. You step into my domain without my permission i have every right to point a weapon at you. I have been robbed twice at gunpoint in my own house hence i take intruders very seriously.

I do appreciate any advice given and am willing to learn to make any ammends if needed. Thanks guys, appreciate the tips :twothumbs
 

boats

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Oct 30, 2009
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Have a look on Surefires web site. It's sort of buried but there is a page called Articles. Lots of detail on weapon mounted and hand held flashlight methods.

Shooting with a hand held is not easy to do needs lots of pratice. Give that shotgun some time on paper targets too, not as easy as it looks. Close the shot hardly spreads at all. The gun has to be set up right to connect.

Boats
 

TCSF

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Oct 23, 2009
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Basic safety rule is ... stay alive. The other guy is playing by the rules? Let the lawyers sort it all out later. Look what OJ's guys were able to do.

With a weapon mounted light, the lead goes where the light goes. Every time.

On my 870 I have a Streamlight TLR-2 attached to a two round extended magazine by Brownell's part number 100-003-129. Extended magazine needs to be 1" diameter. Cost of parts is much less than a fore end unit. Light is excellent. If you don't want the laser, save money and get the TLR-1. Any dummy can put these parts together.

Brenneke's Green Lightning slug load uses a hard lead alloy 1 1/4 oz slug that will put a tenth of an inch deep divot in the front of a 1/2 inch steel plate and bulge out the backside. Nice confidence builder to have this stuff in your gun when something goes bump in the night.
 

ARA

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Jun 24, 2009
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210
Update:

I went to the range today to try out the shotgun with the surefire forend, must say no complains yet. As Mercaptan stated, the Winchester defender 1300's (also known as the speedpump) bolt disengages immediately once the trigger is pulled. I found that with the Surefire forend the movement is exaggerated even more (probably due to the weight), but i did not have any malfunctions or problems loading.

I did notice that there is some play between the forend and the magazine tube fit. Not much to cause worry but nevertheless its there. :shrug:

Now just need to get a Malkoff.
 

ARA

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Jun 24, 2009
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Update:

I finally got myself a Malkoff M61 only to be disappointed that it does not completely fit inside the battery body and hence does not work. I tried screwing down the bezel but it would not screw down completely. Can anyone give any suggestions to make this work. :anyone:

Right now i have a KX4 Led head on it, though i cannot tell of any difference in output between the P60L and the KX4. :oops:
 

ionizedsky

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Dec 30, 2008
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Update:

I finally got myself a Malkoff M61 only to be disappointed that it does not completely fit inside the battery body and hence does not work. I tried screwing down the bezel but it would not screw down completely. Can anyone give any suggestions to make this work. :anyone:

ARA,

Does it not reach because the shape of the module will not allow it to go all the way down? Also when you look down the battery tube is there a little metal ring in there that is removable?

-Ion
 

gt_mule

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May 30, 2010
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Update:

I finally got myself a Malkoff M61 only to be disappointed that it does not completely fit inside the battery body and hence does not work. I tried screwing down the bezel but it would not screw down completely. Can anyone give any suggestions to make this work. :anyone:

Right now i have a KX4 Led head on it, though i cannot tell of any difference in output between the P60L and the KX4. :oops:
Here is the mod:

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/282484

In your case you have to do it to the tube; there is no adapter collar.
 

ARA

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Jun 24, 2009
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Thank you for your replies,

Yes sir the shape of the M61 does not allow it to completely seat in the battery tube. There is a plastic ring which i believe is to prevent the batteries from smashing into the dropin under recoil. I have not tried to remove it yet as i did not want to experiment without being clear what the problem is.

I have tried a Thrunite dropin as well and it had the same problem. Seems like the tolerance of the battery tube is very little to accomodate any other dropin other than the P60L for which it was designed.

@gt_mule, thanks for the link mate, yes that explains my predicament very well.

So the only way to accomodate any other dropin would be to get rid of the plastic ring and the raised metal tab underneath it right ?
 

gt_mule

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May 30, 2010
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The plastic ring and metal flange are half of the problem. The inside diameter is the other half.

I can't speak for a Thrunite drop-in, but a Malkoff needs the ID opened up.
 

ARA

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Jun 24, 2009
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Thank you sir for the clear explanation.

Aw well, might as well stick with the KX4 head.

Just an observation though might be helpful for others. the Surefire website still has the BP60L Led conversion head for the incandescent forends. I still cannot understand why they have not upgraded/updated its LED when the KX4 is a cheaper and higher output replacement. i have yet to test it at the range though to give a complete review.
 

ARA

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Jun 24, 2009
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All rights guys, i need your input on this lego. :stupid:

I tried a Z2 battery tube on the forend housing and the setup works though now i have three primary cells running the M61 rather than two. Since this is not the manufacturers intended use of the Z2 body as it lacks the flange/plastic ring preventing the batteries from moving ahead during recoil, will this setup work reliably or should i just stick with the stock 2 batteries combo with the KX4 bezel ?
 

ARA

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Jun 24, 2009
Messages
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All rights guys, i need your input on this lego. :stupid:

I tried a Z2 battery tube on the forend housing and the setup works though now i have three primary cells running the M61 rather than two. Since this is not the manufacturers intended use of the Z2 body as it lacks the flange/plastic ring preventing the batteries from moving ahead during recoil, will this setup work reliably or should i just stick with the stock 2 batteries combo with the KX4 bezel ?

:poke: Anyone
 

angelofwar

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Nov 17, 2007
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South Carolina
All rights guys, i need your input on this lego. :stupid:

I tried a Z2 battery tube on the forend housing and the setup works though now i have three primary cells running the M61 rather than two. Since this is not the manufacturers intended use of the Z2 body as it lacks the flange/plastic ring preventing the batteries from moving ahead during recoil, will this setup work reliably or should i just stick with the stock 2 batteries combo with the KX4 bezel ?

I tried this with a 6P...while it worked, I didn't like the threads being exposed. I'd just get a 660 body and stick with that. or an LU20 will work as well with a millenium head
 
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