Dealing with people in the inner city.

Manzerick

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I think we're all saying the same thing different ways. We like to think we don't have preconceived notions but the fact is we do to some extent. No matter the situation it can be understood the individual is responsible not the whole ethic group. If a pattern forms then it can be deduced that it is the ethic group.
 

twentysixtwo

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Clearly, no ethnic group has a lock on bad behavior. 270Winchester, being on the west coast, may have to deal with being confused for an "FOB" and resents the stereotype.

I'm Asian and originally from LA. Back in the 70's and 80's, there were very few Asians in the valley who weren't 2nd or 3rd generation so the stereotype was different. Come to think of it, there were very few Asians in the valley in general.

When I got to Berkeley, I found myself annoyed by "FOB's" who perpetuated some of the asian stereotypes. I was an "ABC" who, although studying Engineering, also rode a Motorcycle and played guitar.

Being in Michigan now, the difference is that people often assume that I'm not native. Funny, when they ask me where I'm from, I respond "California"

One thing about people passing on the right - don't know the exact situation, but if they were from Japan, they might be simply confused. I have an interesting story sometime about someone who passed on the left. Unfortunately they were in England at the time.
 

Brighteyez

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twentysixtwo said:
Clearly, no ethnic group has a lock on bad behavior. 270Winchester, being on the west coast, may have to deal with being confused for an "FOB" and resents the stereotype.

I don't think it would be unreasonable to be concerned about a young person who appears to be ashamed of his race, ethnic origins, and culture. That has to potential for pathological behavior down the road. I'm guessing that his is of Asian descent, he never confirmed that. He only said that his parents were of Asian-American descent (for all I know he could be black and adopted.) Also a little scary is that stuff about his grandmother being a "commie". I'd be inclined to give him the benefit of the doubt to think that his grandmother may have emigrated from China (aka Mainland China, Red China, etc.) rather than being a member of the American Communist Party, or a dyed in wool desciple of Chairman Mao.

twentysixtwo said:
I'm Asian and originally from LA. Back in the 70's and 80's, there were very few Asians in the valley who weren't 2nd or 3rd generation so the stereotype was different. Come to think of it, there were very few Asians in the valley in general.

From what I"ve heard, there are entire cities in the LA area now that are differentiated by people from specific cultures. One example that was presented to me was Monterey Park which is mostly inhabited by people of the Chinese culture (they weren't clear as to whether they were mostly immigrants or 2 or later generations.) There is probably a greater density of Asian/Pacific Islander people in the Valley these days than when you were there.

I understand that the majority population in San Franscisco by racial makeup is now Asian/Pacific Islander with Caucasian being second. And in the South Bay there are much larger areas that are primarily Asian than there used to be and there has been a lot of Taiwanese money that has flowed in to invest in shopping centers to cater to this demographic.

twentysixtwo said:
When I got to Berkeley, I found myself annoyed by "FOB's" who perpetuated some of the asian stereotypes. I was an "ABC" who, although studying Engineering, also rode a Motorcycle and played guitar.

I've only seen/heard of that ABC/FOB stuff from people of the Chinese community and always found it a bit odd that such a differentiation and delineation would exist within their own community. Never really understood why. I don't know if it is a misinterpretation, but I get the impression that members of the Chinese community seem to stay closer and within their own communities than Asians of other nationalities? Seems that in my day, I had classmates of Chinese descent who were born and raised in the U.S., yet had English as a second language.

twentysixtwo said:
Being in Michigan now, the difference is that people often assume that I'm not native. Funny, when they ask me where I'm from, I respond "California"

Well that sounds reasonable. While I know what you're trying to get at, I wonder what you think you should respond with? If you were born and raised in California and emigrated to Michigan, just what are you suppose to say when someone asks you where you're from? (As a Northern Californian, I'd think we'd prefer that you used "Southern California", "La-La land", "the San Fernando Valley" or something like that, but that's a topic for another discussion :) ).

twentysixtwo said:
One thing about people passing on the right - don't know the exact situation, but if they were from Japan, they might be simply confused. I have an interesting story sometime about someone who passed on the left. Unfortunately they were in England at the time.

Actually I observed this while in Seoul on a business trip. Had nothing to do with China. And yes, I know they drive on the left in Hong Kong, Singapore, and Japan (I don't think that was an issue.) One of the members of my golf club who immigrated from Taiwan many years ago mentioned that there are many Asian drivers who have never driven a car before until they arrived in the U.S. and by that time they're often in their mid-30s. The lack of driving experience and their traffic pattern influence from the motherland is not always a very good combination ;) .
 

270winchester

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OddOne hit it on the head, tolerance is not acceptance. While we tolerate people who we do not approve of, we are not obligated to like them just because we are in the same racial group.

WHile I as a member of the society, witnessing things I do not like, it is not in my place to force them to act like me. However, it does not strip me of the option to have my opinions and voice it in a discussion.

Brigheyes, from what I have gathered you are not Asian, but just a very, very PC person that lives in San Jose. So why not tolerate us without resorting to name-calling? You keep saying that you know people who are Chinese/Asian or of Asian descent, but with all due respect, you do not live their lives and you do not experience the kind of junk they go through in America.

I do not pretend I know every darned thing about whites in America or the African Americans, because I do not live their lives. So please stop with the condescending tone toward those of us who speak from our own experience just because you know some Asian people or have traveled to Asian countries.
 

Brighteyez

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Actually I don't recall mentioning my race, and indeed I did so intentionally because it would have given it a bias. Because you (and you're not alone, so don't get all senstive about my picking on you) don't know the difference between race and nationality, and I believe it is you're the one who hasn't a clue as to how people of Chinese descent have been victimized and discriminated against. Certainly at least from your perspective, it all happened before you were born, and with the waves of recent immigration, possibly before your parents or grandparents arrived in this country. And no doubt, since your birth, you've probably never known racism as it once existed in this country, other than possibly through some filtered history books.

Much as I'm becoming aware that you may be very much of a lost cause and are hopelessly lost as a "banana" as I believe is the appropriate term in the Chinese-American community, I'm not going to waste a lot of time on this other than to list a few points about 'being Asian'.


1. All people who are classified as being Asian racially are not Chinese, or Chinese-American. There are other countries in Asia besides China. There are also people in countries like Viet Nam, Burma, Laos, Thailand, Singapore, Malaysia, Korea, Japan, Pakistan, and India who are considered of Chinese heritage.

2. There was a Chinese migration, mostly peasants and laborers that came to the U.S. from the mid 1800s until just before the Chinese Exclusion Act. Descendants from those immigrants are well into their 6th and 7th generations as Americans, and no doubt some of their cultural heritage has been lost, people from those families are more likely to have Chinese as a second language if they understand it at all. These are the people whose families have known real discrimination, the Baby Boomers from these families are now starting to become today's senior citizens. Some of them aren't too knowledgeable of their heritage either. But for racial purposes, they would be Americans by nationality and Asian/Pacific Islander by race

3. There are also the Americans of Japanese descent who migrated to the US in the late 1800s and later, many of whom became prisoners of war in their own country during WWII. These families are also well into the 5th, 6th, and 7th, and have bravely stood up for their country regardless how their country treated them. Count the heroes of the US Army's highly decorated 442nd Regimental Combat Team and the 100th Infantry Battalion in this group. Last I heard people from this group were mostly classified by the Bureau of the Census as Asian/Pacific Islander

4. There are people who would be classified as Caucasian who are citizens of Asian countries (not just working there, but actually citizens.) Their nationality would be reflective of their citizenship and they may have adapted the culture and would consider themselves to be of that culture. These people could be Korean, Japanese, Chinese, Singaporean, Taiwanese, by nationality, I don't know if those countries classify by race, but in the US they would be classified as White/Caucasian.

5. There are couples of Asian racial heritage, in the United States, who have adopted or raised (e.g. Foster Family Program) children of various racial backgrounds and these children may have been raise in the cultural traditions of the adopted parent's heritage. Children who are products of this upbringing may indeed consider their cultural heritage (and rightly so) to be Chinese, Japanese, or whatever the parent's cultural heritage may have been.

6. There are people from various Asian nations who have immigrated to or have come to the US as refugees, during a more recent wave of immigration that started in the early 70's, most would be classified as Asian/Pacific Islander by race.

7. There are people who are racially Asian, who are not natives of what is considered today's Asia, but rather natives of the former Soviet Union and are now citizens of the countries that have formed following the downfall of the USSR.

8. And since Chinese seems to be of your cultural heritage, there are also people in countries outside of Asia other than the U.S. who are of Chinese heritage, they might call themselves, Canadians, British, German, French, Mexican, Brazilian, etc.

I'll give you a hint, I'm in one of the 8 groups, if it's important for you. Personally I don't care.

I believe it is you who may not have the good fortune to have avoided having to live the lives of those who made your Asian experience in this country so much more comfortable than theirs. And I'm sure those abused immigrant railroad workers who were sent over a cliff held only by a frail rope to light a stick of dynamite and hope to get back up before it blew (ever hear of the term "Chinaman's Chance", that's where it came from) would roll over in their graves if they heard you spewing the rhetoric of the descendents of those who sent them over those cliffs.

I'm afraid that you, sir, do not only don't know "every darned thing about whites" but also could benefit from learning a bit more about your own heritage and those who have suffered on your behalf so that you wouldn't have to.

And yeah, I know a few Asian people. Also people from just about every part of the world. It kind of comes from living in this area. And I own a few firearms too.

270winchester said:
Brigheyes, from what I have gathered you are not Asian, but just a very, very PC person that lives in San Jose. So why not tolerate us without resorting to name-calling? You keep saying that you know people who are Chinese/Asian or of Asian descent, but with all due respect, you do not live their lives and you do not experience the kind of junk they go through in America.

I do not pretend I know every darned thing about whites in America or the African Americans, because I do not live their lives. So please stop with the condescending tone toward those of us who speak from our own experience just because you know some Asian people or have traveled to Asian countries.
 

Empath

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Brighteyez, consider Nick's arrangement for discussion. Any additional posts in this thread by you that consists of talking TO 270winchester, or ABOUT 270winchester, will be deleted. Confine your posts to talking OF the topic. Your post may contain some useful information, but they also contain flames.
 

goldenlight

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I have to shop in the inner city; it costs to much in gasoline to drive to the suburbs.

One thing I've learned shopping in the inner city: carrying a Glock loaded with +P+ Hydrashoks 'takes the worry out of being close'.
 
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