BuddTX
Flashlight Enthusiast
In another thread, dat2zip (Wayne) said this:
[ QUOTE ]
dat2zip said:
I think the general populous here has lost sight on a great combination.
I see new posts asking what is the brightest... Well, sure the brightess may be the MM+, but it comes at a great expense. I think CPF has the ownership to inform others of the tradeoffs of the cutting edge and to offer a diverse set of alternatives as well as what is the cutting edge.
I think the MM is a bargin.
Fact: MM is 80% as bright as a MM+.
(MM+ is only 20% brighter)
Fact: MM runtime on 2AA is 2-3 hours of almost flat constant output.
(MM+ is lucky to get you 1 hour)
Fact: MM is overdriving the 1W Luxeon by more than 2X the rated current. This puts the MM above almost any commercial flashlight using the same 1W Luxeon. In general, this includes the KL1 and all the ARC LSLs and LSHs.
I believe in maximizing usefullness. Thus, I have invested heavily in the MM series. As long as the few extremist dominate CPF demanding the bleeding edge, the average user will never see the practical side that most 1W Luxeons of almost any bin is still technology better off than any generic incandescent lamp.
I am putting this here to stop the bleeding and the some of the lunacy I now see happening in the Firefly thread.
. . . .
I'll explain why I would do this:
1) The MM would be nice and bright. Most 1W of any bin is plenty bright for a keychain light. In fact a MM is probably an overkill.
2) The MM would give me several useful hours of runtime. I know I could count on this as a emergency light to walk down the highway for an hour and not worry about it dying on me. I need 1+ hours for an emergency flashlight.
3) The Low dome (Batwing) configuration is actually not as focused beam as the High dome (Lambertian). In fact this is a plus, since I prefer a wider beam to see a bigger area in front me. If I'm walking I want to see the rock before I trip over it. Going to the High dome and NX05 generates a tight beam. Using the Fraen LP in place of the NX05 would collect even more photons and direct it to the center beam.
THE ONLY WAY TO SEE TINT AND COLOR IS TO SHINE IT ON A WHITE WALL. IS THIS HOW WE ALL USE OUR FLASHLIGHTS?
I thought we bought flashlights to light our way through the dark. I must be missing something here.
To be honest here a single 5mm light IMHO is still awesome technology. Let's not lose site of reality. The Opalec Newbeam is a great light and it only has 3 5mm LEDs in it.
Wayne
[/ QUOTE ]
This post is NOT just about Wayne's sandwich modules, or what should go into a firefly, but about the brightness/runtime and Color of LED debate in general, and a trap that we should avoid falling into.
Issue 1- BRIGHTEST
I have to say that I did fall into this trap of always wanting the brightest. Who wouldn't, here on CPF. We are all "extremists" when it comes to flashlights.
After all, to my friends, neighbors, and family, I am known as the flashlight guy. I always have a flashlight on me, and when I KNOW I am going to need a flashlight, look out, I bring an arsonal. AND, when it happens, by chance, that SOMEONE ELSE in the group happens to have a brighter flashlight, that PISSES ME OFF! I go into a spending frenzey! HOW DARE someone have a brighter light than me!
Now intelectually, I know that, for an EDC light, there should be a good balance inbetween runtime and brightness, but emotionally, let's face it, it is HARD to impress your friends, neighbors, and family with long run time! We want the SHOCK and AWE of extreme brightness.
Well, something recently happened to me, that EMOTIONALLY changed my opinion of the brightness/runtime debate.
One of my favorite lights, is my Turnkey McLux. I almost always have that on me. Now I was secretly just a tad disappointed that the Turnkey McLux came with one of Wayne's BadBoy 400 modules. Heck, I thought to my self, why not use the BB500, or make a special 650 or 800 BB! That will really knock my socks off. If I buy a 3 gig PC, I am going to be thinking, "should I have purchased a 3.2 Gig? Think "TIM ALLEN" MORE POWER! Whatever rating it is, figure out a way to make it go up one more rating! Overclock it! OverDrive it, Arruuggghh Arrruugggghhhh!
Well, in the last week or two, I had to use my McLux, steady, for at least a half hour, or so, at least 3 times. The third time I used it, I was expcting it to die any moment, but it did not. I did not change the batteries, as I wanted to see how much longer it would run. ( Roy's McLux Runtime graph shows 2 hours!) but I did not know this, I thought it was only an hour.
A few days later, I was presented a situation where I needed to use my McLux again, for an extended time, (at least 45 minutes) and I remember thinking, "oh great, the battery will die any moment, and I will loose my status a supreme flashoholic!" Now, whatever it was, it was a serious situation, not something that one would laugh if the battery went dead. Well, it turned out that the light did not die, and I came off, still holding my flashoholic reputation!
Well, this taught me, via experience, that runtime is important too!
I have never been "dissatisfied" with the brightness of the McLux, actually, quite the contrary, it has always been bright enought for all the tasks that I needed it to do. But, I was NOW GLAD that the McLux had a 2 hour runtime, and was using the BB400, instead of the BB500!
Yes, I have known for years, that for EDC, a good balance of brightness/runtime should be achieved, but emotionally, I wanted the show off brighest light. NOW, after experiencing my McLux situation, I have to say, that EMOTIONALLY I want a good runtime on my EDC light. Just to clarify, if you have NOT seen the output of the McLux, it is just wonderful, and probably brighter than most, if not all, 1 watt Luxeon Star Low Dome lights available. {EDIT} I MEANT TO SAY ONE OF THE BRIGHTEST <font color="red"> COMMERCIALLY AVAILABLE </font> lights!
ISSUE 2-COLOR of the LED
Most of the LED's that I have, both Nichia 5MM and the Luxeon Star have a slightly to (in some cases) extremely blue tint to them. And for most of us, either that color was more pleasing to us than an incandecent, or we accepted that color.
A little background.
My Dad worked for GE for most of his life, and I remember getting into a discussion about "WHITE REFERIGERATORS". Years ago, GE made pure white appliance, and they got complaints that the color seemed to look yellow. Well, they made them as white as they could be, but people were still complaining, so they added a little BLUE to their white paint, and they made a "whiter white" so to speak.
Now, again, my McLux is one of these lights that puts out a slight blue tint. I have never had a problem, or complaint in actually using the light.
Recently, I was lucky enough to have Wayne hand make me, as well as a few other people here on CPF (thanks Wayne) a R2 LED.
So, I popped that baby into a Brinkmann 2AA light, and put two fresh batteries into it, and WOW, was I impressed.
Very very nice, thanks Wayne.
So now, I start to compare it to my McLux, and an interesting thing happened.
First of all, let me state again, that I am VERY VERY happy with my McLux, and the MM+ R2 sandwich also impressed me a LOT.
BUT, when I started comparing the two, side by side, something interesting happened-I started liking one more, and one less, but they alternated inbetween the two!
WHAT?
First, my McLux was TOO BLUE! Wahhhhhaa? I never noticed that before, it always seemed just fine to me, but NO, it was TOO BLUE!
I continued to do comparisons, and then, all of a sudden my opinion changed. "The McLux is just fine!" the R2 Sandwich is too white, almost a tinge of yellow." (I swear, I was not drinking, OK, maybe just a little).
I put one down, and used ONLY ONE, and all my problems went away. BOTH OF THEM WERE JUST WONDERFUL!
It reminded me of shopping for stereo speakers, and having the choices narrowed down to two or three choices, all from premium, well respected speaker companies. I came to the conclusion that they ALL were good speakers, and I would be very happy with any of those three selections. And, I was comparing then against each other, not against the original source.
I am at work, so I need to finish this, but I hope this starts some useful discussion.
One of the original "dim/long run time lights, was the CMG Infinity. a single 5mm light is pretty dim, making it dimmer on purpose did not seem to make sense to me, but when dealing with a luxeon star or equivalent, you are already dealing with a much brighter source, so "dim" is a relative term.
[ QUOTE ]
dat2zip said:
I think the general populous here has lost sight on a great combination.
I see new posts asking what is the brightest... Well, sure the brightess may be the MM+, but it comes at a great expense. I think CPF has the ownership to inform others of the tradeoffs of the cutting edge and to offer a diverse set of alternatives as well as what is the cutting edge.
I think the MM is a bargin.
Fact: MM is 80% as bright as a MM+.
(MM+ is only 20% brighter)
Fact: MM runtime on 2AA is 2-3 hours of almost flat constant output.
(MM+ is lucky to get you 1 hour)
Fact: MM is overdriving the 1W Luxeon by more than 2X the rated current. This puts the MM above almost any commercial flashlight using the same 1W Luxeon. In general, this includes the KL1 and all the ARC LSLs and LSHs.
I believe in maximizing usefullness. Thus, I have invested heavily in the MM series. As long as the few extremist dominate CPF demanding the bleeding edge, the average user will never see the practical side that most 1W Luxeons of almost any bin is still technology better off than any generic incandescent lamp.
I am putting this here to stop the bleeding and the some of the lunacy I now see happening in the Firefly thread.
. . . .
I'll explain why I would do this:
1) The MM would be nice and bright. Most 1W of any bin is plenty bright for a keychain light. In fact a MM is probably an overkill.
2) The MM would give me several useful hours of runtime. I know I could count on this as a emergency light to walk down the highway for an hour and not worry about it dying on me. I need 1+ hours for an emergency flashlight.
3) The Low dome (Batwing) configuration is actually not as focused beam as the High dome (Lambertian). In fact this is a plus, since I prefer a wider beam to see a bigger area in front me. If I'm walking I want to see the rock before I trip over it. Going to the High dome and NX05 generates a tight beam. Using the Fraen LP in place of the NX05 would collect even more photons and direct it to the center beam.
THE ONLY WAY TO SEE TINT AND COLOR IS TO SHINE IT ON A WHITE WALL. IS THIS HOW WE ALL USE OUR FLASHLIGHTS?
I thought we bought flashlights to light our way through the dark. I must be missing something here.
To be honest here a single 5mm light IMHO is still awesome technology. Let's not lose site of reality. The Opalec Newbeam is a great light and it only has 3 5mm LEDs in it.
Wayne
[/ QUOTE ]
This post is NOT just about Wayne's sandwich modules, or what should go into a firefly, but about the brightness/runtime and Color of LED debate in general, and a trap that we should avoid falling into.
Issue 1- BRIGHTEST
I have to say that I did fall into this trap of always wanting the brightest. Who wouldn't, here on CPF. We are all "extremists" when it comes to flashlights.
After all, to my friends, neighbors, and family, I am known as the flashlight guy. I always have a flashlight on me, and when I KNOW I am going to need a flashlight, look out, I bring an arsonal. AND, when it happens, by chance, that SOMEONE ELSE in the group happens to have a brighter flashlight, that PISSES ME OFF! I go into a spending frenzey! HOW DARE someone have a brighter light than me!
Now intelectually, I know that, for an EDC light, there should be a good balance inbetween runtime and brightness, but emotionally, let's face it, it is HARD to impress your friends, neighbors, and family with long run time! We want the SHOCK and AWE of extreme brightness.
Well, something recently happened to me, that EMOTIONALLY changed my opinion of the brightness/runtime debate.
One of my favorite lights, is my Turnkey McLux. I almost always have that on me. Now I was secretly just a tad disappointed that the Turnkey McLux came with one of Wayne's BadBoy 400 modules. Heck, I thought to my self, why not use the BB500, or make a special 650 or 800 BB! That will really knock my socks off. If I buy a 3 gig PC, I am going to be thinking, "should I have purchased a 3.2 Gig? Think "TIM ALLEN" MORE POWER! Whatever rating it is, figure out a way to make it go up one more rating! Overclock it! OverDrive it, Arruuggghh Arrruugggghhhh!
Well, in the last week or two, I had to use my McLux, steady, for at least a half hour, or so, at least 3 times. The third time I used it, I was expcting it to die any moment, but it did not. I did not change the batteries, as I wanted to see how much longer it would run. ( Roy's McLux Runtime graph shows 2 hours!) but I did not know this, I thought it was only an hour.
A few days later, I was presented a situation where I needed to use my McLux again, for an extended time, (at least 45 minutes) and I remember thinking, "oh great, the battery will die any moment, and I will loose my status a supreme flashoholic!" Now, whatever it was, it was a serious situation, not something that one would laugh if the battery went dead. Well, it turned out that the light did not die, and I came off, still holding my flashoholic reputation!
Well, this taught me, via experience, that runtime is important too!
I have never been "dissatisfied" with the brightness of the McLux, actually, quite the contrary, it has always been bright enought for all the tasks that I needed it to do. But, I was NOW GLAD that the McLux had a 2 hour runtime, and was using the BB400, instead of the BB500!
Yes, I have known for years, that for EDC, a good balance of brightness/runtime should be achieved, but emotionally, I wanted the show off brighest light. NOW, after experiencing my McLux situation, I have to say, that EMOTIONALLY I want a good runtime on my EDC light. Just to clarify, if you have NOT seen the output of the McLux, it is just wonderful, and probably brighter than most, if not all, 1 watt Luxeon Star Low Dome lights available. {EDIT} I MEANT TO SAY ONE OF THE BRIGHTEST <font color="red"> COMMERCIALLY AVAILABLE </font> lights!
ISSUE 2-COLOR of the LED
Most of the LED's that I have, both Nichia 5MM and the Luxeon Star have a slightly to (in some cases) extremely blue tint to them. And for most of us, either that color was more pleasing to us than an incandecent, or we accepted that color.
A little background.
My Dad worked for GE for most of his life, and I remember getting into a discussion about "WHITE REFERIGERATORS". Years ago, GE made pure white appliance, and they got complaints that the color seemed to look yellow. Well, they made them as white as they could be, but people were still complaining, so they added a little BLUE to their white paint, and they made a "whiter white" so to speak.
Now, again, my McLux is one of these lights that puts out a slight blue tint. I have never had a problem, or complaint in actually using the light.
Recently, I was lucky enough to have Wayne hand make me, as well as a few other people here on CPF (thanks Wayne) a R2 LED.
So, I popped that baby into a Brinkmann 2AA light, and put two fresh batteries into it, and WOW, was I impressed.
Very very nice, thanks Wayne.
So now, I start to compare it to my McLux, and an interesting thing happened.
First of all, let me state again, that I am VERY VERY happy with my McLux, and the MM+ R2 sandwich also impressed me a LOT.
BUT, when I started comparing the two, side by side, something interesting happened-I started liking one more, and one less, but they alternated inbetween the two!
WHAT?
First, my McLux was TOO BLUE! Wahhhhhaa? I never noticed that before, it always seemed just fine to me, but NO, it was TOO BLUE!
I continued to do comparisons, and then, all of a sudden my opinion changed. "The McLux is just fine!" the R2 Sandwich is too white, almost a tinge of yellow." (I swear, I was not drinking, OK, maybe just a little).
I put one down, and used ONLY ONE, and all my problems went away. BOTH OF THEM WERE JUST WONDERFUL!
It reminded me of shopping for stereo speakers, and having the choices narrowed down to two or three choices, all from premium, well respected speaker companies. I came to the conclusion that they ALL were good speakers, and I would be very happy with any of those three selections. And, I was comparing then against each other, not against the original source.
I am at work, so I need to finish this, but I hope this starts some useful discussion.
One of the original "dim/long run time lights, was the CMG Infinity. a single 5mm light is pretty dim, making it dimmer on purpose did not seem to make sense to me, but when dealing with a luxeon star or equivalent, you are already dealing with a much brighter source, so "dim" is a relative term.
