When will quality flashlights hit the mainstream public

[MikeSalt]

This will never happen. It is like trying to sell quality seperates HiFi (Bowers and Wilkins, Denon, Kimber etc...) to the masses. 90% of people will be happy with that all-in-one boombox rubbish from Walmart (ASDA).

The quality products will only ever appeal to the fanatics like us. There are actually some cheap, but quality flashlights out there for the non-fanatics. I reviewed a few here...
https://www.candlepowerforums.com/posts/1930583#post1930583

 

[selfbuilt]

Another point to consider is that people may have picked up a cheap LED light when they first hit the market, and were so turned off by the pale blue beams that they gave up on LEDs.

My two week wilderness eco-lodge experience in Costa Rica earlier this year was very "illuminating" in that regard. All guests are advised to bring a decent flashlight, as we were over an hour from the nearest electrical grid (by 4-wheel drive through dirt roads in the rainforest), and the resort only had generator power for a few compact fluorescent bulbs in the various cabinas. Depending on where you were, you could have had 20 min walk in the dark to get to your bed after dinner.

Most guests arrived without flashlights. Those that did fell typically in to two camps: 2D cell incandescent Mags, or cheap 1st gen LEDs that were dimmer than the <$1 photon clones I give out. Needless to say, my D-mini made quite an impression on people, handily out-throwing the Mags. :twothumbs

Keep in mind this eco-lodge was not cheap, and most guests there could readily afford good lights. That tells me it will likely take a few more years before decent white LED emitters make significant in-roads into the general buying public.

Check out my review thread above to see a few cute shots of frogs at night (plus how some the other lights fared).

 

[Dr.K]

We are the exception to the rule. The only way the public is gonna see whats out there is if we educate them.

Christmas = All my gifts this year will be high quality flashlights.

 

[Bushman5]

regular joes are stunned at how much even a BASIC 2 C Maglite costs, never mind some of the lights we have. I only recently got into the hobby heavily, but after seeing the old man blow a gasket when he learned I spent several hundred on my Wolf Eyes flashlights (he could'nt believe anyone would spend that kind of money), i realized that we are a VERY small niche group , and that the general public will never be involved as we are, maybe .0000001% might pick it up.

one of the comments i hear a lot after people learn about my lights and how much they cost, is: "I can get 10 lights form Home Depot or Walmart for what you paid for your light" they fail to see the build quality, the light, the runtime, the waterproofness etc etc, all they see is $$$ and they choke

 

[Kiessling]

Since quality flashlights seem to be retreating even in the sacred halls of CPF, I can't see them advancing elsewhere. So I join the voices that say ... never.
bernie

 

[duffman]

one of the comments i hear a lot after people learn about my lights and how much they cost, is: "I can get 10 lights form Home Depot or Walmart for what you paid for your light" they fail to see the build quality, the light, the runtime, the waterproofness etc etc, all they see is $$$ and they choke

Well, we're not gonna be the ones left in the dark after their lights 10 dollar lights fail!!

 

[DM51]

Someone above mentioned $5 as the maximum figure Joe Public will pay, and this is probably correct.

On the basis that at some stage in the future, battery and LED technology will have advanced to the extent that what we now call a good quality light will be a volume-production item and will cost far less in real terms than it does today, Joe WILL be able to get a good light for his $5. So I for one would not say "never".

 

[Gatsby]

Since quality flashlights seem to be retreating even in the sacred halls of CPF, I can't see them advancing elsewhere. So I join the voices that say ... never.
bernie

Touche.

 

[NeonLights]

Won't happen for a variety of reasons, many of them already mentioned. The perceived value issue is probably one of the biggest, many people I know who need a flashlight for a camping trip or the like will buy a Walmart $1 2xAA incan or a $2 2xD incan plastic light, then keep it around the house, and when the batteries die or it starts needing a bunch of whacks to start working, they'll throw it away and buy another the next time they need one.

Another issue I see, even with my more (relatively speaking) high quality lights like Mags and other slightly more expensive but commonly available lights, is that with time, most alkaline powered lights will either have their batteries leak (very common with Mags IME) and/or there will be some corrosion built up at the battery or switch contacts that will cause th elight to flicker or work intermittently. For most of us this is no problem, we clean off the contacts, sometimes use something like Caig Deoxit to treat the contacts, and our lights are working as good as new. Most other people will relegate a Maglite to the junk drawer or throw it away if it "doesn't work right" anymore.

The quality lights are readily available to the general public now, Walmart carries LED Mags and several re-branded Nuwai lights, Target has the River Rocks and Inovas, outdoor stores generally have a good selection and many sell Surefire, yet the general public doesn't buy them, mainly gadget freaks, people serious about a particular hobby (that requires a light), or people that need one for their profession buy the better lights, and that leaves out a very large percentage of the population. For most people a $1 2xAAA Walmart plastic light gives them as much function as an $8 Mini Maglite and much more perceived value, and they wouldn't even think about spending $20-30 on an LED MiniMag or something similar. If people would just be willing to spend $12-13 for a MiniMag and Nite Ize LED drop-in at Walmart, and be willing to change the batteries before they leak, they'd have a light that would last for many years and be cheaper in the long run than what they do now. Oh well.....

 

[IMSabbel]

What is the point of a "quality flashlight"?

Surely, its not HA3, nor some great styling, or a lifetime replacement assurance.

Because the only situation average joe will _ever_ need a flashlight is a) a blackout or b) poop-hits-the-fan situation.

in a), a candle or a zippo is usually enough.
in b): the nice machining, the fact thats only a limited edition/ that it was made in america by expensive workers dont matter anything.
Your light will most likely use esoteric cells not that easy to get, and if it breaks, you wont get the replacement anyway. So redundancy is a much better factor. 5 cheaps 1$ walmart lights around the house will be much more usefull than a $300 surefire that got wrecked during the Big One...


Those lights are a fashion statement, a neat gadget, and for _some_ people, a high quality tool. But just like i personally cannot justify spending $50 for a screwdriver, or $1000 for a power drill (my usage pattern would make the expense a waste, even though high quality tools feel nice), for most of the population the same applies for lights.

And _please_ dont try the preaching approach, i.e. tell the unwashed masses that they suck for not using something thats >$50. They will just think you a ******* that has no bigger problems that demand his attention. (and rightfully so)

 

[taiji]

but on the other hand ,,what fun would it be if everybody else had high powered
flashlights.

 

[kelmo]

...One person had a Coleman latern...

They let a guy with a gas lantern in a field of dry corn stalks?! If he would have dropped it everybody would have lots of light.

Taiji is right, if everybody has good lights then we would have to find another obsession...er...forum.

Sharpdogs, how many people were using their cell phones for light? HA-HA.

It kills me how unprepared people are and then when SHTF how demanding they can be of those of us who are prepared.

I hear ya Bro

 

[Bushman5]

Personally i'm glad that only a very small percentage of people have nice lights. Around here the only people with high powered flashlights are the Police and other emergency techs. It makes my job easier because the TDM's (Thieving Druggy Misfits) that i blind with my light are NOT used to high quality lights blinding them before they are taken down and they think anyone wioth a high powered light is a cop. I use that to my advantage (as a private Security officer). The look of shock and fear on the TDM's faces gives me precious extra seconds to deal with them or my partner to go around and restrain them. If every tom **** and harry started carrying pro level flashlights and flashing them around, i would'nt have that advantage anymore.

 

[Scott Packard]

Was at my dentist's last week and I'm asking the receptionist about the long power outage she had to endure this summer (24 hours). She had 10 flashlights around the house and none of them worked. She heard an engine running and found her neighbor was the only one with a generator so now she's thinking of getting one.

I'd guess that 95% of other people are like her, in that they don't maintain their flashlights. Well, why would somebody go out and spend $50+ for a good flashlight if they *know* it won't work when they need to use it? It'll probably have leaking batteries.

One coworker (before I started showing him a few of my LED lights) was gushing about how great the shaker flashlights are "because you never need to worry about batteries", which I think implies never worrying about leaking, run-down batteries. Personally I haven't looked closely at the shakers but I suspect they have a NiCd in them, and my experience with those is 5 year life and eventual leakage.

I think the public wants a light they can forget about in a drawer for 10 years then use in an emergency. Next, vendors to businesses want an ultra-cheap squeeze light they can print their logo on and give out at conferences. Then schools and businesses want a bottom-dollar flashlight they can stock their square footage with to comply with local emergency preparedness rules.

The police and fire are kind of the visible benchmark for the public for the "best light available". IMHO. (Where would we be without this site? A lot worse off. So, thanks to CPF.)

 

[Bushman5]

^ good point on the schools...ive seen their "disaster" kits and they are utter pre packaged garbage (ESPECIALLY the flashlights) . The admins know that the chances of actually needing the kit are about .0000001%, so the bottom line is they spend as little as possible.

 

[270winchester]

Since quality flashlights seem to be retreating even in the sacred halls of CPF, I can't see them advancing elsewhere. So I join the voices that say ... never.
bernie

I hate to say it but I completely agree with you.

The irony of the first post is profound, to me at least.

one of the comments i hear a lot after people learn about my lights and how much they cost, is: "I can get 10 lights form Home Depot or Walmart for what you paid for your light" they fail to see the build quality, the light, the runtime, the waterproofness etc etc, all they see is $$$ and they choke

now replace "Walmart" with the name of all the same-yet-different venders here, the same statement is repeated daily in CPF. I personally have been called stupid and elitist by other CPFers for trying to argue for the merit of buying well-made domestic lights as much as possible(side note, I concede that the AA market had seen a large vaccum for the longest time and Fenix came and stepped up to the plate with decent products very quickly), but I have been told many times to change with the times.

Eh, so to the original post, never.

 

[h_nu]

Sorry if you missed out but the Freeplay X-Ray was on clearance last week at Target for $12.48.

 

[f22shift]

Because the only situation average joe will _ever_ need a flashlight is a) a blackout or b) poop-hits-the-fan situation.

in a), a candle or a zippo is usually enough.
)

true. in my pre cpf during the big northeast blackout, i had a bunch of tea lights everywhere. it was enough and quite romantic :kiss:

cant wait for night maze myself

 

[KWillets]

The hidden hand here is information. If flashlights had believable output and efficiency ratings, people would happily shell out the extra money if needed.

Look at appliances. People willingly spend 2-3x more than the cheapest model if they know they're getting better energy efficiency or reliability, based on credible, independent ratings.

 

[lctorana]

A few points to make:

1)
Price Snobbery.
I am quite sure that somewhere there is a forum where Rolex wearers sling off at people who wear Timexes or look at the time on their mobiles.

Reality check, people. Quality flashlights are a tool for a certain type of tradesman, and really expensive flashlights are a token of affluence.

2)
The Reverse is Actually Happening.
I could actually mount the depressing argument that flashlight quality available to the general public has gone backwards over the years.
At least in Australia, there is nothing available, even in high-end camping stores, that even approaches the quality of a D cell Maglite.

There are cheap 2AA, 4AA, 2D plastic things, and anyone who needs a real torch buys an Eveready Dolphin.

But back to my theme. 20 Years ago, you could buy metal 2D, 3D, 4D, 5D and even 8D torches, metal 2C torches, sealed beam throwers, torches with variable focus, metal reflectors and glass lenses. In any local hardware store.

Not any more. Disposable plastic rules the shelves.

And camping stores? Mini-Mag knock-offs and 9-LED junque.

3)
Availability 1.
I show my lights to people, and jaws drop. People are interested, but until torches with Crees and Xenon drop-ins appear at Big W or Bunnings, they will continue to regard them as stuff of the future.

4)
Availability 2.
You people in the USA, count yourselves lucky.
To look down on a D-cell Maglite tells me you have the luxury and priviledge to encounter something better.
To Australian eyes, a Maglite is a ruinously expensive extravagance, and of jaw-dropping quality. I have never ever laid eyes on a MagLED, and the price of one of those here is too high even for a flashoholic.
Other brands further upmarket than Maglite are unknown outside very specialist circles.

5)
Net Worth.
In recent years, electricity supplies have become increasingly more reliable. Blackouts are rare. Nightlights are plugged into powerpoints. Light pollution in our cities means that urban dark often isn't that dark.
Street lighting has improved. Cars are more reliable, and often have "limp home" capability. Doing without a torch is a risk like carrying no spare tyre - a risk people are prepared to accept.

The point I am getting at is the value, to the average city dweller, of a torch is less now than it used to be.