6x 14500 in FM holder...possibilities?

[Crenshaw]

i can put in 6 x 14500s

~24.6v nominal

~21.6v working

what are my options from there?

i have glass lens+metal reflector. Its currently an ROP. I Have a reflector for G4 bulbs though.I plan to order the bi-pin adaptor, am i missing anything else other then the bulb?

any help much appreciated.

Crenshaw

 

[FILIPPO]

aren't they in 2S3P configuration?

Total nominal voltage would be 7,4V....

 

[Crenshaw]

aren't they in 2S3P configuration?

Total nominal voltage would be 7,4V....

you lost me....

i am a complete noob when it comes to incan, the limits of my knowledge extend to series= add up the Vs, parallel, add up the Is
and over driving= brighter, whiter until it pops.

Crenshaw

 

[Illum]

well we're not in incan yet, we're just taking about your holder
2S3P = 2 series 3 parallel
2x14500s is 3.6Vx2 = 7.2V [4.2x2=8.4 OCV on fresh cells ]
3 parallel is well...1 stack of 2 14500s yields 7.2V @ 750mah
3 parallel stacks is 750x3=2250mah without losses

so, given that your 6x14500 is a 2S3P holder, you have 7.2V 2250mah to work with

if your holder happen to be 6x14500s configured in 6S1P [or just "series"], you pretty much have 21.6V nominal [25.2 OCV on fresh cells] and only 750mah in capacity...thats a pretty worthless configuration for hotwire lamps:shakehead

AW protected 14500s can take up to 2C of current draw [1C = capacity of battery, 2C = 2x750mah = 1.5 amp draw max] Most hotwire lamps draw at least 3 amps, 3A = 3000mah. 3000/750=4, 4Cs is potentially dangerous using 14500s not to mention a very very short runtime under the assumption that your holder is configured in series.

now, if your holder is what Filippo's referring to 2S3P, then you have to size your lamp within 7.2V[3.6 (nom)x2]-8.4V[4.2 (peak)x2]
but you have 2250mah to work with.

at a maximum of 2C current draw [as stated per AW guidelines] 2x2250=4500, or 4.5 amps max for the holder. The values gives you a general parameter for your lamp...then we can go on to choosing lamps

 

[Crenshaw]

ahhh, okay that makes sense now....im pretty sure its 6S1P because Its my ROP battery holder, with 6 imedion Nimhs in it now. SO...maybe not such a great idea huh....i was hoping to maybe build something like a mag85 in that 2D.
by the way, i recall reading something about the switch and maybe the socket or something in the mag needing to be changed out for higher up hotwires?

Crenshaw

 

[fivemega]

14500 cells are too small to power up high current hotwires in 6S configuration but 6x17670 will work much better in tri bored 2.5D
For shorter M*g85 you need a tri bored 1.25 M*g with 3x17670

 

[Illum]

ahhh, okay that makes sense now....im pretty sure its 6S1P because Its my ROP battery holder, with 6 imedion Nimhs in it now. SO...maybe not such a great idea huh....i was hoping to maybe build something like a mag85 in that 2D.
by the way, i recall reading something about the switch and maybe the socket or something in the mag needing to be changed out for higher up hotwires?

Crenshaw

well, there was a discussion on the mag's switch spring having high resistance in nature and most consider cutting off the neck of the switch and soldering heavy gauge wiring directly to the switch assembly. Also, the spring on the tailcaps replaced with a gold plated spring from kaidomain.
Supposedly the anodizing in the tailcap must be dremeled off for better conduction [anodizing is an insulator btw] but they all measure in mohms
or milliohms, my Mag85 works in a stock mag, but just not as bright as a polished/cleaned/modded/pro-golded mag. thats all...
All I did was replace the d cells with a FM holder, the window with borofloat from lighthound, the reflector a FM MOP, and a G4 brass bi-pin to PR adapter from FM...then I'm done

the only thing that would require the removal of the stock light tower would be a lamp that has the temperature to melt it...see OSRAM HLX lamps and the mag623
in those cases, a KIU high-temp ceramic socket would replace the entire switch assembly completely. the tutorials sounds easy, but I took my mag 3D apart and took forever to put it back together

14500 cells are too small to power up high current hotwires in 6S configuration but 6x17670 will work much better in tri bored 2.5D
For shorter M*g85 you need a tri bored 1.25 M*g with 3x17670

I prefer 17670s because they fit in the DSD, but if your looking to upgrade to a mag85 using a 2D ROP...:thinking:
Considering your location, Tri-boring sounds like a hassle
2D Mag85 Questions

 

[mdocod]

technically speaking, there are probably some options that WOULD work with 6x14500s in series. Just have to keep in mind that limit of ~1.5A, I would personally set that limit at 1.2A for safety and practicality.

So what you need is a bulb that will operate at around 26 watts, maybe as high as around 30 watts, that will do so with around 22V input.

If it were me, and my goal was a 6x14500 powered incan, I'd buy up some various 12V 10W long life halogens to play with. Some might handle the overdrive, some might pop, in the name of experimentations, some bulbs must be blown

here's a link to a G4 base halogen bi-pin that would be at the top of my list of bulbs to try in this configuration:
http://www.bulbconnection.com/ViewItem/bcrw/itmid/1905/oc/JCX12V-10W/G4/item.html
By my calculations, the result would be a bulb operating somewhere in these approximated ranges: ~22V, ~1.2-1.4A, ~26-30W, ~5-15 hour life, 600-900 bulb lumens. Or it might just burn out as soon as it is tried, but it might work.

here's another possible option:
http://www.1000bulbs.com/12-Volt-G4-Base-Halogen-Xenon/5987/

In conclusion, I don't know if I would bother, but the configuration would have some advantages: Like: cheap replacement bulbs (~$2 each online), if you find one that doesn't instaflash frequently, li-ion power storage with minimal self discharge, similar brightness to an ROP high, less losses from resistance since you'd be running higher voltage and lower current.

 

[Crenshaw]

Thanks for the help, my ROP has taught me much about incan, and i have new new found respect for them....

I will go and do all the background reading needed....

hopefully i will have a high powered incan 2D mag soon..

on the topic of a mag85...if i bought an 3D mag, and FM 9AA>3D and the WA bulb, and since i have the G4 reflector and glass lens, is that all i need? or is the KIU socket a necessity to avoid a big mess later on.

resistence fixes can come later

Crenshaw

 

[sb_pete]

No Kiu socket needed for a mag85, but you will need a metal reflector.

The FM reflectors are better than the KD reflectors for WA1185 bulbs. I prefer not to use a Kiu socket so as to keep the focusing ability. That said, a KD smooth reflector will not, in my experience, focus down enough and will have a dark center spot. The KD MOP reflector works fine though. This is because the FM reflectors taper all the way down to the hole whereas the KD ones do not taper as deep and make the hole the right size by filling in the larger hole with a flat reflective part. In short, the FM reflectors are better when available, a KD MOP reflector works fine, but a KD SMO reflector will be dissapointing for this application.

Hope that helps
-Pete

 

[FILIPPO]

Litho123 sells reflectors for 20$...check here:
(here you can also get some popula bulbs)
http://www.cpfmarketplace.com/mp/showthread.php?t=168089