I'm less than happy with Cree based lights

[orbital]

Its taken how many threads.....

Hmmm, I guess I'm one of the few who didn't get a Fenix.

 

[Outdoors Fanatic]

I agree 100%. But I think your problem is with the Fenix lights, not with Cree emitters itself. You should wait for the SureFire Cree-based lights (also check it out the Amilite Neo T5). Some brands are not here to deliver useful life-warranty tools, but rather to make a quick buck selling overmarketed toys.

I too, prefer the KISS approach, reliability and quality over bells and whistles, and that's why the SF E1E is still my favorite EDC.

 

[orbital]

11 threads about Fenix on the very first page under LED, I'm at a loss for words.

 

[Raven]

This is the price that early adaptors pay.

 

[mpc]

I bought a fenix L0D LuxIII, about 5 minutes before the L0D-CE came out. I recently upgraded the standard L0D to an SSC Ubin. This was my first mod so it was a bit of a rough job. Comparing the L0D-SSC to the L0D-CE, I am convinced that the SSC is not quite as bright - but the beam produced is much better for my needs. Nice and smooth, large diameter flood with no rings. The hotspot transitions well into the sidespill.

As for the flicker issue. I have ordered a Rex 2.0 (cree) from Kai Domain, Rexlight have claimed to have solved the flicker problem. Initially it seemed from Kai's original posting that this could be down to current regulation rather than PWM. From the revised advert for the Rex, it isn't really stated clearly - just that they have sorted the flicker out - so it could be high frequency PWM I suppose.

 

[savumaki]

I find this stuff about 'too small a spot' and 'brighter is not always better' a bit precious, when it's so easy to stick a bit of translucent tape (Scotch Magic) on the lens or even spray it with a bit of hairspray, which I'm sure all you ladies keep in your handbags. Brighter is always better when it's for the same power.

w

Oh, you mean like buying a 600 hp motor and putting a governor on it ?

 

[BrightIdeaOSU]

I have the Neo T5, and it solves all of the mentioned issues; simple and quick low-high-off interface, nice floody beam that fills the whole area of the woods with light, yet it has a useful hotspot to fill in distant objects. The McGizmo reflector in the T5 is worth the few extra bucks for the light, IMHO, and the machining quality on the Amilite is better than any of my Fenix lights.

 

[EngrPaul]

I just pulled a Cree star out of my previously modded Brinkmann 3W LED flashlight and replaced it with a Seoul P4 star. World of difference! What a beautiful beam. With the Cree, I was getting ready to replace the flashlight and sell it dirt cheap.

 

[Curious_character]

I find this stuff about 'too small a spot' and 'brighter is not always better' a bit precious, when it's so easy to stick a bit of translucent tape (Scotch Magic) on the lens or even spray it with a bit of hairspray, which I'm sure all you ladies keep in your handbags. Brighter is always better when it's for the same power.

w

I'm also a fan of the tape method. It reduces the light output by an insignificant 10% and makes a good flood. And it's easily reversible. It's never any problem to make a light more floody. But sharpening up a beam is a lot tougher to do.

I've got the best of both worlds. I put a Seoul P4 into my P1, so it puts out just about the same amount of light (when running on a Li-ion cell) as my P1D CE. The P1 has tape over the lens, so I use it when I want flood, and the P1D CE when I want throw. Each acts as a spare battery carrier, and spare light, for the other. And both together are smaller and lighter than most single lights.

c_c

 

[Sinjz]

Nice post. I'm glad to read threads where people aren't afraid to give thier personal informed opinion, even if it may not be popular to the masses. It also saves me the agony of lusting after some of these lights.

 

[woodrow]

Sounds like its a Fenix thing, but everyone is differnt.

 

[patycake57]

Please!,
First, you've misquoted me...

Al

I apologize about the misquotes. I found your OP points entirely reasonable and a valid viewpoint. Your second post in this thread is well reasoned, and I certainly agree that criticism is important.

However, there is constructive criticism and bashing. When you start off with "A crusade for usability" and in the middle state that the "L2D CE is a prime example...", you not only state that these lights are not for you, but imply that these lights are poorly designed (e.g. by the sales department). Given the number of people who like the P1D CE and L2D CE, I think that implication is incorrect. There simply is no universal metric for "usability." My point is that these types of extraneous statements are simply not necessary, and have been propogated throughout the thread by many others in statements of poor engineering, profiteering-whatever random thoughts people want to post which may or may not have anything to do with the light or reality.

 

[GeorgePaul]

...and most of all the dismal battery run time graphs on flashlightreviews.com which immediately made it known that this light was not for me.

Why do you think the run time is "dismal"?

 

[Gator762]

It sounds like your complaint with the CREE lights is easily fixed with some Scotch tape.

It's hard to see it as a problem... Different people have different needs, so who do you market to? Seems most want throw, and that's what most are geared toward. If you want spill, that's pretty easy to customize for your need. The most common complaint I have read here is that LEDs don't throw as far, so can you blame them for focusing on throw and not spill or flood?

I also have a L1D CE/L2D CE, but have not had any flickering problems. I have only used a few different NiMH cells so far. But from what I've read, your problems with Lithium cells are the exception, not the rule.

 

[daveman]

A crusade for usability.

The P1D CE, unlike my older P1D is just too tightly focused and doesn't have enough side spill... Maybe a PID with a CREE,... bright, lots of flood, minimal hotspot.

You obviously prefer a floody, spill-oriented light. As a flashaholic (or maybe you're not), you would, of course, know that there is a time and place for flood lights, and there is a time and place for throw lights. So....why are you complaining about a light that has more throw than flood?

The least useful is the new L2D CE I recently purchased... I was far less impressed by the aesthetics of it, it is, to be frank, just plain ugly, it's too long to carry anywhere except in a bag or in the holster and no use to me since I wear a suit.

Some men, (to be frank...), simply have smaller builds and hands, and consequently, wear smaller pants with smaller pockets that can't comfortably fit a 6 inch tube. The rest of us don't have that problem. So you say the L2D CE is at fault because it's 6 inches long with 120 lumens to play with. Why is it that you didn't fault the Mag 6Ds, 5Ds, 4Ds, 3Ds, 2Ds, Surefire U2s, L2s, L5s, Inova XO3s, XOs, or any other light with a bigger size and less output as too big?

The initial mode of (L2D CE's) ultra dim isn't well suited at all for such a large light (by today's standards). While it's certainly nice to have that mode, I always need to click to step up the brightness and half the time end up turning it off in the process...

If you REALLY have a L2D CE as you say, then you would surely know that the L2D CE has a turbo mode which allows you to start off with max output with a simple twist of the bezel. If it's simply a case where you don't know how to operate the light as the rest of us, then how does the fault lie with the torch?

And I hate the beam; in an effort to get maximum throw and a flawless spot, nearly all useful side spill has been sacrificed. I have to point it like a laser beam and then I get a useless blinding spot. It's a good throw light, that's for sure, but not at all useful for close work on any mode.

Again, us flashahoics usually (more like always) have a set of flood lights, and a set of throw lights. So you hate the L2D CE for because "It's a good throw light"??? Why don't just get rid of your throw lights and buy flood lights? No need to fault a torch (or its users) because it's a flood light.

My sample of the L2D CE is also not at all friendly to battery types as I can only use NiMH. Others samples seem to fair better, but in mine a brand new pair of Lithium's will only run for perhaps a minute before the light starts blinking rapidly in Turbo mode (the only useful mode for a light this size).

That's weird, mine runs at max output for more than 120 minutes on lithium AAs. I guss you got a lemon, exchange it with the dealer you bought it from. From which dealer on CPF did you buy it from again?



I see you mentioned that you've operated L2D CE in the Turbo mode. Then you would know that max output comes on first during turbo mode. Then why did you, earlier in your post, complain that the "initial" mode is not the max output? I'm really confused by your post here...

...I'm beginning to wonder if the design of the lights and/or the optics available to build them with has dictated they will never be very useful except where intense hotspot and long throw are all that's desired; which, in my opinion, is not what most people usually need.

So...you know what "most" people need? That's really...amazing...I'm rather speechless.



Just kidding, but I am incredibly impressed though. The bottom line is, you do understand the simple concept that, throw lights are, just like flood lights, useful in certain situations, right? If you do understand, then why are you complaining about lack of flood in a light that throws?

The 2ndGen Arc AAA-P is a tough light to beat for daily use. It's tiny, wonderfully bright, has a fine flood, projects well enough in darkness and runs forever on a Lithium AAA.

Yeah, but it doesn't throw. Aren't you going to complain about that?

Sorry – I know this will annoy a lot of people because it rubs against the grain, but let's see what you carry in your pocket after the novelty of the latest toy wears off; which light it is you reach for a dozen times a day.

I reach for my L2D CE.


See, Al, your post is annoying (as much as it is illogical) not so much because it rubs against anything but rather because it lacks cogency. Maybe a throw light will help you clear whatever's been fogging up your mind?

By careful study of other peoples reviews, their comments and complaints, and most of all the dismal battery run time graphs on flashlightreviews.com which immediately made it known that this light (L2D CE) was not for me.

The L2D CE produces 120 lumens out the front for more than 120 minutes on 2 lithium AAs. Under comparison, the Surefire U2 can only do, at most, 120 lumens, at least, 65 lumens ( ) for LESS than 50 minutes on CR123s.

I guess if the L2D CE's runtime is "dismal" for you, then the Surefire U2's runtime is downright pathetic?




A lot of inchoherent posts in this thread. Maybe the original posters should explain the points I highlighted above, just so no noob would confused when he reads this thread.

 

[bill_n_opus]

It's great you have an opinion and that you decided to flesh out your opinion to the forum ... so based on reading your post may I be so bold and forward to give you my impression:

- many of your "points" are personal and subjective and you relegate your wording to be very slanted in nature. That's a weakness and you may want to reconsider your vocabulary or at least your assessment skills.

- you have a "box of useless lights". Consider that if a person actually has a "box" of sorts labelled with a negative moniker as a catchment of "lights that do not satsify that person" - does that say something about those lights ... or does it say more about that person? What is your response? I lean towards asking the latter question.

- just to take a quote from you:

The least useful is the new L2D CE I recently purchased. I know everyone's in love with this light, its brightness and throw, and when I received mine a few days ago I too was initially very impressed by those features. However, I was far less impressed by the aesthetics of it, it is, to be frank, just plain ugly, it's too long to carry anywhere except in a bag or in the holster and no use to me since I wear a suit.

Here's a selected statement that is full of holes. "Aesthetics" is the definition of subjective. "Plain ugly" for you is "good looking" to someone else. "Too long to carry anywhere ..." - people carry it around for sure. Just because you have a difficult time making it meet your needs does not make it a failed EDC. An EDC the l2d-ce is not.

You wear a suit. That's nice, don't you think that it's superflous to even make a statement considering you wear suits all the time? It's silly to make such a statement - carry an Orb Raw instead - the lesson here is to use the appropriate tool for the appropriate situation. Here's mine:

"I wear spandex all the time - the l2d-ce is useless to me and is now relegated to my box of useless lights"

- you begin your post with the statement "a crusade for usability" - but after reading your post it sounds more like you're having a hard time satisfying your own expectations - and it's easier to find flaws and comment on them rather than discretely analyze your own flawed system of assessment(?). How about "a crusade to understand myself"?

I could go on .. but it would probably be construed as a personal attack of which i'm absolutely trying not to make it sound like.

What i'm trying to say is this:

personal expectations is a function of that person.

It takes much analytical thought sometimes to separate the person from the function and the product that serves that person/function - in this case flashlights. Lines get crossed, blurred, you get the idea. Sometimes an introspective analysis is needed when expectations are not met.

I try all the time to get my wife to understand that concept ... she's quite stubborn you see.

but let's see what you carry in your pocket after the novelty of the latest toy wears off; which light it is you reach for a dozen times a day.

This is a very insightful statement. It has impact and truth. One thing is for sure, you finished strong on your post.

(personally, I reach for my l2d-ce because it's bright, lasts a long time, I carry it everywhere despite being the size of a cigar because I know it's not an EDC and I can actually find it when I need it, I love using NiMh batteries, I don't wear suits, yes the beam is ringy but I don't whitewall hunt and in everyday use I don't notice it at all, it looks fine even though I prefer my l2p, however, i'm beginning to think the l2d-ce shape is more functional)

 

[daveman]

You wear a suit. That's nice, don't you think that it's superflous to even make a statement considering you wear suits all the time? It's silly to make such a statement - carry an Orb Raw instead - the lesson here is to use the appropriate tool for the appropriate situation. Here's mine:


"I wear spandex all the time - the l2d-ce is useless to me and is now relegated to my box of useless lights"

Oh....this is gold...thanks for the laugh, Bill.

 

[mtn_dance]

This was a very thought provoking and interesting post, until personal comments about the poster were added; I think challenge the post and not the person yields more information, and credibility.

Someones views about why they do not like a light are as helpful to this rookie flashaholic as all the glowing reviews. This has been one of the best threads I have read on CPF, (ignoring the personal comments aimed at the OP).

 

[SEMIJim]

Al, some of your comments reflect precisely why I have yet to pull the trigger on a new light. My main problem has been they've all been too throwy and not enough floody. But now comes the Amilite Neo T5. More floody than its competition, but still with a hot spot good for some range. Simple low-high-off reverse clicky. Choice of either 15 or 30 lumen low. I believe it's DC-DC boost/regulation, so no flickering. 5-Star rated by flashlightreviews. I'm just waiting for a U.S. distributor to start carrying them and I think I'm gonna pull the trigger on this one.

Another light that's a bit more floody than its competition is the Huntlight that's using an SSC P4. (Couldn't tell you which model, off-hand.) But I believe it's also PWM, so you may experience the flickering issue at lower brightness'.

 

[Lobo]

This was a very thought provoking and interesting post, until personal comments about the poster were added; I think challenge the post and not the person yields more information, and credibility.

Someones views about why they do not like a light are as helpful to this rookie flashaholic as all the glowing reviews. This has been one of the best threads I have read on CPF, (ignoring the personal comments aimed at the OP).

Can't agree with that this is a very thought provoking post. All of the complaints the OP had on cree lights, where only on Fenix lights, so the title is missleading to say the least. On top of that, most complaints didnt make much sense or they we're very subjective. L2D not being bright on initial mode? If you actually used the light, you should know that if you twist the head, it will START on turbo (and the irony of the OP complaining that Fenix should send out the lights to real user before deciding on design). A throwlight being throwy? A 2AA light being to large for suit EDC, shame on Fenix not designing a 2AA light that shrinks the batteries when they are in the tube! Could as well complain about the light not being pink. It's like he bought the light without any research at all what he was getting and then was dissapointed and figured the only reason could be bad engineering. It's like buying a car and finding out it doesnt go 0-100km/h in 5sec and then complain about it. The only valid complaint I understood was the lights being to throwy, but that's what they were designed for. If you want a floody light, buy one, there are plenty, and start a thread named "throw vs flood"(which there allready are a couple of hundreds of). His crusade for usability dont do much for anyone else that dont have the same needs he has.
True, the two earlier post (and mine also maybe) could have been nicer, but they have very valid points. The OP is of course entitled to voice his opinion, but so are the rest of us.

Oh, one thing I can agree with the op is that the later generation of lights have to many useless and gimicky feature, but that's the beauty of the Fenix L1D and L2D, you don't have to ever see those features if you dont want to. It's a simple click on, click off and turn the bezel for output kind of light if you want to.
Cheers.