Overtaking vs passing

[idleprocess]

After a ~yearlong break from road trips I've come to the conclusion that the greater driving public has gotten worse at making the distinction between the two terms.

• Overtaking : Continuously driving faster than another vehicle on the road
• Passing : A series of time-limited maneuvers executed to complete overtaking another vehicle

To wit: far too many drivers opt to merely semi-passively overtake other vehicles rather than actively pass them - often at a literal walking pace (<5PMH). This is dangerous in any level of traffic for several reasons:

1. This involves disappearing into the blind spot and lingering there for several seconds
2. The apparent movement is so low that motion camouflage mechanics come into play - there's not enough movement in the peripheral to trigger prompt awareness of the oncoming vehicle
3. Other motorists attempting to pass stack up, becoming impatient and often passing on the right the moment there's minimum adequate clearance

When driving on the highway I actively pass vehicles that I am overtaking:

1. At -10 car lengths to other vehicle's rear bumper (simultaneously): accelerate +10MPH, disable cruise control, change to the left lane
2. As front bumper reaches -1 car length relative to slower vehicle's front bumper: trend towards the left edge of the lane to minimize bow wake impact
3. +1 car length gap: let off accelerator, re-enable cruise control
4. +5-10 car lengths gap: change to right lane

This should be a ≤30 second maneuver to get around an OTR truck pulling a 53' trailer; less for smaller vehicles. OTR trucks are what I end up passing most of the time thus the closure rate during the pass ends up being at least +15MPH. As a I cruise at the speed limit this does involve short periods of time exceeding the speed limit, however it keeps the left lane clear, minimizes time in blind spots, is highly visible to the vehicle being passed, and thus seems immensely safer.

TL;DR it's best driving technique to overtake then pass rather than just overtake.

 

[hamhanded]

Cool!

Now do one for merging onto highways from a surface street.

 

[Olumin]

I find your ideas intriguing, and would like to subscribe to your newsletter.

 

[badtziscool]

When driving on the highway I actively pass vehicles that I am overtaking:

1. At -10 car lengths to other vehicle's rear bumper (simultaneously): accelerate +10MPH, disable cruise control, change to the left lane
2. As front bumper reaches -1 car length relative to slower vehicle's front bumper: trend towards the left edge of the lane to minimize bow wake impact
3. +1 car length gap: let off accelerator, re-enable cruise control
4. +5-10 car lengths gap: change to right lane

Seems like most people forget this vital step.

 

[idleprocess]

Seems like most people forget this vital step.

Indeed. They often keep trundling on left lane cruiser style or snap into the right lane at +½ car length gap, threatening to irrecoverably upset their suspension in the process.

 

[bykfixer]

When I pass in dry weather I raise my speed to 10mph over the vehicle I'm passing and wait until I see the at least entire vehicle in my (in the cab) rear view mirror. I generally knew how fast they were going and stay at least 1mph over that. At times that vehicle ends up passing me then slows down to less than I'm going. Very annoying.

In wet weather I tend to wait until several car lengths past so as not to cover their wind shield with my "spray".

As a rule I'm the car most people pass.

In my state there is an antiquated law that states you are supposed to honk the horn as you pass. It probably stems from days before the interstates were built when a roadway was generally a two way direction without a median.

 

[idleprocess]

As a rule I'm the car most people pass.

Assuming you're otherwise traveling at highway speeds there's nothing wrong with that.

On paper, cruising at 85MPH vs 75MPH (speed limit +10MPH on interstates in my region) on a 300 mile road trip saves 28 minutes. In reality I've found that the actual time savings will be perhaps half that. Driving at +10 makes you the figurative fastest vehicle on the road, obliging one to not only pass with great frequency, but also decelerate with great frequency as other vehicles pass at speeds generally below your cruising speed. This contributes to additional stress, wear on components, and fuel consumption.

 

[badtziscool]

Indeed. They often keep trundling on left lane cruiser style or snap into the right lane at +½ car length gap, threatening to irrecoverably upset their suspension in the process.

I'm sure part of the reason some people are overly eager to move back over to the right is because of the other side of the spectrum where they're being tailgated by overly aggressive drivers thinking that will send a message for those to move out of the passing lane.

Funny story related to this. I was driving down a freeway, passing someone on the left as you described. An overly aggressive driver comes up behind me and gets right on my tail. I pass the car on the right enough to move over, but I guess it wasn't fast enough for him, so mid way over, he jumps onto the shoulder to pass me up and cuts me off. Of course I react by raising my hand at him, and the goes to brake check me and the three vehicles behind. One of those vehicles was an unmarked police officer who proceeded to light up and pull the offender over.

I rolled down my windows and made sure the driver saw the pure joy that was on my face.

 

[bykfixer]

At speed limit or a couple mph over IP. I'm in no hurry and enjoy music while driving. I stay in the right lane until nearing busy interchanges where if practical I move over a lane and back over to settle in behind the vehicles that had come from the interchange.

The last few weeks I travel at about 8:30-9 pm and have at times made sure I'm driving around the speed limit because I'm passing so many vehicles. Strangely enough it seems at that time of day many motorists are driving well under the speed limit.

 

[Lumen83]

There is nothing wrong with passing slowly. You shouldn't have to drive faster than you are comfortable with just to make the pass. Just be mindful of those behind you and move over into the right lane after making the pass.

 

[idleprocess]

I'm sure part of the reason some people are overly eager to move back over to the right is because of the other side of the spectrum where they're being tailgated by overly aggressive drivers thinking that will send a message for those to move out of the passing lane.

I've found that passing at a closure rate of ≥10 MPH greatly reduces these shenanigans. However it still happens. On those occasions I make a point to both signal early and - because the closure rate is significant - execute the return to the right lane as they clear the bumper of the slower vehicle.

At speed limit or a couple mph over IP. I'm in no hurry and enjoy music while driving. I stay in the right lane until nearing busy interchanges where if practical I move over a lane and back over to settle in behind the vehicles that had come from the interchange.

I try to maintain cruising speed which means often passing slower-moving vehicles. In cases of 'convoys' in the right lane -I'll remain in the left lane for a few minutes at a time rather than change lanes every 30 seconds - if someone is rolling up on me at +10 MPH and I've got >10 seconds until I'm within ~10 car lengths of a slower vehicle in the right I'll change over and let them pass.

The last few weeks I travel at about 8:30-9 pm and have at times made sure I'm driving around the speed limit because I'm passing so many vehicles. Strangely enough it seems at that time of day many motorists are driving well under the speed limit.

I've noticed this as well. I know that the highways I take routinely used to have night speed limits -5MPH relative to the daytime limits, but this was done away with some 5 years ago.

There is nothing wrong with passing slowly.

Except for the reasons I've laid out in the first post: the first two prolong time spent in proximity to another vehicle at speed under conditions of low observability while the latter - while not excusable - is predicable and consistent behavior on the highway that I've observed over tens of thousands of miles of road trips.

You shouldn't have to drive faster than you are comfortable with just to make the pass.

It's one thing if the vehicle is incapable of the maneuver:

• The vehicle lacks the performance to accelerate: i.e.18-wheelers take something like 3 minutes to pass on another because they lack the power at those speeds to accelerate quickly
• A vehicle is unusually burdened and thus struggles to simple maintain a cruising speed
• There are other situational conditions that make such a maneuver unsafe

Just be mindful of those behind you and move over into the right lane after making the pass.

I will say that if one does not wish to execute a pass and instead slowly overtake, the best time is when there is no oncoming traffic that is likely to be delayed. But do endeavor to reduce impeding other motorists and otherwise attempt to remain conspicuous to the vehicle being overtaken - I've seen more close calls as a result of slow passing than anything else on the highway.

 

[Fuzzywuzzies]

After a ~yearlong break from road trips I've come to the conclusion that the greater driving public has gotten worse at making the distinction between the two terms.
---
TL;DR it's best driving technique to overtake then pass rather than just overtake.

I have to say, I genuinely appreciate the time that went into conceiving and solidifying this 'philosophy of travel'!
This is (perhaps unfortunately?!) how I also think, as I spend long hours on the road almost every single day, and always somewhere different.
I drive a truck, and our laws specify that I have to drive slightly slower than than the normal speed limit, so I'm on the receiving end of these shenanigans multiple times a day. I installed a train horn, and when used sparingly and precisely, I feel sure that I'm slowly but surely raising the IQ of our nation's motorists...! (That and increasing their laundry... but hey, at least it helps avoid collisions!)
Good note about the bow wake too, that's one that most folks don't even think about. I once avoided a bad crash while driving a small bus full of people on a very gusty day; we suddenly passed a truck coming the other way at the exact same time as there was a break in the shelter belt on the roadside. I preemptively counter-steered, and kept her straight enough to pull out in one piece. Afterwards I was never sure if we actually took the two-wheel challenge, but it was a close thing all the same.

 

[Sjvalleydave]

On a 2 pane road, one in each direction, when I'm passing a car/truck get within a couple lengths, make sure oncoming is clear, kick it down to 3rd gear, grab a big handful and wham, up to a 100mph in no time, pull my bike back to the right and keep on going...350,000 miles over the years on a bike..

 

[Poppy]

Depending upon traffic conditions, and my mood, I do a combination of active and or passive passing.
I do my best to keep from allowing another driver to pull up next to me and ride next to me in an adjacent lane. I'll either speed up, or back off.
Also, I do my best to keep about 15 feet distance for each 10mph from the car in front of me. If I have an idiot following too closely behind me, I'll slow more to allow a greater stopping distance between me and the car in front of me. This saved me from more than a couple rear end crashes, when traffic suddenly came to a halt.

Once, I didn't have enough room, but minimized the amount of damage, and there was no personal injury. I was in relatively heavy traffic, on the interstate, but it was moving along at the posted limit. I kept my usual distance, maybe a little less. Suddenly traffic came to an abrupt halt! I had to hit my brakes hard, and stopped about a car length behind the car in front of me, but looking in my rear view mirror, I knew that the car behind me, wasn't going to be able to stop, so I rolled up until I was almost at the bumper of the car in front of me, to allow the guy behind me some additional stopping room.

He almost made it, but, hit me and drove me into the car in front of me. The plastic frame of the license plate holder cracked, otherwise there was no damage. No personal injuries!

I hate tailgaters.

When I am about to change lanes, I give good warning, and move from one lane to another rather slowly, so there are no surprises. I also hate it when I am approaching an exit ramp, and put my directional on and the idiot behind me decides he is going to pass me on the right within the exit ramp entrance. When that is about to happen, I'll typically more rapidly pull over. That way the idiot will have a choice, slow down, rear end me, or try to squeeze by on the right, and maybe be the cause of a sideswipe accident.

 

[Poppy]

MIRRORS:
It is important to always maintain situational awareness.

I am constantly checking my mirrors.
I don't have any blind spots.
I have gotten into other people's cars where the side view mirrors are positioned such that when one looks into them, half of the mirror view is occupied by the side of the vehicle. That makes for huge blind spots.

I want to be able to see, either with my peripheral vision, or the side view mirror, a vehicle in my adjacent lane. That means that the angle of the mirror is angled outward, somewhat. If I want to see the side of my car, I have to move my head. If I want to see way down the lane, to see and judge the speed of oncoming traffic so I can merge into that lane, I have to move my head. But in either case I have plenty of time to do that. However, If I need to make an emergency change of lanes, all I have to do is glance over.

I can use the rear view mirror to see approaching vehicles in all three lanes, to know what is going on behind me.

 

[idleprocess]

I drive a truck, and our laws specify that I have to drive slightly slower than than the normal speed limit, so I'm on the receiving end of these shenanigans multiple times a day.

Oh I've no doubt you play spectator to more than a few motorists executing aggressive right-lane passes with slightly >1 car length of clearance and just hope it's enough.

And I do appreciate that trucks simply drive slower for reasons of physics if nothing else.

Good note about the bow wake too, that's one that most folks don't even think about.

So I don't know if this impacts OTR trucks but on the occasions I've been passed at speed I feel that push and know to anticipate it. The effect seems to be most pronounced on large surface area / lightweight vehicles - slab-sided motorhomes and lightweight recreational trailers are the most susceptible.

On a 2 pane road, one in each direction, when I'm passing a car/truck get within a couple lengths, make sure oncoming is clear, kick it down to 3rd gear, grab a big handful and wham, up to a 100mph in no time, pull my bike back to the right and keep on going.

FWIW my experience the last ~decade has been primarily interstates (minimum 4 lanes) and this is written from the perspective of country rather than city driving. However on a 2-lane road one is often obligated to pass decisively or not at all.

I do my best to keep from allowing another driver to pull up next to me and ride next to me in an adjacent lane. I'll either speed up, or back off.

If a left lane cruiser is crawling up on me at +1 MPH and I'm within ~20 car lengths of a vehicle I'm overtaking I'll generally initiate the pass early - particularly if there are vehicles crawling up on them. I too find vehicles in adjacent lanes travelling at similar speeds uncomfortable and know there's potential for shenanigans as the left lane cruiser does the rolling road block routine for a minute-plus and irritates other motorists.

I hate tailgaters.

Same. They're a hazard.

They also tend not to accept the natural speed of a given stretch of highway at a given time. Outside of truly open highway with negligible traffic, exceeding this speed becomes increasingly more difficult and risky.

I've also noted that while tailgaters are often willing to drive markedly faster than the average speed they're so ineffectual in their approach that I can often catch up to and pass them, leaving them stuck in a convoy of slower traffic without increasing my cruising speed. Bump drafting doesn't sufficiently encourage other motorists to make way to improve one's pace.

When I am about to change lanes, I give good warning, and move from one lane to another rather slowly, so there are no surprises.

I tend to make maneuvers with several lanes of clearance so I make them briskly - check for clearance, touch the signal, and about time the automatic 3-flash sequence has terminated I'm starting to straighten out in the other lane.

It is important to always maintain situational awareness.

Indeed. Watching other motorists - on city streets, urban highways, interstates, country roads - I'm convinced that the average driver is consistently failing to utilize their senses in order to build and maintain this awareness. I feel like some of this is distraction - yelling at kids, looking at their GD phones, futzing with their infotainment systems - but some of this is a failure to look further ahead and also a failure to properly fill in blanks based on limited information.

On the latter point I was close witness to a collision recently. I was waiting to turn left at a signal on a 6-lane divided road behind another vehicle along a sweeping right curve. Signal was flashing yellow arrow - yield to any oncoming traffic, of which there was a steady flow. I glanced up as the flow started to clear and the vehicle in front of my started to inch forward. As a vehicle in the innermost lane started to clear the intersection I sensed something was wrong. The vehicle in front of me committed and my perception caught up with the situation - a vehicle in the outer lane was oncoming at perhaps 60 MPH, had been partially masked by the vehicle in the inner lane, and contrasted poorly with its surroundings. The collision was sufficiently energetic to knock the turning car into a third vehicle waiting to turn right. No one reacted. Entire situation took less than 5 seconds to unfold. Mercifully no one appeared to be seriously injured.

 

[orbital]

+

Last year I had to go to Walgreens to ship something back via FedEx.
It was early in the morning and one of the women working there, who was older, said to another older women 'you just have to go with the flow'
They couldn't see me because their back were toward me,, walking past I said, quote of the day, 'you just have to go with the flow'
Obviously was going to mention this in the Speed Limit thread, but if people are NOT passing and overtaking, Interstates & Highways will be safer.
=it's all about people not having to change lanes=

When I lived in California, I5 could be bumper to bumper or going 80,, you had to adapt, period.

People have to stop looking in their rear view mirror and drive forward to the pace of traffic,,
regardless if you're eating, posting, almost sleeping, smoking, drinking a 90oz. soda, watching porn,, whatever.

Cops will not bother you if you're prudently flowing with traffic, even if it's well over the posted number.

 

[Lumen83]

Except for the reasons I've laid out in the first post: the first two prolong time spent in proximity to another vehicle at speed under conditions of low observability while the latter - while not excusable - is predicable and consistent behavior on the highway that I've observed over tens of thousands of miles of road trips.

I agree that it is not a good idea to spend a lot of time side by side with another vehicle. But I think people get too hung up on those who aren't passing with the aggressiveness or speed that they would prefer. As long as someone is passing at a reasonable rate and not hanging side by side, and they pull into the right lane after, that is fine.

 

[idleprocess]

if people are NOT passing and overtaking, Interstates & Highways will be safer.

Indeed, but they are and will, thus we should endeavor to reduce risk to ourselves and others.

I agree that it is not a good idea to spend a lot of time side by side with another vehicle. But I think people get too hung up on those who aren't passing with the aggressiveness or speed that they would prefer. As long as someone is passing at a reasonable rate and not hanging side by side, and they pull into the right lane after, that is fine.

So what do you consider a reasonable rate?

A +1MPH closure rate is a delta of 1.47 feet per second. An object of reasonable size moving at this speed is perceptible under normal circumstances such as sitting still, walking, etc where you have the margin to scan widely and investigate movement in your peripheral vision. Much less so in a moving automobile where you are obligated to limit your scanning to a forward angle which decreases with speed.

So expending on +1MPH. A nominal car length is something like 15 feet or 10.2 seconds at +1MPH. Add in -5 car lengths for some degree of safety and that interval to parity is 61.2 seconds or 112 seconds to pull ahead by +5 car lengths, and a good third or so of the approach will be spent in the blind spot (some folks like @Poppy will adjust their mirrors to avoid said blind spot but most don't). An OTR truck hauling a 53' trailer is a maximum 65' long so you're at 143.3 seconds to fully pass with just 5 car lengths of margin; 248.3 seconds to do it with a more comfortable 10 car lengths of margin.

Bump closure rates to +5MPH and there's a factor 5 change - 7.35 feet per second delta, 22.4 seconds to pass an automobile with -/+ 5 car lengths' margin, 49.7 seconds to pass an OTR truck with -/+ 10 car lengths' margin.

I've seen overtakes that took more than five minutes to clear an automobile and going on 10 minutes to clear an OTR truck with minimal clearances and in situations with traffic a deluge of passes on the right as soon as there's enough room to get around. I've also experienced being passed at such a low closure rate that I did not notice the seemingly static vehicle behind me change lanes and disappear into my blind spot only to surprise me creeping forward to my left minutes later. Which begs the question - why bother passing at all since the time savings will at best amount to low single minutes per full day of driving? Bump the cruise control down by -1MPH and live a happier life.

 

[jabe1]

Great thread. I drive roughly 20k miles/year and I'm still amazed at some of the driving habits I see on a daily basis, especially regarding lane usage and passing.
I've always said that there are more people "riding" in their cars than there are actually driving them.
From all of the comments, this is reinforced; throw in distraction from cell phone usage while moving, and it's downright dangerous out there.