Question on Mini Lathe/mill combo

[Nitroz]

Santa might deliver a lathe or lathe/mill combo to my house.

Here's my question. Is is better to have just a mini lathe, or a lathe/mill combo?

As much as I would like to have a huge lathe, that would be above the budget. Any input from Mini lathe owners would be appreciated.

 

[gadget_lover]

You might look at http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=205468 where a similar question was asked.

In general, a combo will have some advantages and disadvantages. Don't expect the mill to be as usable as a dedicated mill. The lathe is often just as good as a stand alone lathe.

Some of the combo units are really very small, so check for a forum or yahoo group that is dedicated to the one you are considering. There you will learn about shortcomings as well as tricks that make it even more usable.

There are also mid sized lathe / mill combos that weigh nearly 1000 pounds, so always double check the specs!


Daniel

 

[Nitroz]

Thanks for all the suggestions and links!

I think I might go with just a dedicated lathe, and if money allows later a mill. The Grizzly 7 x 12 looks like a nice lathe.

I have a question for Grizzly owners.

Does the Grizzly 7 x 12 have automatic gears? In that you do not have to change belts?

I need to search and read up some more on the operation of lathes. I was a machinist in the 90's and ran a boring machine and a hone, but never had a chance to operate the lathe before I left.

 

[will]

The Grizzly 7x12 lathe is from the same factory that makes Harbor Freight, Enco, and a few other brands of mini lathes. I have an Enco 7x10 lathe. I have used it for wood cuttting and aluminum cutting. It works very nicely for those softer materials. (I tried some stainless once with very poor results, Not sure if the stainless was hardened in some way.)

The opening in the 3" chuck is less than 3/4 inch, A mini-mag body will not fit inside the chuck opening. I bored my chuck out to 3/4 inch, the same as the spindle bore.

The motor speed is controlled by a dial, no belts to change, there is a high and low gear set in the back with a lever.

This is a small lathe, limited as to the size of materials you will be able to work with.

 

[Nitroz]

The Grizzly 7x12 lathe is from the same factory that makes Harbor Freight, Enco, and a few other brands of mini lathes. I have an Enco 7x10 lathe. I have used it for wood cuttting and aluminum cutting. It works very nicely for those softer materials. (I tried some stainless once with very poor results, Not sure if the stainless was hardened in some way.)

The opening in the 3" chuck is less than 3/4 inch, A mini-mag body will not fit inside the chuck opening. I bored my chuck out to 3/4 inch, the same as the spindle bore.

The motor speed is controlled by a dial, no belts to change, there is a high and low gear set in the back with a lever.

This is a small lathe, limited as to the size of materials you will be able to work with.

So working a "C" or "D" Mag body would be out of the question for a 7 x 12 lathe?

Sorry for the newb questions.

 

[gadget_lover]

It's not out of the question; it's a matter of what you are doing to the larger pieces and how you will hold them.

A C or D light being reduced to a 1 Cell shorty can be done.

Turning fins on a D cell head can be done easily.

Doing a tri-bore? That takes some special tricks, but even that can be done.

But if you can afford it, look for a bigger lathe. A 9 or 10 inch lathe will seldom have a bore large enough for a big Mag, but the chuck might.

Daniel

 

[will]

I have done external work on a 2 C or 2 D mag. The bed is not long enough to do inside threading on a 2 cell light. I question doing even inside work on a 1 cell light. The work is only being held by a small portion of the jaws on the chuck, Can it be done, probably, but the reality is that a mini lathe is just that, a mini machine..

 

[Nitroz]

Thanks for the excellent responses everyone.

I think to cut my teeth and because of my budget, I will start with a 7 x 12 Grizzly. I have much to learn and look forward to having even a mini-lathe around to do some things that are nearly impossible without one.

If anyone has any sugguestion or ideas for me, please chime in. Thanks!

 

[gadget_lover]

I have done external work on a 2 C or 2 D mag. The bed is not long enough to do inside threading on a 2 cell light. I question doing even inside work on a 1 cell light. The work is only being held by a small portion of the jaws on the chuck, Can it be done, probably, but the reality is that a mini lathe is just that, a mini machine..

I'm half drunk and feeling feisty, so read this fast. I might erase it in the morning.

You can do a lot with the mini-lathe using big machine techniques. Fixtures and supports are the answer.

For instance, a chuck is not the only way to hold a light. An expanding arbor with an MT3 shank, for instance, can extend half way up a 2 D maglight and will be held firmly in the headstock. Then you can do inside threading.

A steadyrest will hold the light safely while it's held in a chuck. A follower can be used too.

You can use a threaded fixture held in the chuck and simply thread the flashlight onto it.

Need an extra inch and a half? Remove the threading indicator.

Need yet another inch? Move the cutting bit to the right side of the tool post.

Need to bore a long piece? Clamp the piece to the compound and put the boring bar in the chuck. You can fit up to a 3/4 inch diameter boring bar through the chuck. My 3/4 inch bar is almost a foot long. Advance the boring bar a few inches at a time.

As I said, the 7x12 is not ideal for larger lights, but with some ingenuity you can make it work. But a bigger lathe is better.

So there. Thhhhpppt!

Daniel
P.S. That was a raspberry.

 

[will]

Daniel
I agree completely with you. My 7x10 does not have that extra inch or two for inside threading. Once you start to add the costs of the extra parts and tools to compensate for the small size, the money might be better spent getting a bigger lathe to begin with. Don't get me wrong, I have pushed mine to it's limits, maybe even a little beyond. I spent a few years as a prototype machinist, We were always figuring out ways to make unusual parts and componants. For the new lathe operator, simple is better.

 

[gadget_lover]

I think to cut my teeth and because of my budget, I will start with a 7 x 12 Grizzly. I have much to learn and look forward to having even a mini-lathe around to do some things that are nearly impossible without one.

The 7x12 is a good size to learn on. Even at that size, it can be dangerous. Find and read some safety material. A 3 inch chuck turning at 3000 rpm has a lot of kinetic energy and will not stop just because your fingers are in the way.

Beginner's suggestions:

Try to make things that match what you want them to be. Start with a drawing of what you are making. Do the math to make sure everything adds up.

Learn to count revolutions of the cranks. If it's .040 inch per revolution, then how many to move the compound 1/2 inch?

Buy at least a dial indicator and magnetic stand, a 4 or 6 inch caliper (dial or digital) and a magnifying glass.

Get small grinder. You will use it to sharpen your cutting tools.

Geeze. There are a thousand other suggestions. Some you learn through experience. Some you learn through study.


Daniel

 

[Nitroz]

Awesome guys! I am doing some reading on the mini-lathe web site also.

Once I do have a lathe I plan to take my time and get familiar with it's operation before trying to crank something out on it. I remember running a hydraulic hone and know how quickly something can be damaged or, gasp, be completely mangled.

It's just going to take some time and reading. I wonder if I could goto a local machine shop and watch the experts and learn some things from them that you can't get from reading.

 

[Nitroz]

I'm half drunk and feeling feisty, so read this fast. I might erase it in the morning.

You can do a lot with the mini-lathe using big machine techniques. Fixtures and supports are the answer.

For instance, a chuck is not the only way to hold a light. An expanding arbor with an MT3 shank, for instance, can extend half way up a 2 D maglight and will be held firmly in the headstock. Then you can do inside threading.

A steadyrest will hold the light safely while it's held in a chuck. A follower can be used too.

You can use a threaded fixture held in the chuck and simply thread the flashlight onto it.

Need an extra inch? Remove the trading indicator.

Need yet another inch? Move the cutting bit to the right side of the tool post.

Need to bore a long piece? Clamp the piece to the compound and put the boring bar in the chuck. You can fit up to a 3/4 inch diameter boring bar through the chuck. My 3/4 inch bar is almost a foot long. Advance the boring bar a few inches at a time.

As I said, the 7x12 is not ideal for larger lights, but with some ingenuity you can make it work. But a bigger lathe is better.

So there. Thhhhpppt!

Daniel
P.S. That was a raspberry.

Not so fast with the morning after deletion, feisty one.:nana:

Interesting ideas, even though some of them sound like greek to me until learn the terminology and the force.:shakehead:huh:

 

[VanIsleDSM]

Hi Nitroz.

I just went through this whole mini-lathe choice not too long ago. The grizzly is one of the more expensive versions you can get, but apparently it's worth it if you ever need any customer support. I bought my lathe from another company that's supposed to be great with customer support. I went with the micro-mark lathe. It's got some features that make it better than the other mini-lathes. For instance, it's 14 inches long, not 12 or 10. It also has a redesigned tailstock that allows you to turn longer pieces.. and it has a digital readout for the spindle speed, which can be pretty handy, metal gears in the headstock, and a few other little improvements. Now.. it's also a true-inch lathe. This was kind of a drawback for me, I prefer working in metric, however you might prefer that.

 

[Nitroz]

Hi Nitroz.

I just went through this whole mini-lathe choice not too long ago. The grizzly is one of the more expensive versions you can get, but apparently it's worth it if you ever need any customer support. I bought my lathe from another company that's supposed to be great with customer support. I went with the micro-mark lathe. It's got some features that make it better than the other mini-lathes. For instance, it's 14 inches long, not 12 or 10. It also has a redesigned tailstock that allows you to turn longer pieces.. and it has a digital readout for the spindle speed, which can be pretty handy, metal gears in the headstock, and a few other little improvements. Now.. it's also a true-inch lathe. This was kind of a drawback for me, I prefer working in metric, however you might prefer that.

Very nice! Decisions...decisions.

 

[gadget_lover]

If you think in inches, the true inch lathes are nice. The leadscrews for the compound and cross slide, for instance, are an even fraction of an inch. 20 ti means each turn of the handle will be .050 inches. A metric screw will end up being something like .042 inches per turn.


I decided to leave last night's drunken rant in place. While most of us will not go to the extreme lengths to make such fixtures, the concepts can be used in many instances to extend the usefulness of any machine.

I'm even toying with the thought of making a few madrels and other fixtures myself. How a bout a setback tool holder for internal threading ?

Daniel

 

[Nitroz]

If you think in inches, the true inch lathes are nice. The leadscrews for the compound and cross slide, for instance, are an even fraction of an inch. 20 ti means each turn of the handle will be .050 inches. A metric screw will end up being something like .042 inches per turn.


I decided to leave last night's drunken rant in place.

Daniel

It was a good rant.

I will do quite a bit of reading before I end up with my new lathe. I usually learn most things better hands on then I do reading. It is still important reading and learning tips and trick though.

 

[wquiles]

I agree with Daniel, will, and the other experienced folks here in the forum in that the 7x series lathes are GREAT to learn, but they are small machines. I learned on a Cummins 7x12, and now have a HF 8x14 - a much heavier and sturdy machine. If you don't mind changing belts to change gears (something that is easily done on the 7x12 due to the variable speed DC motor), then I can say that the HF 8x14 is a better machine:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=162307

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=171871

 

[Nitroz]

I could not find the 8 x 14 lathe on the HF page. I did find the 8 x 12.

Is that the one?

I noticed yours had metal gears, I would gladly change belts or whatever to have metal gears vs. plastic.

Do you have a link to the lathe you talked about above? Maybe they quit carrying it.

 

[Nitroz]

Oh boy! Now I am as confused as ever as to which lathe I might end up with.

I see myself easily trying to expand my budget for a better lathe. I might just start with a cheaper one, if I can contain myself, and then once I get familiar with that upgrade to a better one later.