help a newbie? another "recommend a light" thread

[Y.T.]

Hello and happy holidays to all. I've browsed the CP forums before, but only now registered. I'm looking for a LED pocket light and would appreciate some recommendations that meet my use and budget (see info below). I'm still researching, but thought you knowledgeable folks might be able to provide some pointers.

I read through carrot's great guide and nabbed the flashlight checklist that was reposted on EDC forums (I couldn't find a sticky with it here). My answers to the checklist are below.

The Fenix EO and LOD were both recommended to me and seem fine light, but after some investigation they also seem so small for my intended use. Maybe I'm underestimating them? I also wasn't clear what Fenix means by "sun mode" and "moon mode" for the EO light since it only has one brightness setting. The Inova X1 was also recommended, but again seems more mini than pocket size and therefore I question it's power & throw for my intended use.

Thanks in advance for your time.


Recommend a Flashlight Checklist:

1) Short Essay Question: What do you intend to use this light for?

I need a general use pocket-size flashlight for BOB (go bag), emergency and camping. I already have an LED headlamp and 2 EDC mini-lights (one mini-Mag, one Petzel e-lite headlamp). I want something larger, with more power and throw than my mini lights.

Long runtime is important to me. I'd rather have a light that can last for several days with few battery changes, than something that's going to light up like the sun but only lasts a few hours. I prefer a twist switch or slide switch since this will be stored in a pack most of the time. I'm concerned that a button switch could easily be bumped and turned on while stored.

I expect this to be mostly outdoor use such as walking trails, open desert areas, or urban areas. I'm in Arizona which means lots of dust and camping is mostly open desert (needing a wider flood of light to avoid brush, holes, critters -- a long distance light just shows a whole lot of nothing).

2) What Region/Country/State will the light be purchased in?
[ ] I will be buying online, so this doesn't matter.

3) Price Range: An easy question, but you may change your mind after answering the rest!
[ ] $15-30
[ ] $40-60
* my budget is limited, so the above pricing is taking into account that I may need to some research to find good deals or sales.

4) Format:
PART A
[ ] I want a flashlight.

PART B
Length:
[ ] 2-4 inches - basically under 5" is fine (Pocket carry)

PART C
Width:
[ ] I prefer a short wide light, but I'm flexible on this point

PART D
Weight:
[ ] Medium light, about the weight of a AAA MiniMag
[ ] Medium, slightly heavier than a AA MiniMag

5) What kind of "bulb".
[ ] LED - more rugged, unlikely to burn out in your lifetime, less accurate color rendition, in general less output but more efficient (longer runtimes)

6) What batteries do you want to use?
[ ] I want common Alkaline batteries. (AA, AAA)
or
[ ] I want lithium batteries. (coin cells, CR123, AAA, AA...)

7) How much light do you want?
[ ] I want to walk around a generally paved area. (15-20 lumens)
[ ] I want to walk unpaved trails. (40 lumens)

8) Throw vs Flood: Which do you prefer, lights that flood an area with a wide beam, or lights that "throw" with a tightly focused beam?

Throw (distance)----------------------|---------X-------------Flood/close-up

9) Runtime: Not over-inflated manufacturer runtime claims (like some LED lights).
[ ] 360+ min. (More than 6 hours), willing to sacrifice brightness for longevity

10) Durability: Generally the old phrase "you get what you pay for" is very accurate for flashlights.
[ ] Very Important (Camping, Backpacking, Car Glove-box.)

11) Switch Type:
[ ] twisty switch, so it doesn't get accidentally knocked on
(if push button, a momentary switch is a nice option)
* eta: after further review I'm open to push button since that seems to be more common

12) Switch Location:
[ ] I want a rotating head switch.
or
[ ] I want a rotating end-cap switch.
* eta: see above re: push button

13) Operational Modes: Check all that apply.
[ ] A simple on-off is fine for me. anything else is gravy

14) Is it important whether the body is metal or plastic/composite?
[ ] I don't care.

15) Special Needs: Is there anything else you want or need that hasn't been mentioned?
[ ] desert-worthy (good protect against dust and/or easy to open and clean)
[ ] Built-in second (or spare) lamp or filament handy for shorter life bulbs
[ ] Wrist/Neck Lanyard handy, but I usually have pockets

 

[carrot]

First off, welcome to CPF!

The Nitecore SmartPD lights -- EX10 (CR123) or D10 (AA) fit all your criteria, coming in at something under $59 with the CPF8 coupon code (at 4sevens.com). The Fenix LD10 and PD20 also fit the criteria.

If you are worried about accidental activation, don't be, because you can untwist the head to effectively "lock out" the light without compromising the o-ring seals.

Your length requirement precludes two celled lights like the Nitecore D20, Fenix LD20, and PD30.

These lights are multi-mode/multi-level and so you get to pick how much runtime/output tradeoff you want to make -- at their lowest brightnesses they should be able to meet your requirements of long runtimes.

Also, despite your reservations about the Fenix E01 being too small it does put out ample light, and is still worth a consideration. The size of the E01 makes it perfect for a keyring or even neck-carry on a lanyard.

The terms "sun mode" and "moon mode," if I remember correctly come from terms that Peter Gransee used when he introduced the (legendary) Arc-AAA. Here is an explanation of sun and moon modes by Doug P (Quickbeam) as it relates to the Arc-AAA:

The LED sits in a polished aluminum reflector to direct all of the sidespill light forward toward the subject being illuminated. Behind the perfectly centered LED is the electronics which boost the measly 1.5 volts from the single AAA battery up to a level where the LED can emit a 'serious-for-its-size' beam of light. In addition, those electronics help maintain the brightness of the LED throughout the life of the battery as it is being drained to the point of becoming nothing more than a paperweight. Once the battery can no longer supply enough current to maintain the set brightness of the LED, the light switches to "moon mode". This low light mode is there so that you are not left completely in the dark, while at the same time consuming the last little bit the battery has to give.

Sun mode is not a term thrown around a lot but is generally the light that is put out until the flashlight reaches 50% of its original total output. Moon mode is whatever follows that.

Here is a review of an older version of the E01: http://flashlightreviews.com/reviews/fenix_e0.htm

 

[StarHalo]

2-4 inches, $40-60, LED, flood-ish beam, twisty, good protection, easy to maintain; sounds like a Fenix P1D: https://www.fenix-store.com/product_info.php?cPath=22_65&products_id=354

 

[:)>]

Novatac or Fenix P1D are both great choices and are available at great prices.

The Novatac can be reprogrammed to act like a 120P giving you the ability to set the 4 levels to brighness of your liking.

Good luck.

 

[Y.T.]

First off, welcome to CPF!

thanks! and thanks for your excellent info page.

The Nitecore SmartPD lights -- EX10 (CR123) or D10 (AA) fit all your criteria, coming in at something under $59 with the CPF8 coupon code (at 4sevens.com). The Fenix LD10 and PD20 also fit the criteria.

Thanks for the recs and for the coupon code! I appreciate your time. I'm reading through some specific threads in the Flashlight Reviews section now.

Your length requirement precludes two celled lights like the Nitecore D20, Fenix LD20, and PD30.

really anything under 5" is fine. The Fenix LD20 and Nitecore D20 are too big, but the Fenix PD30 is only 4 1/4" so that may be good.

If you are worried about accidental activation, don't be, because you can untwist the head to effectively "lock out" the light without compromising the o-ring seals.

thanks! I wasn't aware of that. I've seen some good sales on the click button, I may reconsider those now.

Also, despite your reservations about the Fenix E01 being too small it does put out ample light, and is still worth a consideration. The size of the E01 makes it perfect for a keyring or even neck-carry on a lanyard.

again, thanks. good to know.

The terms "sun mode" and "moon mode," if I remember correctly come from terms that Peter Gransee used when he introduced the (legendary) Arc-AAA. Here is an explanation of sun and moon modes by Doug P (Quickbeam) as it relates to the Arc-AAA:

that was very helpful.

 

[Y.T.]

StarHalow, >,
Thanks for the recs. I'm looking into those now. I appreciate your suggestions.

 

[Jarl]

Reading through that, it was like "oooh, no... ok, how about... no." lol

Small light: E01. "only" 10 lumens, but easily enough to walk by on paved/not too rough trails.

Bigger light: PD30 or P3D. Runs of 2xCR123 (or RCR's, which the P1D or P2D can't go so well). The only thing that precludes it is that it's more throwy than your chart would make me expect you to want, though the E01 should give you a decent amount of flood, leaving the PD30/P3D for longer range spotting or absurdly long runtimes on low.

 

[Y.T.]

Thanks for the suggestions. After poking around, it looks like the Fenix PD20/P2D or the Fenix LD10/L1D would be great for what I need. I just need to decided if I want to stay with AA (LD10), or move to CR123 (PD20) batteries. The former is easier to find and I can swap batteries between devices. The latter appears to last longer and I think may become increasingly popular in time.

 

[Toaster]

You'll be happy to know the PD20 and LD10 share the same head. So you can order a 1xAA body to convert a PD20 into an LD10. Or conversely order a 1xCR123 body to convert a LD10 into a PD20. Or you can order a 2xAA body to convert either to an LD20. So you're not stuck buying a new light if you decide you want to make a switch down the line :twothumbs

 

[ebolamonkey3]

What about the EagleTac P10C2? It's got a great UI, really bright, has the length of run time, and is just under 5 inches.

I don't have this light myself, but I've got the P10A2 and I love it.

 

[Jarl]

The latter appears to last longer and I think may become increasingly popular in time.

Interesting you should say that. There are people that take the hardcore view on both sides on the subject, but IMO the consensus is that CR123's have had their day. 20 years ago, if you want 6V to power an incan, it was 2 CR123's or for alkaline D cells, so CR123's really took off then. Now you have boost drivers that can get enough power from a single AA to power an LED decently, high performance NiMH cells with good capacity and without the potential safety issues of CR123's.

That's not to say we'll see CR123's vanish anytime soon- certainly not, they fulfill a role that rechargeables can't and won't ever be able to, and some people need to use primaries, some just prefer to use them. However, I do see them becoming less and less popular as time passes, even without the help of restrictions on lithium cells while flying, and pretty soon the green lobby will probably outlaw them, but lets not go into that here!

Basically, I don't think you need to worry about future proofing your lights, but IMHO the L1D and some sanyo eneloops will be better than the P1D and a lot of CR123's.

 

[Yoda4561]

The only "real" advantage cr123's have in LED setups is their form factor. a 2xAA light for me is just a little longer than I like to have in my pocket. The extra width of a cr123a light is easier to deal with.

 

[Gunner12]

Yes, as Toaster said, the LD10, LD20, and PD20 all have the same circuit board, so if you want to switch between 1AA, 2AA ,or 1 CR123, all you need is the other body and tailcap. The same goes for the L1D, L2D, and P2D. The latter series and the former series also have the same threading, so a LD10's body will fit the P2D's head and so on. The L1T V2.0 and L2T V2.0 also have compatible threads.

You might also want to check out the Olights, mainly the T15 and T10.

:welcome:

 

[carrot]

There are plenty of great reasons to still go with CR123 and I remain stalwart in my decision to almost completely ignore the AA and 2AA form-factor. Yes, they have their place, but not in MY pocket. CR123 is a much better form factor.

 

[snakyjake]

I would advise looking into the Fenix P2D or L0, Nitecore EX10 or D10, LiteFlux LF2X or LF3X.

Consider user interface, how you will carry (do you want a clip?), runtime, output, size, and battery type.

There's reviews on the site that talk about each of the lights. After reading through the site, post any questions you have for us to provide some opinions.

 

[Y.T.]

thanks again for the recommendations. I'm still reading reviews and looking around. After awhile these do all sound like basically the same light with about the same size, output and run time. :laughing:

Though after reading up on the 123 Lithium safety issues I'm questioning the idea of using such a battery in AZ, where it would potentially be exposed to high temps and also the stress of hot days and cold nights (sometimes a 40 degree drop in temperature in just a few hours). I understand that explosions and venting issues are less likely with a single battery light (no mixing issues) and that it's necessary to change the batteries promptly (not drain them down too low, causing overheating). But still, the temperature conditions here may not be well suited for the 123s.

Consider user interface, how you will carry (do you want a clip?), runtime, output, size, and battery type.

I think I stated all that in my OP. a clip is not needed, a lanyard is handy but not necessary.

 

[StarHalo]

Both a lithium/primary 123 and Energizer Lithium AA can handle -40 to 140 degree temps, so no worries there. You only get into extreme temperature issues with the alkaline and rechargeable (NiMH, Li-Ion, etc) cells.

 

[Y.T.]

Both a lithium/primary 123 and Energizer Lithium AA can handle -40 to 140 degree temps, so no worries there. You only get into extreme temperature issues with the alkaline and rechargeable (NiMH, Li-Ion, etc) cells.

Thanks, StarHalo. I was concerned that the repeated change from hot to cold might be an issue. I forgot the 123s have a high temp range tolerance.

gees, who knew flashlights were so complicated? :laughing:

 

[StarHalo]

I was concerned that the repeated change from hot to cold might be an issue.

As long as you're in the battery's rated temp range, you're good to go.

It should also be noted that it'd be pretty hard to get your flashlight over 140 degrees, the exception being car storage in summer. If you do plan on keeping your light in your car during high temps, store it *in the trunk*, where temps never get over 120 (glovebox can reach 140, any spot in direct sunlight can go over 150).

For battery safety and reliability, use only a single-cell configuration with a primary 123 or Energizer Lithium AA for *any* car/storage/emergency light.

 

[SEMIJim]

Now you have boost drivers that can get enough power from a single AA to power an LED decently,

Well, yes, but you can't create something that isn't there. You're still going to get more brightness or runtime out of a single CR123 than a single AA. (Given similar battery chemistries.)

high performance NiMH cells with good capacity

If you're willing to deal with the charging issues. I've BTDT and, quite frankly, for as much as I use battery-powered devices, I've no interest in going back there. (Yes, I know: Not very eco-friendly of me.)

and without the potential safety issues of CR123's.

CR123's mainly have safety issues only in multi-cell configurations, no? And they have the advantage of working better in very cold temperatures, no?

...IMHO the L1D and some sanyo eneloops will be better than the P1D and a lot of CR123's.

FSVO "better."

Quite honestly: I don't use my flashlights often- or long-enough for it to make much difference one-way-or-the-other. I've 1xAA, 2xAA, 1xCR123 and 2xCR123 lights, and they all work well. I've yet to change a battery, tho my 2xCR123 light, the one I've had the longest, is beginning to look like it's about ready for a new set of batteries. (Btw: I always install lithium AAs in my AA-powered lights.) Let's see... that 2xCR123 light was given to me... three years ago.

I buy AA- or CR123-powered lights as the mood strikes me. If, at the instant, I'm more interested in more brightness or longer runtime: I'll choose the CR123. If I'm more interested in easy battery availability, anywhere: I'll choose an AA-powered light. For a BOB, I'd probably go AA. After all: In a TEOTWAWKI scenario: Which are you more likely to find on abandoned convenience store shelves? Well, unless it's already been looted. The average looter would probably give the funny-looking batteries a pass. Hmmm... Decisions, decisions...