Will bigger Li-ion batteries become a trend?

XTAR Light

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The big size 46800 and 46950 Li-ion batteries seem to have found their niche in some new powerful lights and lanterns. Some flashlight lovers think bigger batteries are definitely a plus. They have advantages in capacity, no multi-cell voltage issues. And charging one battery is much easier and safer than 3S or even 3P cells.

While, as for charging efficiency, it may take most the day to get a big 46800 or 46950 fully charged via the charging port on the light. But you can charge three or four 21700 with 2A at once more quickly. Besides, to compare the energy density among those Li-ion batteries, the 21700 battery seems still the optimal choice.

Do you think the trend towards big batteries is the future? And some users told they are also interested in external charger for these big batteries. Will it only cater to a smaller, niche market. How about your view on this? ;-)
 

jtr1962

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The larger sizes are good if you want to store a lot of energy but only if it's available in a safe chemistry like LiFePO4 or sodium-ion. A 46800 li-ion cell has roughly 1/3 the energy of a stick of dynamite. I wouldn't feel comfortable carrying that around with me.

All other things being equal, I totally agree I'd rather have one cell than 3S or 3P cells.

BTW, I'm surprised 46800 are even available to consumers. I thought they were only being made for EV battery packs.
 

KITROBASKIN

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Interesting, but not sure how much of a market there will be. I could be totally wrong.

Interesting that XTAR is looking forward like this. Maybe start out with a simple single bay that will handle 18650 or 26650 and up to 46800? Is that even possible?
 

vicv

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I know I have no interest in sell that big. I think 26650 is the perfect size. But since they are not getting any new cell material, 21700 is the best right now. I don't like soda can light and I don't need that much capacity. It's fine for a lantern though. But even then I would prefer three or 4x 21700 cells. There are no issues charging cells in parallel so that doesn't worry me.
 

alpg88

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It could be useful for soda can lights, but those are not as common as smaller lights people carry.
 

orbital

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Really big batteries aren't the future, but they are interesting.
3x21700 high power light is a better way to go ~ 12V

I have a Lumintop light with a 46950 battery in it,, Type C charging

 

Ocelot808

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Then there's this SBT90.2 monster, the new Lumintop GT110 with 46110 with 38,000mAh.


One advantage of the gargantuan single cell sizes is their incredibly low internal resistance, less than 2 milliOhms allowing for safe high charge rates. 2.5C max discharge can provide 90 Amps CDR. So a 20A flashlight load with that cell is only 0.5C, minimal voltage sag.

It's sad the 26800 recently died out, it was slowly gaining acceptance for larger capacity cells. Now there's a big gap between 26650s and the Red Bull can 46-series monsters just now emerging.
 

Ocelot808

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I really hope not! I'm perfectly happy with 21700 lights.
21700 really is a Goldilocks cell size for capacity and current delivery. Big improvement over the long dominant 18650, which still has plenty of purpose.
 

Kestrel

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Looking at my purchase records (what, you don't have a "Lights" Excel spreadsheet ??), the last LiIons I bought were a pair of AW 3100mAh 18650's, in 2015. And they haven't even gotten into the rotation yet, lol. ;-)
 

Monocrom

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Records?? I'd likely drop dead from shock if I knew how much money I've spent on this hobby over just the last 5 years alone.
 

vicv

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I still think the 26650 is the better size. Should be about 8000mah if they got the same treatment as 21700s did. Don't even need 26800. Course that would be a nice longer tube at over 10000mah
 

ampdude

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I'm fine with 18650's as my biggest lithium ion batteries, but I wish the C format would really take off.

21700's are meh... weird.
 

vicv

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I'm fine with 18650's as my biggest lithium ion batteries, but I wish the C format would really take off.

21700's are meh... weird.
I remember when aw came out with his "C" lithium ion. They were pretty neat. But went bad after not a lot of cycles. All those Leef and fiveMega bodies and such a short lived cell
 

KITROBASKIN

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Looking at my purchase records (what, you don't have a "Lights" Excel spreadsheet ??), the last LiIons I bought were a pair of AW 3100mAh 18650's, in 2015. And they haven't even gotten into the rotation yet, lol. ;-)
So funny. AW batteries… good times.
Turns out just this evening I pulled out a classic SolarForce for a neighbor to try. Battery I will loan is a protected Panasonic from 2015 as well!

She had an Amazon Goreit aspheric that was misbehaving badly; advised her to junk it but hold onto the 6000mAh 26800 protected cell.

200,000 lumens!
 

Ocelot808

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I wish the C format would really take off.
26650 cells are absolutely "C size" format and have been popular for at least 7 years.

32650 are "D size" and never really got off the ground. Best ones had only 6000mAh, which current 26650s can surpass.
 

ampdude

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I remember when aw came out with his "C" lithium ion. They were pretty neat. But went bad after not a lot of cycles. All those Leef and fiveMega bodies and such a short lived cell
Yea, I don't know what the story was on that, since I have AW 17500's still going strong after more than a dozen years and he also made them the correct size. Most of the other lithium ions I have go bad after a few years or are the wrong width or length to begin with.
 

vicv

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A C cell is the same volume as a 21700. So they would be 5000mah. Can you imagine? A light with two of them would barely be bigger than a single 21700 light, but it would run for days with a good buck driver. They'd make the perfect jacket pocket light. It'll never happen though.

21700 on the left. 2x C on the right
image.jpg
 
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