surefire m3 Parasitic drain??

[ghosthound]

I thought that incans didnt suffer from this. If i leave in a set of cr123 batteries, even with the tail cap locked out, (not all the way, enough that pressing the button wont turn on the ligh) for over a week, when i go to use it, the batteries will be weak if not dead. Im using batteries i got from botach if that matters.

this is probably the main reason im selling it... I can't afford to constantly replace the batteries and rechargeables seem too over my head.

 

[mdocod]

Hi ghosthound,

I think it's worth further investigation as the M3 is such a wonderful light to own, and you have a lot of options to try out.

Don't let the world of li-ion rechargeable cells scare you off too much. Spend some time doing some reading and you'll pick it up.

As a booster for confidence in moving to rechargeable cells; li-ion is actually safer than the primary cells that the light calls for!

off-brand cells often have problems with rapid self-discharge once used partially, some just have awful true capacity and aren't suitable for use in tactical lights, this could be the problem. what brand of cells did you get from there?

Just an FYI:
A pair of quality protected 17500 cells from AW with a quality charger (Pila IBC is recommended) will operate as a direct replacement for the 3 CR123s in there for running the MN10 bulb. (not the MN11). You can also choose from some bulbs from LumensFactory to run on those cells in that light if you want a few more lumens to throw around.

-Eric

 

[Outdoors Fanatic]

Try using brand name batteries then come back here...

 

[R@ndom]

Mayby he's got a M3D if there ever was one...

 

[ghosthound]

its an M3T so im using the MN15 bulb...

im currently using ultralast batteries.

how much of an investment are the rechargeables?

 

[paintballdad]

The problem might be the batteries that you are currently using. They are known to have less than full capacity right out of the package. Try picking up a set of Surefire batteries and check if the problems persists. Lowe's has the Surefire CR123s for $5/pack of 2.

 

[leukos]

You'll need two of these: http://www.lighthound.com/AW-17500-Protected-Rechargeable-Lithium-Battery_p_99.html

And one of these: http://www.lighthound.com/Ultrafire...3-37-volt-Lithium-Battery-Charger_p_2279.html

And you won't ever need to look back! :thumbsup:

 

[Patriot]

im currently using ultralast batteries.

When I used to buy from botach, they always sold name brand batteries like Duracell, Energizer and Sanyo. Ultralast sounds like a junk generic to me.

Unless you have some particular reason to use primaries, do like leukos said and join the world of high quality power.

 

[ghosthound]

You'll need two of these: http://www.lighthound.com/AW-17500-Protected-Rechargeable-Lithium-Battery_p_99.html

And one of these: http://www.lighthound.com/Ultrafire...3-37-volt-Lithium-Battery-Charger_p_2279.html

And you won't ever need to look back! :thumbsup:

would i need the spacer they recommend?

would i also need a battery tester?

Do they have chargers that better inform you of the state of the battery?

i use to be into RC cars and i remember they had some ridiculously fancy chargers.... I wouldnt mind investing in something of that caliber if it meant "better" charging for the batteries...

1 last question... should i buy extra sets to keep around? or what kind of run time can i expect with these batteries.

Thanks for your help guys! I would have been very sad to sell the M3T but this gives me hope!

 

[Monocrom]

I thought that incans didn't suffer from this. If I leave in a set of CR123 batteries, even with the tailcap locked out, (not all the way, enough that pressing the button won't turn on the light) for over a week, when I go to use it, the batteries will be weak if not dead. I'm using batteries I got from botach if that matters.

Oh yeah, it makes a difference! A huge difference! The difference between a Corvette vs. a Go-cart. Listen to Eric. (The initial investment might seem a bit high, but the rechargeable cells will pay for themselves in short order. Especially if you use your M3T often).

If you want very bright output, swap out the stock Surefire lamp with one from Lumens Factory that is tailor made for use with two 17500 cells.

Lighthound.com has a good selection of Lumens factory lamps. If you want bright, check out the HO-M3T.

EDIT:

Wrong Lumens factory lamp originally mentioned as EO-M3T for use with 17500 cells.

 

[rx78gp02]

would i need the spacer they recommend?

would i also need a battery tester?

Do they have chargers that better inform you of the state of the battery?

i use to be into RC cars and i remember they had some ridiculously fancy chargers.... I wouldnt mind investing in something of that caliber if it meant "better" charging for the batteries...

1 last question... should i buy extra sets to keep around? or what kind of run time can i expect with these batteries.

Thanks for your help guys! I would have been very sad to sell the M3T but this gives me hope!

you sound a lot like me.
i too used to be into r/c cars. lol
but on a serious note, my first light was a surefire m3t as well.
its a great starter light and you'll be very fond of it.
the 2 17500 li-ions is a great starter and the charger reccommended is a great combo. i use the same combo with great results. I do reccomend getting some extra cells for spares if an emergency should occur.
You'll eventually want an led emitter if your annoyed at the "parasitic drain", which would probably lead you to getting the smaller m3 head to mate the body with.
wish yah the best of luck.
oh and 2 is 1, 1 is none.

 

[leukos]

would i need the spacer they recommend?

would i also need a battery tester?

Do they have chargers that better inform you of the state of the battery?

i use to be into RC cars and i remember they had some ridiculously fancy chargers.... I wouldnt mind investing in something of that caliber if it meant "better" charging for the batteries...

1 last question... should i buy extra sets to keep around? or what kind of run time can i expect with these batteries.

Thanks for your help guys! I would have been very sad to sell the M3T but this gives me hope!

No, you don't need the spacer if you use that charger. The bays are spring loaded and will fit the 17500 batteries just fine.

You really don't need a battery tester for Li-ions. Just checking the voltage with a DMM will tell you all you need to know about an Li-ion.

If you have a background in RC, then you could certainly appreciate a better charger. The one linked is as simple as it gets, but a lot of CPFers use it and like it. There are many threads in the "Flashlight electronics-batteries included" section of this forum about various RC chargers that could work for you.

Buy extras? Sure, as many as you think you might use in a night. These Li-ions do not have as much capacity as primaries, so you will probably get about 45 minutes runtime if you are running the light constantly with the MN15 (maybe 50-60 minutes intermittently). However, these Li-ions outperform primaries because the voltage does not sag as much, so the lamp stays brighter for longer. You will probably only notice dimming of the light the last 2 minutes before the low voltage protection circuit kicks in. I think you will find Li-ions a 100% improvement over primaries for regular use.

The other thing to clarify is that the 17500 size should not be used with the MN16, it pulls too much power. If you want a high output lamp for use with these Li-ions, use the EO-M3T as previously suggested: http://www.lighthound.com/Lumens-Fa...ns-Lamp-Assembly-for-SureFire-M3T_p_1011.html

 

[Outdoors Fanatic]

You can also use 3x 16340 IMR with the HO-M6R, this will give the best performance for 15 minutes of awesomeness.

 

[mdocod]

You can also use 3x 16340 IMR with the HO-M6R, this will give the best performance for 15 minutes of awesomeness.

Used that configuration the other night to investigate a bump-in-the-night and it's definitely one of my favorite high performance configurations.

----------------

ghosthound,

I would recommend against the WF-139, do a search for YOHO-122 and read up on how to get one (batterystation might still have some on clearance). It would be a good alternative in a similar price bracket. The WF-139 has come in at least 3-4 revisisions, each revision broke the rules of li-ion charging in at least one way, while most of them broke the rules in several ways. If you are willing to plop a few bucks, the Pila IBC I mentioned is the only consumer friendly charger for the charging of loose li-ion cells that I am aware of that uses a TRUE proper charge method. The YOHO-122 is close, plenty good, the old DSD chargers are functional but slow. Some of the revisions of the WF-139 are just plain dangerous IMO. There are numerous hobby style chargers that are geared towards RC li-ion and li-po packs that will charge your cells and give you more detailed information provided you come up with a way to "mount up" those cells in a harness or cradle of sorts to reliably connect them to the charger outputs.

-Eric

 

[leukos]

Pila broke rules in previous models too. I have over $160 of dead Pila 150s batteries as proof. The DSD charger cannot truly handle international voltage. All chargers manufactured in china are a trade off of price versus performance. The latest WF-139 is in my opinion one of the most user friendly of the cheapy chargers. Nothing compares with a quality RC charger, but the price can jump $100+, which is not always an easy entry point for folks new to Li-ion. And there is a learning curve with using many more advanced chargers. Newbies could still kill batteries or cause fires with RC chargers.

 

[Monocrom]

My experience with chargers is as follows:

DSD ~ Junk. Absolute junk. Very low price, but once you spend your money on it; you'll end up having to buy a better charger. So you end up spending even more money anyway.

WF-139 ~ I bought mine last year, works well. You just have to keep in mind that it's a very basic charger, and you must keep a constant eye on it. With my job, that's not an issue. Might be an issue for others.

Soshine chargers ~ A couple of variations of the basic design. (Mine is the one designed to charge nearly every type of cell except RCR123s). Flimsy plastic cover. But a good charger overall. Better than the WF-139. And capable of charging four cells at once. I use it as my main charger. Other than the flimsy cover, no issues with mine. You can find it at Lighthound.com

 

[Outdoors Fanatic]

Used that configuration the other night to investigate a bump-in-the-night and it's definitely one of my favorite high performance configurations.

----------------

ghosthound,

I would recommend against the WF-139, do a search for YOHO-122 and read up on how to get one (batterystation might still have some on clearance). It would be a good alternative in a similar price bracket. The WF-139 has come in at least 3-4 revisisions, each revision broke the rules of li-ion charging in at least one way, while most of them broke the rules in several ways. If you are willing to plop a few bucks, the Pila IBC I mentioned is the only consumer friendly charger for the charging of loose li-ion cells that I am aware of that uses a TRUE proper charge method. The YOHO-122 is close, plenty good, the old DSD chargers are functional but slow. Some of the revisions of the WF-139 are just plain dangerous IMO. There are numerous hobby style chargers that are geared towards RC li-ion and li-po packs that will charge your cells and give you more detailed information provided you come up with a way to "mount up" those cells in a harness or cradle of sorts to reliably connect them to the charger outputs.

-Eric

I've just bought one here -->> http://www.e-lectronics.net/charger-liion-17500-18650-batteries-p-150.html

 

[SilentK]

I also have a friend who has an M3 who has this problem quite offten. And he is using Surefire batteries. So i doubt it is the cells. And wont 17500 cells overdrive the bulb? so you will get more than 125 lumens if you are worried about it not being bright enough.

 

[ghosthound]

ahh... okay im definitely gonna get the batteries...

Now i just gotta decide on the charger... So much to learn!!!

Ill think about picking up the other bulb as well but the runtime is too short... Ive never used my mn16s anyway.

 

[Superdave]

I've had the same batteries in my Z3T since June (Army issue Panasonic 123's) and never seen any loss. All my Surefire lights have primaries in them (Except my EDC) and none of them have ever had any problems.

Bottom line, if the tailcap is locked out there is no way the light is causing the cells to discharge. It's the batteries themselves.

If the tailcap is not locked out then you have a problem, either take apart the tailcap and clean it with DeoxIT or call Surefire and they'll take care of it.