How-To . . . Vector Twin 100W HID Pictures

petrev · Jun 1, 2008

Hi

Had been looking at the Vector Twin for a while and thinking about an HID mod when I saw Lasercrazy had one at PF10 - OK I've got to make one now . . .

Got all the bits and then stumbled accross this thread by English_Mart Vector twin halogen lamp converted to HID - This had been going on for ages . . .

Vector Twin VEC192
HID conversion Kit - 50/55W H7 4300ºK (mine was from YourHID )

Anyway here are some photos of my build.

The HID conversion kit is a virtual Drop-In. Lots of room and a plastic divider that becomes the perfect mount for the ballasts.

Remove the front bezel, glass and twin-mirror and you find this black plastic divider piece (there is another spacer piece mounted on the front of it too but that isn't needed - just taking up space so remove it . . . )

Take a Dremel to the battery side and you get this . . .

Do this to the front - cut down the 4 mounting posts.

Cut out the top side - this may help give some sort of air flow route

Drill some big holes to provide some more air ! Convection ! ! !

Attach one Ballast, Pre-wired with input and output cables, onto the battery side using some double sided sticky foam (Sticky Fixer Strip)

Re-Mount the Plastic piece into the body
View from the rear . . .

Attach the second ballast to the front side with another piece of double sided sticky foam (Sticky Fixer Strip) and connect all the wires - There are spade connectors that connect into the existing wiring - too easy !

Re-Fit the front and its all done . . . Simple !

Standard SLA gives 25min runtime on 100W and no overheating problems (?)

Weight is about the same as POB 35W HID so have to sort out a lithium version at some point . . .

Quite a bit of UV output - Photochromic lenses

Lots of Light for not much money and effort . . .

Cheers
Pete

Lunal_Tic · Jun 1, 2008

Now that's just wicked. I'm a not exactly clear, can you light both off at the same time? Beamshots?

-LT

edit: I'd not seen that other link, thanks. How far out would you say the beams converge?

petrev · Jun 1, 2008

Lunal_Tic said:
Now that's just wicked. I'm a not exactly clear, can you light both off at the same time? Beamshots?

-LT

Hi LT

One Lit = 50/55W
Two Lit = 100/110W

There are beamshots and some more pics in English_Mart's original Vector twin halogen lamp converted to HID thread.

I'll try to get some more shots soon

Cheers
Pete

Flashanator · Jun 2, 2008

Nice pete.

I have been wanting to bulld one myself for a while now.

What batt you got in that? Id expect 7ah sla would give low runtimes.

what about a li-ion?

petrev · Jun 2, 2008

Flashanator 500mW said:
Nice pete.

I have been wanting to bulld one myself for a while now.

What batt you got in that? Id expect 7ah sla would give low runtimes.

what about a li-ion?

Hi Flash

25 minutes 100/110W is from the standard SLA that comes with the host. Still deciding on the Lithium option ! ! !

Cheers
Pete

Flashanator · Jun 2, 2008

rofl, its threads like this that make me lash out on my wallet.

ive already ordered the black & decker host, 6k 55w ballast kit, & ill see what li-ion batt i can get built with what ever room i have.

i like 6k over 4.3 or 4.2k.

any risks of over heating with HID? I assume the orig halogen bulbs produce more heat?

Later.

petrev · Jun 2, 2008

Flashanator 500mW said:
rofl, its threads like this that make me lash out on my wallet.

ive already ordered the black & decker host, 6k 55w ballast kit, & ill see what li-ion batt i can get built with what ever room i have.

i like 6k over 4.3 or 4.2k.

any risks of over heating with HID? I assume the orig halogen bulbs produce more heat?

Later.

Hi Flash

:twothumbs

No trouble with heat (so far . . .)

Lamps are fine and produce much less heat than the originals.
Worried a bit about the ballasts in the closed in space (hence the token holes) but they seem fine (so far . . .)

You will love this mod

Laters Dude

M@elstrom · Jun 2, 2008

Awesome thread Pete! really nice result too, just curious as to the reflector diameter of those Vectors Twins? also how'd you get on with the beam focus points (looks like the exact same kit as KrisP & I used)?:candle:

Flashanator 500mW said:
rofl, its threads like this that make me lash out on my wallet.

i've already ordered the black & decker host, 6k 55w ballast kit, & ill see what li-ion batt i can get built with what ever room i have.

i like 6k over 4.3 or 4.2k.

any risks of over heating with HID? I assume the orig halogen bulbs produce more heat?

Choosing a HID/LED colour tint is a personal thing... but I'm curious why you went with 6000K, from my understanding the lower the frequency 4000~8000K the better the colour rendition (ie. useful to the human eye)?

I've had not had any issues with overheating of those cheap Chinese 55w HID kits yet and FWIW according to the specification booklet the ballast/burner are of Bosch origin/design (depending on the kit you obtain) :twothumbs

Looking forward to your DIY HID mod thread G/L!

Flashanator · Jun 2, 2008

For spotlights I like 6k over 4.3 for the beam. 6K stands out more.

If I find i like 4.3K better, ill just swap the bulbs.

look forward to beamshots.

btw, what (k) is best for human eyes? sunlight is 5.5-6k, so I thought white light gives better visablity then lower 4.3k???

thx

lasercrazy · Jun 2, 2008

Good job on the mod. :thumbsup: When I did mine I completely rewired everything and used a custom 12 cell 10AH LSD D pack. The ballasts I used were pretty thick with great heatsinking, but that made mounting them difficult.

petrev · Jun 2, 2008

Flashanator 500mW said:
For spotlights I like 6k over 4.3 for the beam. 6K stands out more.

If I find i like 4.3K better, ill just swap the bulbs.
look forward to beamshots.

btw, what (k) is best for human eyes? sunlight is 5.5-6k, so I thought white light gives better visablity then lower 4.3k???

thx

Hi

Higher ºK look bluer going right to violet at highest temps - give a laser beam effect but don't penetrate fog as well and the higher the temp the lower the lumens (rough guide)

4300ºK seem very white to me (night time) - lower will penetrate fog better but there seems to be no increase in Lumens and they might get a bit yellow looking - most people settle on 4300ºK as a good compromise.

lasercrazy said:
Good job on the mod. :thumbsup: When I did mine I completely rewired everything and used a custom 12 cell 10AH LSD D pack. The ballasts I used were pretty thick with great heatsinking, but that made mounting them difficult.

Hi

Kudos on rewiring and pack - I decided to make mine as simple as possible and the ballasts just happened to fit perfectly. Have to get some photos of your pack if possible ? Sounds good

Cheers
Pete

petrev · Jun 2, 2008

M@elstrom said:
Awesome thread Pete! really nice result too, just curious as to the reflector diameter of those Vectors Twins? also how'd you get on with the beam focus points (looks like the exact same kit as KrisP & I used)?:candle:

Hi M@elström

5" Ø reflectors (with common bit in the middle)

Looks like same kit as in your photos - The H7 version seems to be about right for focus, only maybe 1-2mm out, but I think I prefer the slight extra size of the hot spot to ultimate throw so ! ? ! Only small shims required if wanted.

I have a similar host to yours but it doesn't have the extra front-bezel extender so is only 8" Ø. Nice though and fits a Cibie Mirror and a 400W 64663 - Sweet.

Cheers
Pete

M@elstrom · Jun 2, 2008

Flashanator 500mW said:
btw, what (k) is best for human eyes? sunlight is 5.5-6k, so I thought white light gives better visablity then lower 4.3k???

I was always under the impression that sunlight was in the vicinity of 4300K and not 6000K, I could be mistaken but the color rendition (of the human eye) in sunlight vastly surpasses that possible in artificial lighting conditions IMHO

petrev said:
5" Ø reflectors (with common bit in the middle)

Looks like same kit as in your photos - The H7 version seems to be about right for focus, only maybe 1-2mm out, but I think I prefer the slight extra size of the hot spot to ultimate throw so ! ? ! Only small shims required if wanted.

I have a similar host to yours but it doesn't have the extra front-bezel extender so is only 8" Ø. Nice though and fits a Cibie Mirror and a 400W 64663 - Sweet.

5 Inches eh? I was trying to visualize the size of your host and that makes it much easier thanks! I did notice shimming to focus cost me the wide beam I had initially (on installation), but the ability to project a decent hotspot over a couple of hundred meters made it truly worth the effort

a portable 400w beast? :drool:

superjoe83 · Jun 2, 2008

i haven't seen it mentioned yet, but higher kelvin temp = lower lumens out of the bulb

For example, a Philips D2S 4300k lamp puts out 3400-3600 lumens at 35w, the Philips Ultinon 6000k D2S bulb puts out about 2600 lumen at 35w

lasercrazy · Jun 2, 2008

petrev said:
Kudos on rewiring and pack - I decided to make mine as simple as possible and the ballasts just happened to fit perfectly. Have to get some photos of your pack if possible ? Sounds good. Cheers Pete

Essexman · Jun 3, 2008

Great build, I've never seen a twin set up like this.

Is the Vector Twin VEC192 available in the UK?

After a quick search all I could find is a black and decker twin, which looks a bit top heavy.

I keep thinking/looking at building a HID monster, I've got no use for one, no where to keep it, and shouldn't spend any more money really.
But that's never stopped me before.

Cheers.

M@elstrom · Jun 3, 2008

Essexman said:
Great build, I've never seen a twin set up like this.

Is the Vector Twin VEC192 available in the UK?

One would have to think so, as two of the most recent Vector Twin mods I've read were from your fellow countrymen petrev & English_Mart (who's build thread is linked in the opening post of this thread)

Vector Twins FTW! :thumbsup:

petrev · Jun 3, 2008

Essexman said:
Great build, I've never seen a twin set up like this.

Is the Vector Twin VEC192 available in the UK?

After a quick search all I could find is a black and decker twin, which looks a bit top heavy.

I keep thinking/looking at building a HID monster, I've got no use for one, no where to keep it, and shouldn't spend any more money really.
But that's never stopped me before.

Cheers.

Hi Essex

I got mine from America via eBay and the postage was as much as the lamp.

It is also branded Black & Decker VEC192 in The States but not available as far as I can tell in the UK - the top heavy one, VEC158BD, is a slightly smaller unit.

This page from boatandrvaccessories.com has most of the hosts out there in one place and this was the company I got mine from, but via eBay listing.
Ask about postage and description to UK as some sellers can be helpful. :thumbsup:

Cheers
Pete

petrev · Jun 3, 2008

lasercrazy said:
Here are the pics of my pack being made courtesy of LuxLuthor. If you ever need a custom pack made I highly recommend him. :thumbsup:
. . .

Cool Pack Build

Nice work Lux

Cheers
Pete

petrev · Jun 3, 2008

Hi

Colour Temp ? Lumens ? etc. . . Full Disclosure

What is Daylight Temp ?

1500 K Candlelight
2680 K 40 W incandescent lamp
3000 K 200 W incandescent lamp
3200 K Sunrise/sunset
3400 K Tungsten lamp
3400 K 1 hour from dusk/dawn
5000-4500 K Xenon lamp/light arc
5500 K Sunny daylight around noon
5500-5600 K Electronic photo flash
6500-7500 K Overcast sky
9000-12000 K Blue sky

Photographers generally define Daylight White as 5500 K (Nikon and Canon vary)

What is White ?

Trouble with White is the brain sees white based on ambient light so White is whatever is ambient - Your lamp is white in the absence of any other reference - SF-M6 is white until you shine an HID near it then it's yellow (or the HID is blue !) but incandescents have better colour rendering ! see later . . .

CIE Map showing perceived White area

This is all regarding true Black Body radiators like the Sun and incandescent lamps ! Colour Temperature

C.I.E. Colour Space (CIE - Commission internationale de l'éclairage or International Commission on Illumination )

HID and other discharge lamps have non contigious interrupted spectra and hence Correlated Color Temperature (CCT) or Apparent Color Temperature is used.

More Reading - International Cinematographers Guild

Another measure is also used for discharge lamps that of CRI Colour Rendering Index (eg. 95 - Higher is better)

Discharge lamps have interrupted spectra and hence depending on wavelengths present some colours may dissapear or seem brighter than normal - therefore the need for CRI

Fuller specs for a lamp that might help with choices

Color Temperature (ºK) (CCT)
Color Rendering Index (CRI)
CIE Color x
CIE Color y
Luminous Flux (lm) at rated output
Luminous Efficacy (lm/W)

Anything else ?

Oh Yes - it's all personal preference.

Cheers
Pete

How-To . . . Vector Twin 100W HID Pictures

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