Reply from Zebralight over anodizing quality issues

I recently received my new Zebralight H600 mkii headlamp from ledfiretorches.co.uk and although the light itself worked fine I was less than impressed with the quality/finish of the anodizing.

It was patchy, thin and sticky/tacky to the touch all over like it hadn't cured properly or was still wet?! I contacted Zebralight's customer service dept via email with my issues and they replied quite promptly, here's what they had to say.


Almost this entire post is in violation of rule 12 - Norm

Sad and interesting at the same time.

Lord Muzzy said:

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As to your H600, don't worry about anodizing quality of the replacement, it'll be fine - from what I've been told by our coworkers in China and what I've seen in recent shipment recieved here in Irving Texas.

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Uh… so they're replacing your light. Good. At least they're prompt in their explaination and feedback.

I do have to agree with them though… sometimes in the manufacturing process, although you get extra marks for parts/raw material produced in the US of A, having the production already outsourced to a China factory means those extra marks could sometimes undermine the entire process. Just as they described above… imagine when there's raw material production or logistics delays.

A more prudent method to improve their production efficiency would be to first source for a consistent (meaning QAQC involved) raw material supplier near the factory do it cuts down on unnecessary points of failure in the process.

Edmund

Awwww.... they're ditching the natural anodizing. I liked the natural color.

Bummer, no more natural HA. It is getting hard to find, and is my favorite finish.

I'll bet that Zebralight doesn't cut prices due to the lower overhead.

jabe1 said:

I'll bet that Zebralight doesn't cut prices due to the lower overhead.

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Was asking myself the same question. Price drops for them, but will that mean the prices of the lights, also drop for us. Or do they need the 'extra' money because there are copies/ZL sells less lights.

It is most refreshing to get a ZL explanation about the anodizing issue. Also a heads up that their flashlights will now be black in the future ("in our future models")? Thank You Lord Muzzy.

Interesting. I like the natural color.

Cerealand said:

Interesting. I like the natural color.

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Sets them 'apart' from the rest.

ZL for sure watches this forum, while I appreciate you sharing the email, threads like this may make ZL be more tight lipped in the future...

With that said my SC62D anodize is poor, I have seen way better...

I agree, will miss the HA nat...

I will be honest, I really don't care where they source their barstool from. Do whatever keeps the lights in stock. But I am not so accepting of their choice to abandon the HA finish. This finish is vastly superior and is a great indicator of product quality.

Thujone said:

I will be honest, I really don't care where they source their barstool from. Do whatever keeps the lights in stock. But I am not so accepting of their choice to abandon the HA finish. This finish is vastly superior and is a great indicator of product quality.

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Absolutely agree -- losing the distinctive finish is a big deal!

Natural type III HA is a hard anodize and makes the flashlight finish more durable. It is very difficult to get parts to match exactly due to variations in the raw material used. Black if not type III will do nothing for durability. The parts will all match but it wear right off. I am pretty sure you can get black type III HA but it cost more than the natural.

Thujone said:

I will be honest, I really don't care where they source their barstool from. Do whatever keeps the lights in stock. But I am not so accepting of their choice to abandon the HA finish. This finish is vastly superior and is a great indicator of product quality.

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+1

BLACK Zebralights??? No thanks!

:fail:

wsaxton said:

I am pretty sure you can get black type III HA but it cost more than the natural.

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If it would cost more, they wouldn't do it.

Lord Muzzy said:

as well as black color anodizing, also at substantial savings compared to the natural anodizing,

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Having worked in the aerospace field for over 30 years, Zebra Light will regret the switch to Chinese manufactured aluminum stock.

In the early 90's there was a cost cutting effort made to use Russian aluminum. It had lots of inclusions that led to part failures. Metallurgically each lot differed by more that industry standards, and we banned the use.

As for hard anodizing, the anodize bath has very cold, like 34-38 degrees F. As the current is applied you have to monitor the voltageand temperature to keep the parts from burning (the light spots with a halo you're seeing). Decorative anodizing is done at room temperature and isn't subject to the same issues, so Zebra Light is going the less costly route.

The Chinese are not known for their quality standards. Ever notice that there are no Chinese made aircraft flying outside of China? There's a reason.

KEEP the natural anodizing please!

When the better companies find others copying their products, the leaders usually make/keep their product distinctive (like maybe offering that gold anodizing that they had in the past) as in keeping the greenish, natural type III. Joining the race to the bottom trying to compete with knock offs? I'm not so sure. (But that might increase the value of the existing, natural type III lights we already own)

NoNotAgain said:

Having worked in the aerospace field for over 30 years, Zebra Light will regret the switch to Chinese manufactured aluminum stock. In the early 90's there was a cost cutting effort made to use Russian aluminum. It had lots of inclusions that led to part failures. Metallurgically each lot differed by more that industry standards, and we banned the use. As for hard anodizing, the anodize bath has very cold, like 34-38 degrees F. As the current is applied you have to monitor the voltageand temperature to keep the parts from burning (the light spots with a halo you're seeing). Decorative anodizing is done at room temperature and isn't subject to the same issues, so Zebra Light is going the less costly route. The Chinese are not known for their quality standards. Ever notice that there are no Chinese made aircraft flying outside of China? There's a reason.

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First, there is a different quality needed for aerospace parts vs. flashlights. I don't think you can point to a lack of Chinese airplanes flying globally as an indicator of quality, likely more related to military spending gaps between the US and China. Many US aerospace companies depend on fat government contracts, and take advantage of economies of scale that confers. You subsidize them with tax dollars. The Chinese will manufacture to as tight a tolerance as you want, but you need to pay for it, and monitor it, as with any manufacturer. Remember the 60's when people used to think similarly of Japanese products? I'm sure people spouted the same for years after it ceased being true. Here in Canada we can buy Chinese made guns - a product category that has a higher cost if failures happen - and gunsmiths regularly comment that the 1911 clones and Rem 870 shotguns clones (of which I own one) metallurgical quality (steel) surpasses what can be found in US ones, and at the price are a bargain - imagine what the difference could be if we paid on par for them at base cost? ZebraLight essentially is blaming their sourcing decisions and QC failure on the Chinese, rather than owning up to their lack of control over their product - is the company Chinese, or American? Maybe Chinese when they fail, US for the marketing department?

rotncore said:

First, there is a different quality needed for aerospace parts vs. flashlights. I don't think you can point to a lack of Chinese airplanes flying globally as an indicator of quality, likely more related to military spending gaps between the US and China. Many US aerospace companies depend on fat government contracts, and take advantage of economies of scale that confers. You subsidize them with tax dollars. The Chinese will manufacture to as tight a tolerance as you want, but you need to pay for it, and monitor it, as with any manufacturer. Remember the 60's when people used to think similarly of Japanese products? I'm sure people spouted the same for years after it ceased being true. Here in Canada we can buy Chinese made guns - a product category that has a higher cost if failures happen - and gunsmiths regularly comment that the 1911 clones and Rem 870 shotguns clones (of which I own one) metallurgical quality (steel) surpasses what can be found in US ones, and at the price are a bargain - imagine what the difference could be if we paid on par for them at base cost?

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You being a Canadian know of Bombardier? The Global went to the drawing board years after China started the design of the ARJ-21. The ARJ-21 was to be China's crown jewel for regional transportation for the 2008 Olympic games. Guess what, it's still not flying and probably never will.

My point is/was that the Chinese don't have a good reputation for quality. The only companies that are able to get quality merchandise are those that station US representatives on site 24/7. I have friends outside of aerospace that have been sent to China as technical specialists for off-set programs, only to find on late night inspections that their orders were being countermanded by plant managers. It's one thing if you own the plant verses sub-contracting work. Does Zebra Light own the plant or are they contracting the work?

Here in the US, the Chinese made M1A, the Norinco is just average at best due to the Chinese parts used verses the Springfield Armory USGI part built gun. I'm happy your 1911 and 870 work fine, but they're not on the same QC level as US made weapons. I can't speak for the 870 Express as my 870's are older Wingmaster versions.

The Chinese don't use lead based paints on children's toys to poison them, but to help the bottom line due to lead in the drier making colors brilliant.

Metallurgy demands consistency. Whether you're sourcing metal for aerospace parts or flashlights, it needs to be of good quality and it needs to be the same for lot to lot.