batteries stuck inside my LD20

Hello everyone,

I purchased an LD20 in November 2010 and discovered last night that the batteries had become stuck inside the flashlight. The batteries themselves are standard Energizer AA's that I loaded into the flashlight when I first bought it. I know they weren't expired when I first put them in, although I'm not sure if they are expired now because I can't take them out of the tube.

Several weeks ago, I noticed the flashlight wasn't turning on on the first click anymore. It would sometimes take up to 10 clicks to make the light turn on. Once on, the light was dimmer than usual for a given level of brightness. I will also add that the dim issue was seen a couple months before I started noticing the clicking issue. When I first noticed the dimming issue, I was able to remove the batteries. Changing the batteries for new ones fixed the dimming issue, although I decided to continue on with the old batteries because even the reduced level of light the flashlight was putting out was sufficient for most of my applications and I wanted to extract every last bit of value from the batteries.

Having said that, what do I do now? I've tried to jab the batteries out of the tube from either end, but they won't budge, and all of my jabbing is only making indentations in the battery. It seems I would be more likely to destroy the batteries further before I would be able to remove them.

Hopefully there's a fix for this. I would hate to think I spent $50 on an otherwise good flashlight only to have it ruined by batteries.

Also what exactly happened to the batteries? Did they explode inside the tube?

You can try perhaps three things. One is to put penetrating oil down the tube, with both ends off and let it soak, even melted butter might work, or motor oil? Another is to try and put the tube in the freezer and hope that the batteries shrink up more than the tube. Also, you can try putting the tube in a pan of hot water and try the opposite approach.

The batteries might have expanded a bit, wedging them in the tube, or they might have leaked, between their connection and made a seal of some sort, fixing them to the tube wall.

Chris

Sounds like the batteries leaked acid. If you can take the head off and the tail cap off so that you just have the tube, take a dowel stick or round metal rod that will fit inside the tube and place the tube on a block of wood so you don't scratch or damage the LD20 tube and hit the dowel stick with a hammer and pound the batteries out.

It may not be that simple but that is how I picture your problem.

Before taking a chance on further damaging your light and/or the batteries attempting to remove them, I would contact customer service at Energizer. Many battery companies will repair or replace not only the batteries but the device which was damaged by the leaking batteries if you send it to them for inspection.

Taschenlampe Dude said:

Before taking a chance on further damaging your light and/or the batteries attempting to remove them, I would contact customer service at Energizer. Many battery companies will repair or replace not only the batteries but the device which was damaged by the leaking batteries if you send it to them for inspection.

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And when you get the light replaced, do not use alkaline batteries again!! Buy a set of good rechargeable NIMH cells. .;P).

mikekoz said:

And when you get the light replaced, do not use alkaline batteries again!! Buy a set of good rechargeable NIMH cells. .;P).

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Amen to that. Leaving alkalines in a flashlight (especially a good flashlight) for a longer length of time is a recipe for disaster. Long before the advent of the LED lights, I've had batteries leak a number of times in my Mini-mags. For my emergency light in the car, (which doesn't get used much), then I have Energizer L91 lithium's.

Taschenlampe Dude said:

Before taking a chance on further damaging your light and/or the batteries attempting to remove them, I would contact customer service at Energizer. Many battery companies will repair or replace not only the batteries but the device which was damaged by the leaking batteries if you send it to them for inspection.

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I emailed both Fenix and Energizer last week. So far Fenix has already replied saying they will replace it under warranty. I am waiting to hear back from an individual company rep for further instructions.

mikekoz said:

And when you get the light replaced, do not use alkaline batteries again!! Buy a set of good rechargeable NIMH cells. .;P).

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Is that true in general even if my flashlight doesn't see heavy use? The alkaline batteries lasted over a year before they died. I thought rechargeables mainly made sense for much more frequent use. Also will they lose their charge over time if the flashlight isn't used frequently?

Biggest issue using Alkaline batteries is the potential for leaking cells. Listen to the good advise here and stay away from them. Rechargeable AA's such as Eneloop's hold their charge over time.

Bill

Special K said:

Is that true in general even if my flashlight doesn't see heavy use? The alkaline batteries lasted over a year before they died. I thought rechargeables mainly made sense for much more frequent use. Also will they lose their charge over time if the flashlight isn't used frequently?

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My own experience with alkalines over the years is the best way to get the cells to leak is to run them down a bit at a high drain rate and then tuck the light/device away for a few weeks or months. That seems to be the recipe. I think if you used your light heavily with alkalines and changed them out every week, you would have less problems. They simply go dead and the heavy user will promptly change them out long before leakage occurs. Run them down and then storing it for weeks opens the opportunity for a leak. This is just my own experience. Years back, my old company supplied AA duracell procells and horrible penlights. Change them out every week and never a problem. But lose that light with weak batteries in your tool kit for a month and it was sure to leak.

Something low selfdischarge like eneloops will stay charged for a long time in storage and give great service. You can get 4 and a cheap charger for ~$16. Lithium
AA primaries won't leak either, but very expensive and low mode might not work in that light because of the slightly higher voltage.

That's great that Fenix will help you out.

My mantra is "There are two kinds of alkaline batteries: Those that have leaked, and those that are going to leak."

I have literally thrown out a box full of Mag lights ruined by alkalines. The last one, a new 2-C with new cells installed only a month before, I sent back to Ray-O-Vac. They payed for a new one and sent new batteries. Mag also has an arrangement where they get reimbursed by the major battery manufacturers when a light comes in ruined by the batteries. Fenix may have the same.

By the way, I have had all of the big names leak, anywhere from new still in the package to partially used and real dead. Using them down to the bone over a long time does seem the worst condition, though, in my experience.

For long storage, occasional use, pop for the Energizer Lithiums. Otherwise, use NiMH's. Eneloops do hold their charge a very long time, not like any of the old rechargables. They are the best all-around economical solution. Good luck!

Special K said:

Is that true in general even if my flashlight doesn't see heavy use? The alkaline batteries lasted over a year before they died. I thought rechargeables mainly made sense for much more frequent use. Also will they lose their charge over time if the flashlight isn't used frequently?

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If we're talking about storage in a hot vehicle, lithium primary batteries are the "best" choice here. I don't know if the LD20 pulls enough current for it to be a factor but one of the nice things about NiMH vs alkaline is that they can supply enough current for turbo mode usage where usually alkalines cannot.

Special K said:

Is that true in general even if my flashlight doesn't see heavy use? The alkaline batteries lasted over a year before they died. I thought rechargeables mainly made sense for much more frequent use. Also will they lose their charge over time if the flashlight isn't used frequently?

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If you buy low self discharge (LSD, Pre-charged) NIMH's, they will keep their charge quite some time. Some of them boast they keep about 70-80% over the course of a year. I use Eneloops, Duracell brand, Rayovac's, and Kodak brand. I only use alkalines as a backup, and in my cheaper lights. I just lost a mag 3A to leaking alkalines, but I only paid about $15.00 for the light a while back on closeout. I had one cell start leaking in a low end spotlight I own, but it was just starting and caused no damage. Oddly enough, it was a C cell, and that was the first non AA cell I have ever had leak! Rechargeables also save you a lot of $$$ over the course of a year, which also reduces the amout of batteries that end up in landfills. Not everybody recycles them.

Here's a quick update:

Fenix corrected their previous email to let me know that the warranty doesn't cover damage due to batteries. My options are to pay $12.95 for a new battery tube, or send the tube to Fenix HQ in China for repair (no charge, but I would have to pay shipping, lol). Energizer is sending me a prepaid shipping label to send them the flashlight. If they determine the failure was caused by their batteries, they will replace the flashlight and batteries for free.

After reading this thread and a few others, I'm thinking I'll go with the Energizer L91 batteries since my flashlights don't get a lot of heavy regular use. If my usage habits change, I'll upgrade to the eneloops.

I still have a few more questions:

1. Is the LD20 compatible with the E91's? I've read some conflicting posts on here.
2. Assuming the LD20 is compatible with the E91's, is there any change in the relative brightness levels of the different modes? I've heard there is less difference between the low and medium modes when you use lithium batteries with an LD20.
3. Does the turbo mode not work correctly with alkaline batteries? Does the turbo mode work fine with both eneloops and E91's?

I have the Fenix LD22 and that will have problems on fresh alkalines or L91's. Others have posted the same about the LD20. It won't hurt the light, but low and medium will look the same until the batteries run down a bit. Do a google search of the forum (upper left of your screen) Search for 'LD20 low mode L91' and you will see some threads on it. Turbo mode should work fine with any cells and modes other than low should be the same. Turbo might give less run time on alkalines, I don't know for sure.

Special K said:

1. Is the LD20 compatible with the E91's? I've read some conflicting posts on here.
2. Assuming the LD20 is compatible with the E91's, is there any change in the relative brightness levels of the different modes? I've heard there is less difference between the low and medium modes when you use lithium batteries with an LD20.
3. Does the turbo mode not work correctly with alkaline batteries? Does the turbo mode work fine with both eneloops and E91's?

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1. Yes, it is safe to use the E91's in the LD20

2. Also yes, the LD20 is only a boost circuit in order to increase alkaline and NiMH battery voltages to what is needed to drive the LED. The E91's, especially when new, will have more than the minimum voltage to drive the LED, and the light can't "buck" the voltage down, so it goes into direct drive and gives you more brightness at the lower settings than what you get with the other two chemistries.

3. Turbo will be a true turbo, not limited by the batteries ability to provide current, or sag in voltage. Eneloops should be at least close to as good as the E91's. The real problem comes in with the alkalines. When they are driven hard, their voltage drops and they can not maintain the output current the circuit is asking for. They are quite good, though, at running for very long times at very low current.

Hondo said:

2. Also yes, the LD20 is only a boost circuit in order to increase alkaline and NiMH battery voltages to what is needed to drive the LED. The E91's, especially when new, will have more than the minimum voltage to drive the LED, and the light can't "buck" the voltage down, so it goes into direct drive and gives you more brightness at the lower settings than what you get with the other two chemistries.

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Do the low and medium modes have equivalent brightness when used with a fresh set of E91's, or is the medium mode still brighter than the low mode, but both modes are brighter than they would be with either alkaline or NiMH batteries?

The modes will not shift higher, low will be as bright as medium. L91's might be high enough voltage to affect medium too, so it might not be a good solution for you. Check this thread on an older model LD20:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-Which-AA-batteries-can-I-use-with-my-LD20-R4

I only keep alkalines to give to the kids and for emergencies. Heh, even in an emergency I probably have enough eneloops, normal NiMH and li-ions charged to run my lights for weeks without dipping into the alkalines.

lightwait said:

The modes will not shift higher, low will be as bright as medium. L91's might be high enough voltage to affect medium too, so it might not be a good solution for you. Check this thread on an older model LD20:
http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb...-Which-AA-batteries-can-I-use-with-my-LD20-R4

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Based on that thread, it sounds like I'm better off going with the Eneloops if I want to preserve the low and medium modes, which I do.