In need of a new 2XAA Light for Work...???

[more_vampires]

I second the 47s Quark Click QK2A or QK2A-X. Get a spare 1AA tube for those times you'd like a smaller light, and have it custom programmed for the modes and sequence you want. It's a bit more expensive, but you getting a true US warranty and customer service.

+3

 

[reppans]

Reppans has reported a problem with his Archer 2A but the Selfbuilt review seems very good.... I need to read about the 4sevens and the eagtac. I like the 4sevens ui but they have never tried for outstanding output. Best customer service short of surefire though...

Must have mistaken my post, I don't own an Archer. I just commented to the other poster (who does have a problem his Archer, and Baton) that all my flashlight "issues" happen to be with my electronic clicky lights.

Agree 47s tends to under drive it's lights though - IDK, but I suspect that's similar to some of the quality US manufacturers. If they have to stand behind their products with long warranties/good CS, then perhaps it makes sense to under stress them and make sure as few as possible come back?

 

[more_vampires]

Agree 47s tends to under drive it's lights though - IDK, but I suspect that's similar to some of the quality US manufacturers. If they have to stand behind their products with long warranties/good CS, then perhaps it makes sense to under stress them and make sure as few as possible come back?

That's like an old computer reliability trick, "underclocking." The CPU manufacturers literally do this when they test and "bin" processor speeds. It's all made on one line.

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Agree 47s tends to under drive it's lights though - IDK, but I suspect that's similar to some of the quality US manufacturers. If they have to stand behind their products with long warranties/good CS, then perhaps it makes sense to under stress them and make sure as few as possible come back?

I've heard that argument before, but I'm not sure I believe it. They already have a step-down in their lights (as do most manufacturers), so I don't see any reason why not to set the maximum as high as others. I think a higher max output likely requires more expensive drivers, which is why they don't do it. Or perhaps it requires better heat-sinking or more thermal mass, or something that would add cost.

For what it's worth, my 4sevens 2xAA Quark XPG2 runs way hotter than my Armytek 2xAA Prime. The Quark is only half as bright. However, they both consume the same power from the batteries, so the Quark is clearly generating more heat from all that power.

To be fair, the Quark is an XPG2, and the Armytek is an XML2, so that likely has something to do with it. However, my 2xAA Quark XML2 light generates about the same heat as the Armytek, even after stepping-down (and again at that point is less than half as bright).

So, I conclude that 4sevens drivers are not very efficient, which is why I think they don't drive their lights as hard.

 

[Tac Gunner]

I haven't found a better 2xAA light than the Eagletac D25A2. I haven't found any faults with it and the runtimes/output are pretty close to manufacturer's specs.

 

[recDNA]

I haven't found a better 2xAA light than the Eagletac D25A2. I haven't found any faults with it and the runtimes/output are pretty close to manufacturer's specs.

How does output compare to Archer 2A?

 

[Tac Gunner]

It's about 100 lumens less than the archer but the UI is my favorite. I'm not a fan of side switches and love the simple tail cap UI. Also the ability to turn o and off the mode memory as well as change the outputs of the lower modes is nice. I leave the memory turned off and the firefly mode group selected so that it always starts in firefly. I don't have to worry about being blinded when I turn the light on and it's just a simple tap of the tail cap to step up to medium which is plenty for 90% of my tasks.

 

[reppans]

I've heard that argument before, but I'm not sure I believe it. They already have a step-down in their lights (as do most manufacturers), so I don't see any reason why not to set the maximum as high as others. I think a higher max output likely requires more expensive drivers, which is why they don't do it. Or perhaps it requires better heat-sinking or more thermal mass, or something that would add cost.

For what it's worth, my 4sevens 2xAA Quark XPG2 runs way hotter than my Armytek 2xAA Prime. The Quark is only half as bright. However, they both consume the same power from the batteries, so the Quark is clearly generating more heat from all that power.

To be fair, the Quark is an XPG2, and the Armytek is an XML2, so that likely has something to do with it. However, my 2xAA Quark XML2 light generates about the same heat as the Armytek, even after stepping-down (and again at that point is less than half as bright).

So, I conclude that 4sevens drivers are not very efficient, which is why I think they don't drive their lights as hard.

Well, we've had some of this discussion before, but I run my AT Prime Pro A1 and Quark XMLs on 1x Eneloop or 14500, and at max, my Prime is brighter on both cells, but actually less "efficient" on lumens/amp basis, but this is primarily due to the fact that lights will tend to follow an efficiency bell curve, peaking somewhere in the middle of their output ranges, and losing efficiency in the tails of sub-lumen, and harder driven max, outputs.

As far as 47s under-driving their lights due to heat vs thermal mass, that certainly makes some sense - my Prime Pro is literally 50% larger (by volume) and 50% heavier than my Quark on the same battery, it makes sense the AT can heat sink better. If the OP burns sustained max output runs (not that Alks can keep up with that output, btw) then perhaps the additional AT bulk makes better sense.

As to the additional longevity gained by under-driving? My Malkoff MDC AA and HDS 325 both have equivalent thermal mass as my Prime Pro A1 yet they only peak at 115 and 325 lumens, respectively. Wonder what they're thinking, knowing that lumens sell?

 

[wytstang]

I use (because my company paid for it) a streamlight pro tac 2aa and it works fine for me. I also work in Industrial maintenance so looking inside electrical boxes or squeezing into small(ish) metal cabinets is routine. This light has worked well in these situations but it also gets pretty warm when left on high. Having said that when I came in on a weekend to work on machinery while no one else was working I used my personal headlamp (Thrunite) to do some PM's and it was great having the light exactly were I was looking and not having to have my mentor (I'm currently training in this field) hold the light creating shadows making it harder to see what I am doing. Keeping that in mind the Archer has it's belt clip in a position were you can clip it on there bill of a hat making it a headlamp when needed. A feature the other lights your are looking into may or may not be able to do so keep a eye on the body design to see if you can clip them to a hat and turn them into a headlamp assuming you wear hats that is.

 

[bykfixer]

Coast HP1.

$10, solid construction, on/off with momentary, don't mind brief swims, don't mind being dropped, lights a room in spot mode, throws a soccer field on spot, has a sturdy pocket clip or fits in those carpenter pants pocket with your pocket knife, coins etc and run time is pretty good.

If you have flash back issues with the 220 output, you slide the head back some to spread the beam out.
See something in the ceiling you'd like to focus on, you slide to spot and focus to that with plenty of spill to keep from leaning onto or tripping over something harmful.

I've used the same alkaline battery since late August this year to tail stand 15-20 minutes at a time numerous times, shined it into engine bays in daylight, lit countless shadows and just changed battery this week.
It was noticably flickering. But the beam gradually became warmer prior to that, yet still had enough output to be useful for lighting close up shadows in daylight.

And since you have a seemingly unlimited supply of aa batterys...

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

As to the additional longevity gained by under-driving? My Malkoff MDC AA and HDS 325 both have equivalent thermal mass as my Prime Pro A1 yet they only peak at 115 and 325 lumens, respectively. Wonder what they're thinking, knowing that lumens sell?

I never did understand HDS's excessive price, considering it's very conservative with its output. Maybe it has something to do with the fact it runs on CR123, and so can't drive as much current as if it was running on 2xAA Eneloops? I think CR123 specs at something like 1.5 amps max? Whereas Eneloops can go at 5 or 6 amps. Albeit 2xAA has slightly less voltage than 1xCR123, but more than makes up for it from current.

For an example from Zebralight, the SC32 has a lower max output than the SC5, because the SC32 can't drive its CR123 as hard as the SC5 can drive an Eneloop.

I don't think under-driving lights has much to do with protecting the LED. LEDs can handle quite high temperatures, and step-down or PID can deal with excessive temps. It might have something to do with protecting the driver electronics, but I'm skeptical.

 

[reppans]

I never did understand HDS's excessive price, considering it's very conservative with its output. Maybe it has something to do with the fact it runs on CR123, and so can't drive as much current as if it was running on 2xAA Eneloops? I think CR123 specs at something like 1.5 amps max? Whereas Eneloops can go at 5 or 6 amps. Albeit 2xAA has slightly less voltage than 1xCR123, but more than makes up for it from current.

For an example from Zebralight, the SC32 has a lower max output than the SC5, because the SC32 can't drive its CR123 as hard as the SC5 can drive an Eneloop.

I don't think under-driving lights has much to do with protecting the LED. LEDs can handle quite high temperatures, and step-down or PID can deal with excessive temps. It might have something to do with protecting the driver electronics, but I'm skeptical.

Perhaps the SC32 is capped for heat as well (less thermal mass than the 5?), no reason it couldn't shoot for the moon with an IMR 16340, it's designed for them. HDS is also designed for Li-ions, and is modular (2xNiMh and a 18650 tubes), so it could certainly do what so many lights already do - offer different max outputs depending upon cell chem/config... but Henry doesn't.

Malkoff, McGizmo, Surefire, Elzetta, etc. also under drive their lights relative to the Chinese manufacturers.... why? ZL produces the brightest lights for a given size and battery chemistry, yet has the shortest warranty in the industry... any correlation? IDK... just connecting the dots.

I really don't think there's rocket science behind extracting every last ma of current out of a particular battery chemistry to produce every last lumen from a CREE product - it's a business decision. Aside from the reliability/durability/CS reason we've been discussing, I think there are other important reasons behind it:

- By my light box, 325 lumens from a quality American Co is ~425+ ZL, AT, TN lms.
- Some don't believe in step-downs
- Some believe in an hour at max
- Some cater to non-flashaholic markets and know their customers are only going to use primaries, incl Alks (like the OP btw), and don't want them to get pissed when their light fails to achieve full output, and/or fresh cells die in minutes.
- Some find chasing the "brightest output" game futile and subject to the laws of dismissing returns - ie, due to the logarithmic light perception thing, you'll need 4x the power (or get 1/4 the runtime) to appear twice as bright.

IMHO, YMMV and all...

 

[WalkIntoTheLight]

Malkoff, McGizmo, Surefire, Elzetta, etc. also under drive their lights relative to the Chinese manufacturers.... why? ZL produces the brightest lights for a given size and battery chemistry, yet has the shortest warranty in the industry... any correlation? IDK... just connecting the dots.

I think for the price that those companies charge (including HDS), making a bright light as well as providing a long warranty, shouldn't be an issue. I'm not convinced it's because driving an XML2 at 500 lumens automatically makes for an unreliable light. 18650 lights often drive an XML2 close to 1000 lumens, so 500 lumens (an Armytek Prime or Zebralight SC5) isn't "over driving" it, IMO.

But, I'm not sure why they don't try to keep up with the lumens game. Perhaps they're just behind the latest tech, because they concentrate more on other things. Or maybe they feel they can go longer between development cycles if they don't try to keep up with the latest. Or, perhaps they're worried about dummy users, that will keep resetting the light to max after a step-down. (But in that case, they could always use some form of PID to control output.)

 

[KeepingItLight]

- Some cater to non-flashaholic markets and know their customers are only going to use primaries, incl Alks (like the OP btw), and don't want them to get pissed when their light fails to achieve full output, and/or fresh cells die in minutes.

You gotta love somebody who spends $250 for a flashlight and then puts the cheapest batteries available inside it. That's part of the fun of being rich. You get to do whatever you like!

 

[leon2245]

Re: In need of a new 2XAA Light for Work...???

​

Edit


J/k what are you using now again?

 

[LetThereBeLight!]

Don't forget about the Eagletac D25A2, it's another great light to consider and better yet it's available with a neutral tint LED with a choice of a Nichia 219B or Cree XM-L2 T6.

+1

 

[recDNA]

Malkoff has a new AA MDC now. Simple, bombproof, a lot cheaper than HDS but not near $50 either.

 

[WERNER1]

So after pondering on this over the weekend I've narrowed it down to the Archer, EagleTac, and Fenix ... I'm leaning towards the Archer,.. there's a BIN auction on eBay for one w/CW for $36.99 w/Free Shipping,... I think the Cost/value/performance of this one puts it above the others at this point (???) ...

I really appreciate all of the info and input you guys gave me on this!!!

PS - I'm currently using the TerraLUX LightStar 220..

Thanks again!
Rick

 

[uofaengr]

Wow took a peek at Amazon and the NW version of the Archer 2A V2 is now $46?? Glad I got mine when I did else I wouldn't have bought it for that price.

 

[recDNA]

Wow took a peek at Amazon and the NW version of the Archer 2A V2 is now $46?? Glad I got mine when I did else I wouldn't have bought it for that price.

Maybe because Thrunite is not currently building them any more.