SF new E1L vs Fenix P1D ce

Andromeda

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Nov 24, 2006
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After browsing through SF 2007 catalogue, I am really not impressed by the output of their new Cree based lights. Really disappointing. Take for example the E1L, it uses one CR123A but the maximum brightness is only 30 lumens (the catalogue says "Improved Performance"). Performance may means many things to many people, but majority of the people who are into this hobby would regard "Performance" as how bright the flashlight can produce. 30 lumens for a 1x CR123A with Cree led is really digusting :barf: That really defeats the purpose of using a Cree LED. Maybe I am missing something, is there a reason why SF did not optimise the Cree in their new lights and deliberately limiting the output. All of them (E1L, E2L, L1 and L5) are under-performing. Gosh! A P1D CE could easily beats them all!
 

Planterz

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It appears they're using the Cree and SSC LEDs' superior efficiency mostly to boost runtimes rather than brightness. Not the way I would have gone myself.
 

easilyled

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Surefire often underrate their output enormously, which is a refreshing
change from most manufacturers.

I would wait until these are actually in circulation.

I am sure the new L5 will be highly impressive.
 

22hornet

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Hello,

I have the "old" E1L and the main problem is the short runtime: 30 minutes (if not 28 minutes) on a RCR123 3.0v 600mah.
It has an advertised 25 lumens, which is bright enough for my purposes. If they use the advantages of the cree purely for more runtime, it would be a Godsend for me. 60 minutes would be much preferred over 28 minutes.

The same goes for my other CR123 lights which I feed with RCR123 600mah 3.0V:
Peak Mediterranean: 23 minutes (!) (anemic)
Peak McKinley HP: 47 minutes (so-so)
Fenix P1: 40 minutes (not quite borderline)
Suerfire E1L: 28 minutes (pathetic)
Surefire L2 on high: 20 minutes (unpractical)

All these runtimes are, frankly, pathetic. But the output of these lights is sufficient. So I would really welcome better runtimes. As it is now, the runtimes are more like sprinttimes :-(

I find it puzzling that when people complain about short runtimes, when it comes to AAA or AA lights, 90 minutes or 2 hours are frowned upon. If I had 90 minutes with my Mediterranean... I would be very happy!!

Kind regards,
Joris

PS: Chevrofreak advised to use 3.7volt RCR cells in the E1L to improve the runtime, but this would mean stockpiling two different types of cells, two different loaders and all the mixing up by "innocent" family members. I like to standardize on one RCR cell instead.
 

jlomein

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I think they are trying to market the Cree E1X/E2X for what they are named, the Outdoorsman lights. They probably want to showcase the long runtime potential to attract campers and hikers who want a long lasting light.
 

cslinger

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In all honesty 30ish lumens from a light is plenty for just about all practical tasks, especially when you consider this is a pocket light. I want runtime myself. Once again, remember Surefire is very profitable because they cator to their main customers (LEO/Military) and to the masses with there other lights. CPF is such a tiny bump on the radar as far as profitability goes.

I cannot wait to see the new Surefires and I see myself picking up a new E1L and possibly a couple L1s.

Also take into consideration Surefires 30 lumens is heck of a lot stronger then the great majority of the competitions lumens. It's kind of like putting an HDC EDC 60 up against the Fenix P1. Is the Fenix brighter? Yes? Is it 135 lumens brighter? Not on your life.

Chris
 

Surefire_for_all

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I think the improvements do have their merits. Better runtime is more satisfying even if the brightness is still the same. And as a bonus to that, you'll save some bucks for something else.

Feedbacks from civilians and professional users from the millitary, the police, etc. show interests for less powerful but longer runtime flashlights. Therefore, it is possible that Surefire is listening and doing its best to serve its customers.

If your needs are different then be free to consider other products, no one can hold you back.

Best regards from me.
 

270winchester

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it's better to start with a super efficient and moderately high output light for the general market that can be re-biased rather than to cater to the few sophmoric flashaholics and ignore the general public users who want a light not for output alone, but also usefulness over the long run.

the "Surefire does not push the Cree hard enough because they only announce it as 30 lumens" bandwagon has gotten to the point of annoying, especially the complainers have not even senn the light itself, rather just making judgment based on spec along.

A Surefire 30 lumen is like a 60 Fenix lumen, BTW. All you spec-commanders need to understand that before you denounce Surefire's "low" output.
 
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jayflash

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...therefore, you may not notice a "large" improvement in brightness when comparing the E1L & the P1D CE. An honest 30 lumens out of the light is quite enough for most uses.

The RCR123 3.7 volt cells will improve both light's output, I believe.
 

Blindasabat

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All good points. I think Surefire has explored the market and has the L2, L4, L5 and others as options for those who want more lumens. They have a full product line, and it will only improve.
Longer run time is what got me interested in LEDs in the first place. I got a CMG Infinity (non-ultra) to use instead of my Maglights long before learning about CPF, and it was a great light for my general uses with only a couple of lumens.
I think most people will see the 17-18 hour run times of the E1/2L's as a real benefit rather than a brighter light that would waste relatively expensive batteries (most people buy them for ~$4 each at stores).

270winchester said:
...spec-commanders...
:lolsign:
 
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greenLED

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Andromeda said:
...but majority of the people who are into this hobby would regard "Performance" as how bright the flashlight can produce.
Not me! I've come to realize that for my particular needs, brighter is not always better. Although I like the "wow" factor of über bright lights, I'd rather settle for longer runtime and dimmer output.
 

city cop

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Amen 270winchester ! well stated. For me, I'll wait :popcorn: for the "pathetic" Surefire, then buy a light that will break in two months with real use.
 

InfidelCastro

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I'm most excited about the new L5 and L1 coming out. I'm not as excited about the new KX1 heads for the E1L/E2L, but I'm sure it will be a major improvement as well. It will be nice to have a high output head with decent sidespill to screw onto E-series bodies.
 

Skibane

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cslinger said:
In all honesty 30ish lumens from a light is plenty for just about all practical tasks, especially when you consider this is a pocket light. I want runtime myself.

There's no good reason to sacrafice brightness for run-time. Fenix has had user-selectable brightness settings on virtually of their products for some time now. The fact that Surefire still insists on restricting this feature to their "premium" models is simply inexcusable.
 

InfidelCastro

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Skibane said:
There's no good reason to sacrafice brightness for run-time. Fenix has had user-selectable brightness settings on virtually of their products for some time now. The fact that Surefire still insists on restricting this feature to their "premium" models is simply inexcusable.


The E1L and E2L are still marketed towards the outdoor enthusiasts so this only seems logical. Especially since it will still be way brighter than the typical D cell flashlights that most people are used to using.
 
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