High-end Flashlight Makers Could Re-bin LEDs for Better Tint

[twistedraven]

Maybe they're planned on making a new body design for their 18650 lights, and already had the new SC5 body available, so launched those first.

 

[Imon]

Impressive that ZL would do such a thing.

I remember 4Sevens used to have limited runs of warm white or neutral white flashlights (haven't checked up on them recently).
Then I read that they just weren't into it that much since it only constituted a very small percentage of their total sales.

I think things have greatly improved for us flashaholics since the mid/late 2000's.
People here used to joke about the Luxeon lottery and the phrases "angry blue", "pea soup", and "p*** yellow" were not uncommon.

 

[FRITZHID]

Maybe there is something to this "ARE there manufacturer's on this forum?"

..... I'd hope so!
Maybe zebralite has someone here that's paying attention?

 

[pjandyho]

One other manufacturer who tests the LEDs individually would be HDS. Even though the said LEDs are Nichia 219, if it doesn't pass the CRI test of 90+ it doesn't get labelled High CRI, and would only be sold off as neutral white. Also with HDS, each light would be indidually calibrated to the stated output, if they say it's a 325 lumen light so it will be a 325 lumen. Of course run time varies from light to light due to differences in LED efficiency but you will still get the promised run time at the very least.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

One other manufacturer who tests the LEDs individually would be HDS. Even though the said LEDs are Nichia 219, if it doesn't pass the CRI test of 90+ it doesn't get labelled High CRI, and would only be sold off as neutral white. Also with HDS, each light would be indidually calibrated to the stated output, if they say it's a 325 lumen light so it will be a 325 lumen. Of course run time varies from light to light due to differences in LED efficiency but you will still get the promised run time at the very least.

Sure, if you want to spend 5x more than a Zebralight doing something similar.

 

[pjandyho]

Sure, if you want to spend 5x more than a Zebralight doing something similar.

I have a few Zebralights including the SC62W that never got used much because the UI is just slightly more inferior than HDS in my opinion. Not that Zebralights are lousy but it's just that the HDS feels just right in my hands. Not everyone needs a super bright flashlight and not everyone can appreciate the side clicky found on the Zebralight. To each his own. If you like Zebralight then so be it, but I ain't a big fan of Zebralight, and I don't see the need for you to walk in to my post and bash it just for the sake of bashing it. They are NOT similar. If you don't see the need to pay for an HDS, please, keep your comments to yourself rather than being rude about it.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

I have a few Zebralights including the SC62W that never got used much because the UI is just slightly more inferior than HDS in my opinion. Not that Zebralights are lousy but it's just that the HDS feels just right in my hands. Not everyone needs a super bright flashlight and not everyone can appreciate the side clicky found on the Zebralight. To each his own. If you like Zebralight then so be it, but I ain't a big fan of Zebralight, and I don't see the need for you to walk in to my post and bash it just for the sake of bashing it. They are NOT similar. If you don't see the need to pay for an HDS, please, keep your comments to yourself rather than being rude about it.

I'll post my opinions about tint and value how I choose, thank you.

Zebralight is introducing premium tint selection on their SC5 line-up, using the EasyWhite LEDs. While it may not be quite as selective as what HDS does, they're doing it for about one-fifth the price!

Sure, some people will value spending 5x as much, and that's their right. But some of us would rather have 5x the lights.

 

[snowlover91]

I have a few Zebralights including the SC62W that never got used much because the UI is just slightly more inferior than HDS in my opinion. Not that Zebralights are lousy but it's just that the HDS feels just right in my hands. Not everyone needs a super bright flashlight and not everyone can appreciate the side clicky found on the Zebralight. To each his own. If you like Zebralight then so be it, but I ain't a big fan of Zebralight, and I don't see the need for you to walk in to my post and bash it just for the sake of bashing it. They are NOT similar. If you don't see the need to pay for an HDS, please, keep your comments to yourself rather than being rude about it.

It doesnt seem as if he was bashing it but merely stating that the HDS costs about 5x more for similar performance. It's a valid comparison since the HDS is picky about the tint and now Zebralight is as well with some of their new products. From an output standpoint the Zebralights are very similar for a much cheaper price. Sure the HDS are more of a custom light with different switch and great build quality but not everyone wants to spend that much money when you can get a light for much cheaper that offers the same type of performance and is built very well. Keep in mind the Zebralights are also potted like the HDS lights are as well. Main differences are going to be the UI, type of LED used and price. Just my two cents on the issue, they're both great lights and Walkintothelight did make a logical and valid point with his statement.

 

[Imon]

I think some people can only feel good about their selection by putting down other peoples selections.
Not saying anyone in this thread is guilty of that but it's getting there...

To some people, like myself, the one-button click UI of the HDS is worth the price. Besides for Novatac, which were Henry designs anyways, I haven't found another single-button light where I can go straight from one mode to another without having to skip through in-between modes. Plus the programmability of the HDS lights makes it even better and eliminates the high-mode first or low-mode first debate.

 

[twistedraven]

For the size of an HDS light, you can get much higher output and runtimes using an 18650 in a Zebralight as well. A light that's 4 inches and uses only one CR123 is a little perplexing. The form factor and UI of the HDS lights are cool and all, but for a light around that size, they should be providing their customers with 18650s IMO.

 

[Mr Floppy]

The new LED is built on Cree's EasyWhite technology — combining the industry's tightest color binning, intense light output from a single LED and high-voltage options — to best optimize it to replace halogen technology.

That is a passage from Cree's blurb about their easy white xm-l2. By default, the easy whites have a tighter binning out of the production line.

Similar to the zebralight "industry smallest tint variation". Whether it goes through some test by them, who knows but the easy white xm-l2 kind of guarantees that.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

For the size of an HDS light, you can get much higher output and runtimes using an 18650 in a Zebralight as well. A light that's 4 inches and uses only one CR123 is a little perplexing. The form factor and UI of the HDS lights are cool and all, but for a light around that size, they should be providing their customers with 18650s IMO.

Yeah, I've never understood why HDS sticks with CR123, given that 18650 would make much more sense for run-time, and AA would make more sense from cost. Though, given what HDS charges for their lights, I doubt many buyers are worried about the cost of disposable CR123's. Still, IIRC, one of the sales-blurbs from HDS talked about the low-cost of operation due to efficiency. Perhaps they no longer use that, since everybody uses efficient LEDs now.

I'm sure that HDS are excellent quality. Just, IMO, the high-cost doesn't make for good value. For the same price that HDS charges just for shipping to Canada, I can get a Zebralight for the same price, shipping included! When the ZL EasyWhite premium tint versions come out, it will be very tempting not to try them, though I find the tint on my current SC5w is great anyway (finally, a Cree with absolutely no green!).

That is a passage from Cree's blurb about their easy white xm-l2. By default, the easy whites have a tighter binning out of the production line.

Similar to the zebralight "industry smallest tint variation". Whether it goes through some test by them, who knows but the easy white xm-l2 kind of guarantees that.

Yeah, I suspect that Zebralight won't do too much hand-selection of LEDs, if at all. Better that it's done by binning, where Cree has more tools to do it properly.

 

[pjandyho]

I'll post my opinions about tint and value how I choose, thank you.

Zebralight is introducing premium tint selection on their SC5 line-up, using the EasyWhite LEDs. While it may not be quite as selective as what HDS does, they're doing it for about one-fifth the price!

Sure, some people will value spending 5x as much, and that's their right. But some of us would rather have 5x the lights.

It doesnt seem as if he was bashing it but merely stating that the HDS costs about 5x more for similar performance. It's a valid comparison since the HDS is picky about the tint and now Zebralight is as well with some of their new products. From an output standpoint the Zebralights are very similar for a much cheaper price. Sure the HDS are more of a custom light with different switch and great build quality but not everyone wants to spend that much money when you can get a light for much cheaper that offers the same type of performance and is built very well. Keep in mind the Zebralights are also potted like the HDS lights are as well. Main differences are going to be the UI, type of LED used and price. Just my two cents on the issue, they're both great lights and Walkintothelight did make a logical and valid point with his statement.

Just in case you guys are unaware, the OP is asking about having manufacturers pre-select tints for the lights prior to manufacture. Nowhere was he talking about price. I highlighted a manufacturer and it is up to the OP to decide if he wants to spend on one. There is no need to barge in and mention about whether I myself or anyone else am willing to pay the 5x more for one, because in this case it really is redundant to the original post, sounds rude, and tantamount to running off topic.

 

[monanza]

It's good to see Zebralight doing this. Not sure what level of sampling goes into binning emitters at CREE and others but as soon as I saw the post, I decided to try the Zebralight floodies. Two of the reasons I buy HDS are their LED selectivity and output calibration. For a while, I lost interest in Surefire because of the lousy LED emitter tints (my opinion). They are back on my list now. The LED landscape will change as it always does. Light makers will need to adapt. I'll still buy more lights than I need just because.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Just in case you guys are unaware, the OP is asking about having manufacturers pre-select tints for the lights prior to manufacture. Nowhere was he talking about price. I highlighted a manufacturer and it is up to the OP to decide if he wants to spend on one. There is no need to barge in and mention about whether I myself or anyone else am willing to pay the 5x more for one, because in this case it really is redundant to the original post, sounds rude, and tantamount to running off topic.

A little touchy, aren't you? You're the one that brought up HDS. I just pointed out you can get similar tint customization for a fraction of the price from Zebralight, which is exactly what revived this topic yesterday.

Hey, I get that HDS owners are rabid fans. That's fine. But don't try to shut-down any slight hint of possible criticism about the price. HDS are not made by God. They have their flaws. Poor efficiency on moonlight is one, and yes, high price. Tint is not one of their flaws, and hopefully the new Zebralight offerings will offer similar tint at a fraction of the price.

That's GOOD news for everyone. You still have your HDS at a very high price. And others will have Zebralight's EasyWhite offerings at a more moderate price.

Getting back to topic... I hope they do extend this to their 18650 lights. Because the EasyWhite is a 6 volt LED, which means less of a boost circuit will be needed on lithium-ion voltages.

 

[pjandyho]

A little touchy, aren't you? You're the one that brought up HDS. I just pointed out you can get similar tint customization for a fraction of the price from Zebralight, which is exactly what revived this topic yesterday.

Hey, I get that HDS owners are rabid fans. That's fine. But don't try to shut-down any slight hint of possible criticism about the price. HDS are not made by God. They have their flaws. Poor efficiency on moonlight is one, and yes, high price. Tint is not one of their flaws, and hopefully the new Zebralight offerings will offer similar tint at a fraction of the price.

That's GOOD news for everyone. You still have your HDS at a very high price. And others will have Zebralight's EasyWhite offerings at a more moderate price.

Getting back to topic... I hope they do extend this to their 18650 lights. Because the EasyWhite is a 6 volt LED, which means less of a boost circuit will be needed on lithium-ion voltages.

Oh so this topic has become a HDS versus Zebralight prices discussion? Because that is where you are bringing this conversation into in case you don't realize? Mentioning HDS being a manufacturer who takes the effort into selecting their LED tints is very much in line with the discussion started by the OP. Comparing prices is not. There is nothing about being touchy here. You can say anything you want about HDS in a separate thread and I won't bat an eyelid. I don't like the price hike by HDS anymore than any other people and I have no qualms about bringing this up. I have had my fair share of complains about HDS and many have read it in the HDS thread, in fact much more complains than many others. Whether you think I am a rabid fan boy or not doesn't bother me one bit, although I don't think I deserved to be labelled as being rabid.

The fact still remains, you barged into a post I posted, fired a one liner and went underground. It is not the content of your post but rather the way you presented it that seems rude. There is a reason you are not allowed to barge into a sales thread to slam the seller for being too expensive, and it is almost the same here with what you did, except that this is not a sales thread and neither is anyone selling anything. And to make things worst it is off topic in relation to what the OP has started.

I have nothing against you. I have always enjoyed reading your posts and your insights, but I have something against the way you presented that one liner. Maybe you can say I am being touchy here, but the way you presented it sounds more like sarcasm rather than trying to state the facts.

I apologize for derailing this thread and I will refrain from posting anymore here.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

The SC5Fc and SC5Fd are frosted lens units - that's pretty much required because of the multi-segment EasyWhite LEDs they are using - but it does mean they are pure flood with no throw whatsoever.

Yeah, that's the only downside I see from this news. Great tint selection is nice, but pure flood is really only good indoors. Hopefully, they'll work out a way to use the EasyWhite LED without a frosted lens.

 

[snowlover91]

I think price is a relevant factor in the discussion of manufacturing flashlights. It gives the customer a choice to see what is the best fit for their budget and their needs. Zebralight is taking a step towards what the OP mentioned by using these LED's that will significantly help with tint variations for an excellent price. Before this if you wanted a very specific tint the only options would be custom mods from people like Vinh or to purchase a light like HDS. Now customers can buy a lower price light that doesn't need to be modified and is far more affordable while giving the advantage of having great tint. I wonder what the 4k version will look like, if it will be too warm or what? Anyone preorder any of these new Zebralights?

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

I wonder what the 4k version will look like, if it will be too warm or what?

If it's as white as they claim it will be, it should be great. I have a couple of 4000K lights, which I like, but a lot of people prefer something cooler. I suspect their "d" (5000K) will outsell their "c" (4000K). Then again, if you believe companies like 4sevens, nobody wants anything but regular cool-white. :shrug:

(That is, their regular cool white version probably outsells all the others. Sad, but likely true.)

 

[insanefred]

If it's as white as they claim it will be, it should be great. I have a couple of 4000K lights, which I like, but a lot of people prefer something cooler. I suspect their "d" (5000K) will outsell their "c" (4000K). Then again, if you believe companies like 4sevens, nobody wants anything but regular cool-white. :shrug:

(That is, their regular cool white version probably outsells all the others. Sad, but likely true.)

But wasn't that something to do with the warmer/ higher CRI not being as bright as the cool white variant? I am also guessing average tactical joe associated cooler blue LED with new, fancy and tactical. Thus why they're so many "tactical" lights out. :shakehead