Eneloops - Shoulder's to big for the MH-C9000

[Bones]

I just zapped a set of my Eneloops with a 1C charge for the very first time in my MH-C9000.

Slot 2 terminated the charge prematurely at 1068 mAh.

Thinking it might be a contact problem, I took a closer look at how the cells sit in the charger, and noticed the shoulder of all the Eneloops sit hard against the opening for the top contact.

This means it doesn't matter how much pressure the bottom tang places on the cell, it won't effect the contact of the positive post.

About the only thing I can think of that might make a difference is to make sure the wrap overlap is turned towards the bottom right. This will allow it to sit inside the opening for the top contact.

I mention the bottom right because you also want to minimize the effect the overlap has on the temperature sensor. Until now, I've always faced the wrap overlap upwards.

It seems Sanyo has noticed this as well, the following hyperlink documents the re-sizing of the Eneloop to allow for a taller positive post.

http://translate.google.com/transla...search?q=eneloop+r&num=50&hl=en&safe=off&sa=G

The resized cell is apparently called the Eneloop-R.

Now I have to go and apologize to my poor Eneloops.

They've never before been even remotely close to as hot as they just got charging at the 'recommended' rate.

 

[Bones]

One thousand words:

 

[NutSAK]

The resized cell is apparently called the Eneloop-R.

I don't think they're really called "Eneloop-R". But, note that the new improved one has a registered trademark "R" symbol next to the logo.

 

[WildChild]

The Duracell Pre-Charged have the longer positive button of the Eneloop-R.

 

[dekelsey61]

Bones,
What do you mean by wrap overlap is turned to the bottom right?
Thank you for your reply.
Dan

I just zapped a set of my Eneloops with a 1C charge for the very first time in my MH-C9000.

Slot 2 terminated the charge prematurely at 1068 mAh.

Thinking it might be a contact problem, I took a closer look at how the cells sit in the charger, and noticed the shoulder of all the Eneloops sit hard against the opening for the top contact.

This means it doesn't matter how much pressure the bottom tang places on the cell, it won't effect the contact of the positive post.

About the only thing I can think of that might make a difference is to make sure the wrap overlap is turned towards the bottom right. This will allow it to sit inside the opening for the top contact.

I mention the bottom right because you also want to minimize the effect the overlap has on the temperature sensor. Until now, I've always faced the wrap overlap upwards.

It seems Sanyo has noticed this as well, the following hyperlink documents the re-sizing of the Eneloop to allow for a taller positive post.

http://translate.google.com/transla...search?q=eneloop+r&num=50&hl=en&safe=off&sa=G

The resized cell is apparently called the Eneloop-R.

Now I have to go and apologize to my poor Eneloops.

They've never before been even remotely close to as hot as they just got charging at the 'recommended' rate.

 

[Bones]

I don't think they're really called "Eneloop-R". But, note that the new improved one has a registered trademark "R" symbol next to the logo.

Methinks your correct NutSAK, but nonetheless it works, rather well in fact...

 

[Bones]

The Duracell Pre-Charged have the longer positive button of the Eneloop-R.

They really are identical aren't they WildChild?

Can you tell if the Duracell also has the squared off postive post that has been previously noted as an Eneloop characteristic?

 

[Bones]

What do you mean by wrap overlap is turned to the bottom right?

With respect to the MH-C9000, it means that when the Eneloop is inserted in the charger, the cell wrapper overlap is sitting in the 4 to 5 o'clock position dekelsey61.

In fact, if you insert an Eneloop with the overlap facing down, and then rotate the cell counter-clockwise, you may be able to feel the overlap catch the edge of the positive contact opening.

Admittedly, it's a trivial gain, but with the shoulder of the cell sitting hard against the opening, it's difficult to determine how much pressure there is against the top contact, so it could be just enough make an difference.

Incidentally, if you look closely at the shoulder of the Duracell image in WildChild's post, you can see the pronounced wrap overlap quite well.

Hope this helped, I've never been very adept at this degree of discriptive authoring.

 

[TorchBoy]

Re: Eneloops - Shoulder's toO big for the MH-C9000

My Eneloop cells don't have the ® and they fit just fine in my MH-C9000. There's a good gap there, thanks to a couple of sharp bumps on the charger contact. The nipple is noticeably smaller than that on some house brand alkalines I have lying around.

Bones, what model is your MH-C9000? Also, if kansai-event.com isn't your own site you should host the pics somewhere yourself.

 

[WildChild]

They really are identical aren't they WildChild?

Can you tell if the Duracell also has the squared off postive post that has been previously noted as an Eneloop characteristic?

Yes it has it. Same shape, same texture, only slightly longer like the Eneloop-R you shown. See this post:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=2205122&postcount=3

They also have a batch code stamped the same way, with the same font as the Eneloop, melted in the plastic shrink wrap.

Oh and the white circle around the positive tip is made of the same material (same texture, color, etc.).

 

[Bones]

I don't think they're really called "Eneloop-R". But, note that the new improved one has a registered trademark "R" symbol next to the logo.

Methinks you're correct NutSAK, but nonetheless it works, rather well in fact...

It appears the author of the Kansai-Event article wasn't taking complete liberty in naming the resized Eneloop the Eneloop-R, it appears the new cell is actually labelled as such.

Click on the image to view full sized on the Kansai-Event site:

 

[Bones]

My Eneloop cells don't have the ® and they fit just fine in my MH-C9000. There's a good gap there, thanks to a couple of sharp bumps on the charger contact.

It sounds like you've made a working modification to your charger Torch Boy. Please share the details.

I've been thinking about modifying mine, but the only way I've devised thus far is by placing a spacer of sorts behind the contacts for the postive post.

For this to work though, there has to be enough room in the slot containing the contact to accomodate the spacer.

I've just put a couple of 2300 mAh Energizers through a 1C charge in the slot that prematurely terminated with two different Eneloops, and it seemed to charge both the Energizers correctly.

This is a pretty strong indication to me that it is a contact problem causing the premature termination with the Eneloops.

The nipple is noticeably smaller than that on some house brand alkalines I have lying around.

Okay...?

Bones, what model is your MH-C9000?

It's the original release OFAB01.

Also, if kansai-event.com isn't your own site you should host the pics somewhere yourself.

Actually, I decided linking was the lessor offense since the other way involved the theft of the sites images.

I will admit this way involves a loss of bandwith instead, but the images are not very big, and it's not being done for personal gain.

As well, the webmaster always has the option of blocking the linkage.

 

[Bones]

They really are identical aren't they WildChild?

Can you tell if the Duracell also has the squared off postive post that has been previously noted as an Eneloop characteristic?

Yes it has it. Same shape, same texture, only slightly longer like the Eneloop-R you shown. See this post:

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showpost.php?p=2205122&postcount=3

They also have a batch code stamped the same way, with the same font as the Eneloop, melted in the plastic shrink wrap.

Oh and the white circle around the positive tip is made of the same material (same texture, color, etc.).

My apologies WildChild, I didn't realize you had already done your due diligence here.

Is it now reasonable to state both the Sony Cyle Energy Blue and the Duracell Pre-Charged Rechargeables are rebadged Eneloops?

 

[TorchBoy]

Re: Eneloops - Shoulder's toO big for the MH-C9000

... it appears the new cell is actually labelled as such.

It looks to me like those words are just superimposed on the photo.

It sounds like you've made a working modification to your charger Torch Boy. Please share the details.

Sorry, I haven't changed anything there.

Okay...?

What, you don't call them nipples? :huh:

It's the original release OFAB01.

Here's a pic of a positive terminal from that model. The gap when an Eneloop is inserted is smaller than on my newer model but there's still a clear gap. Does your one have the two bumps there? The AAA position underneath also has them.

Actually, I decided linking was the lessor offense since the other way involved the theft of the sites images.

Unfortunately the site we're now posting on (CPF) deems the theft (loan?) of images more acceptable than the theft of bandwidth, which may have to be paid for. Expecting the webmaster to change the pic to protect his/her bandwidth and wallet/purse is probably unreasonable.

See http://www.candlepowerforums.com/Rules.html#siglines for more info.

DO NOT hotlink the images!!! Hotlinking is when you are stealing the bandwidth of a website that you do not have permission to link to.

 

[abvidledUK]

Small magnet ala DX ?

I've cut down the shoulders on my PIR nightlights to allow some, only some, of my nimh's to fit, where normal alkalines fit ok.

Some nimh brands definitely have shorter positive terminals.

 

[Burgess]

interesting !


Gotta' go check mine.



_

 

[Bones]

Re: Eneloops - Shoulder's toO big for the MH-C9000

It appears the author of the Kansai-Event article wasn't taking complete liberty in naming the resized Eneloop the Eneloop-R, it appears the new cell is actually labelled as such.

It looks to me like those words are just superimposed on the photo.

Conceded..., but only upon belated verification that none of my Eneloops have the lateral logo depicted.

It sounds like you've made a working modification to your charger Torch Boy. Please share the details.

Sorry, I haven't changed anything there.

A misinterpretation, I thought you meant you had reshaped the contact with a couple of sharp 'bumps' or blows.

Okay...?

What, you don't call them nipples?

Gasp...!

Actually, just uncertain how to fit the sentence into the context of the post.

It's the original release OFAB01.

Here's a pic of a positive terminal from that model. The gap when an Eneloop is inserted is smaller than on my newer model but there's still a clear gap. Does your one have the two bumps there? The AAA position underneath also has them.

Yes, mine looks exactly the same.

If you ever open up your newer model, I would be interested in whether there is a spacer behind the contact.

Actually, I decided linking was the lessor offense since the other way involved the theft of the sites images.

Unfortunately the site we're now posting on (CPF) deems the theft (loan?) of images more acceptable than the theft of bandwidth, which may have to be paid for.

Understood, and will now comply.

What is this world coming to though, when a person is quite reasonably expected to read the rules.

Isn't that a breach of the same protocol that prohibits reading instruction manuals and road maps?

Mind you, I've never read that either...

As well, the webmaster always has the option of blocking the linkage.

Expecting the webmaster to change the pic to protect his/her bandwidth and wallet/purse is probably unreasonable.

As I understand it, the webmaster inserts a code in .htaccess which prevents all hot-linking.
.

 

[Bones]

Re: Eneloops - Shoulder's toO big for the MH-C9000

Just acknowledging TorchBoy's title edit which reflects the proper 'too'...
.

 

[Bones]

I decided it would be worthwhile to attempt to modify my MH-C9000 (OFAB01) to accomodate the Eneloop and other cells with shorter positive posts.

After considering and rejecting the idea of reshaping the contact itself, I ended up inserting a spacer behind each of the postive contacts. The positive contact is basically a flat metal tang with outward protrusions as shown in TorchBoy's image. Each tang sits in its own slot in the top compartment of the charger.

The thickness of the spacer was determined by how much resistance it caused while sliding a tang in and out of its slot. If the spacer was to thick it could end up causing one or more of the tangs to break off before pulling out of its slot during any future disassembly.

The ideal thickness turned out to be that of a closed Oxford file folder made from post consumer paper. I started by cutting upwards from the fold, and inserted each spacer with its fold at the bottom of the slot.

There is now a gap between the shoulder of the Eneloops and the top contact of the charger. It's not much more than the thickness of a Post-it note inserted edgewise, but a gap nonetheless. In fact, if the wrap overlap is faced upwards, it causes some resistance when the note is inserted.

Interestingly, there seems to be a very slight difference in the four gaps, with slot 2 having the least and slot 4 having the most. This coincides with the fact that it was slot 2 that terminated early during a 1C charge as mentioned in my first post.

 

[TorchBoy]

Re: Eneloops - Shoulder's too big for the MH-C9000

Conceded..., but only upon belated verification that none of my Eneloops have the lateral logo depicted.

IMHO just by looking at it, the text doesn't look like it's on the object.
with a close inspection it's pretty clear it's been put in with an image editor just to denote the cells.

Isn't that a breach of the same protocol that prohibits reading instruction manuals and road maps?

The older I get the more likely I am to read them. :sigh:

It's good that you were able to fix it so easily. :twothumbs FWIW I haven't seen any variation in gap between slots on mine.