Groundhog66
Banned
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
You better not leave there empty handed.....
You better not leave there empty handed.....
My Computer Died.... UPDATE: I bought a Mac!!
- Thread starter MSaxatilus
- Start date
Help Support Candle Power Flashlight Forum
binky
Flashlight Enthusiast
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
Wait! If you're that far along then please at least know to get the lowest amount of RAM from Apple that's possible. Then buy the RAM from an online place like Kingston, Crucial, nearly anywhere else with reputable, top quality RAM. Apple's prices are not just double they're more like 8 times the going rate for RAM.
Much more I could say but I want to post this asap.
Wait! If you're that far along then please at least know to get the lowest amount of RAM from Apple that's possible. Then buy the RAM from an online place like Kingston, Crucial, nearly anywhere else with reputable, top quality RAM. Apple's prices are not just double they're more like 8 times the going rate for RAM.
Much more I could say but I want to post this asap.
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Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
I think you may be just unlucky. I use PC's running XP Pro and have had zero problems. I do the occasional spyware and virus check but I also use a firewall and make sure I take care of the security issues. I do image backups every few months also but have had to rely on a backup only once in the past 5 years or so. An image backup lets me get back to business very quickly (within a half hour) unless the hardware goes T.U.
I have three Dells at home (two laptops, one desktop), a Dell laptop at work, and they're all trouble-free. I hear Macs are not immune to crashes so going to a Mac is not necessarily a panacea. On the other hand, vast majority of people I know that own Macs swear by them so that's something to be considered also. But I'm sticking to PC's since I have no reason to switch otherwise. They're cheap and compatible with what we use at work. Good luck with your choice!
MechBgon,
That's part of the problem. I don't know what the problem is? The more I use the thing the more time I spend maintaining it that actually using it. Between Defrag, Ad-Aware, Norton Antivirus, Reg fixes, dead links, countless error codes, you remove a program, but it doesn't completely remove it from the system, crosslinks..... it goes on and on. I know a bit about computers, but I'm definitely not an expert. But every couple of weeks its starts bogging down or another issue pops up. I just want to go on line and look at flashlights, pay my bills and play a few games. Why do I constantly have to clean my system of spyware, ads, make sure my virus protection is up to date and scanning.... blah blah blah blah blah!!
<Rant off>
Sorry, I'm a bit sensitive at this time.
Symptoms: It was running fine. Actually it was running very good, fast even. Then last night my wife left a web browser open for about 3 hours to show me an article about the Devil Ray's new Stadium in Florida. After looking at the article, I attempted to close the browser. The system hung up and would not close. I waited a few minutes, tried to break it with a ctrl-alt-del. But the system was still hung up. I hit the reset button and on startup, I get a disk-read-error before Windows starts up. Sounds to me like a HD issue?!? Who the heck knows.
The 180GB Maxtor Master HD is about 6-8 months old. I put it in there last summer.
<RANT ON>
Stupid POS!!!!
<rant off>
MSax
I think you may be just unlucky. I use PC's running XP Pro and have had zero problems. I do the occasional spyware and virus check but I also use a firewall and make sure I take care of the security issues. I do image backups every few months also but have had to rely on a backup only once in the past 5 years or so. An image backup lets me get back to business very quickly (within a half hour) unless the hardware goes T.U.
I have three Dells at home (two laptops, one desktop), a Dell laptop at work, and they're all trouble-free. I hear Macs are not immune to crashes so going to a Mac is not necessarily a panacea. On the other hand, vast majority of people I know that own Macs swear by them so that's something to be considered also. But I'm sticking to PC's since I have no reason to switch otherwise. They're cheap and compatible with what we use at work. Good luck with your choice!
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binky
Flashlight Enthusiast
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
So MSax, I think I read all the posts in the thread and I don't see any mention of what PC you have. I guess your complaint is based more on the software than the hardware, but I'm going to make a comment that's hardware related then segue that to software.
I have a pet peeve that I just have to vent and it's not aimed toward you; It's more toward companies that decide on lowest-price PC's for their employees and this gives PC's a bad rap. I guess I'm posting this in sympathy if you hate your PC. Maybe it was even issued to you by your company and it fits the following typical scenario, I dunno.
Let's use Dell as an example, though all the biggies (Sony, Toshiba, hp, Lenovo/ThinkPad) do basically the same thing. Dell sells 3 lines of laptops, and 3 lines of desktops. They split these up as follows, and they say so on their web pages:
Laptops: Vostro is low-end, Lattitude is some quality and designed for long-term use, and Precision is performance and reliability.
Desktops: Vostro is, well, customizable whaddya-want, Optiplex is some quality and for long-term use, and Precision is performance and reliability.
So given those clearly stated design criteria, what do most companies spring for when choosing PC's for their employees? VOSTRO, which as stated by the manufacturer that quality and reliability are definitely NOT in a priority of the design criteria. Plain as day, NOT quality. They work; They have features. When buying one you can check off that it has this feature & that. Not aimed at quality or expandability or long-term use. Features & "value", that's the deal with Vostro.
Regardless of this, most companies, large & small, issue Vostro.
No wonder so many people hate their PC's! I see gobs of people on forums who hate Dell. Nearly all of them own an Inspiron/Vostro POS that either they bought or their company issued to them. If it didn't have enough power then RAM was added, or a bigger drive added. Well, ya can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear.
I do IT support for small companies. These are places that don't have an IT department. If it's a new client I can't tell you how many times I've gone in and the office is filled with each person using a Vostro-level PC. Not necessarily a Dell brand, maybe an HP or whatever, but something the boss went out and got one day based on lowest price and it was in stock. Maybe they got them all at once from Best Buy or Circuit City. What's on them? Well, here's my segue to software and MechBgon's point exactly.
Just like the hardware, the lower-end PC's come loaded to the hilt with crudware. There are toolbars across the top, zippy things going on at the sides, low end imaging, disk burning, and sound tools that step all over each other, and then there are the malware tools. Loads of them. So many I can't believe the PC even boots. Like Norton 360, some expired one like McAfee not totally uninstalled, adaware, anti-spyware galore, some other freeware antivirus tool, some other popup prevention freeware thingy, and some more junk that they might have heard about from a friend then never used again after loading it but it's running in the background with everything else.
Heavens to mergatroid I just can't believe these manufacturers & vendors think the very people who don't know to uninstall these overburdensome apps are the ones who should be taking home a low-end PC that can barely run 2 of these, much less the 6-8 that are loaded and auto-start during boot. Then as soon as they activate Windows they start loading more crudware that they got packed in the deal at the store.
I'm with MechBgon. He didn't say it outright but I'm sure you guessed his mantra is keep it simple. Have one or 2 better guns instead of a whole arsenal of uzzi's. One AV, maybe one anti-spyware tool if really needed, but the real key is to know how to act and to protect the border. Using best-practices like non-admin user, system updates, use a firewall appliance box, etc.
On the other side of the fence there are Macs. There are some lines with problems. They're not immune. For example, a whole lot of previous-rev iMacs had power supplies die. I had one in a salon at the checkout desk and got a call "the Mac is smoking ... What should I do?" Then 2 months later the other one just shut off and never came back. Straight to the Apple Store it went, for a replacement. In contrast, I have had nearly zero problems with the Pro line of equipment, and exactly zero with the Xserve. Well, one Xserve with problems but that one had clearly been physically abused onsite. The iMacs are about value. The "Pro" line is about speed & quality. Same deal as the PC world, in my opinion, though the i-line isn't as low a price/quality target as Vostro gets.
I don't think the iMac/Non-Pro line is down at the level of Vostro, but they also hit the higher price point than the lowest Vostro and aren't as stripped down. And as for software Apple just doesn't sell the Macs with crudware like a Google Toolbar (yet) and all the other junk to bog it down. Some might argue about some apps being hoggy, like Spotlight (think Google Desktop) is notorious.
I personally like Macs a whole lot better than Windows machines for a lot of reasons, so I'm not trying to change your mind, but I also think Windows PC's get a bad rap that in many cases isn't deserved at all. Kinda like what nerdgineer and others said -- with an IT department to set them up & maintain them, the PC's really are OK.
FWIW.
So MSax, I think I read all the posts in the thread and I don't see any mention of what PC you have. I guess your complaint is based more on the software than the hardware, but I'm going to make a comment that's hardware related then segue that to software.
I have a pet peeve that I just have to vent and it's not aimed toward you; It's more toward companies that decide on lowest-price PC's for their employees and this gives PC's a bad rap. I guess I'm posting this in sympathy if you hate your PC. Maybe it was even issued to you by your company and it fits the following typical scenario, I dunno.
Let's use Dell as an example, though all the biggies (Sony, Toshiba, hp, Lenovo/ThinkPad) do basically the same thing. Dell sells 3 lines of laptops, and 3 lines of desktops. They split these up as follows, and they say so on their web pages:
Laptops: Vostro is low-end, Lattitude is some quality and designed for long-term use, and Precision is performance and reliability.
Desktops: Vostro is, well, customizable whaddya-want, Optiplex is some quality and for long-term use, and Precision is performance and reliability.
So given those clearly stated design criteria, what do most companies spring for when choosing PC's for their employees? VOSTRO, which as stated by the manufacturer that quality and reliability are definitely NOT in a priority of the design criteria. Plain as day, NOT quality. They work; They have features. When buying one you can check off that it has this feature & that. Not aimed at quality or expandability or long-term use. Features & "value", that's the deal with Vostro.
Regardless of this, most companies, large & small, issue Vostro.
No wonder so many people hate their PC's! I see gobs of people on forums who hate Dell. Nearly all of them own an Inspiron/Vostro POS that either they bought or their company issued to them. If it didn't have enough power then RAM was added, or a bigger drive added. Well, ya can't make a silk purse from a sow's ear.
I do IT support for small companies. These are places that don't have an IT department. If it's a new client I can't tell you how many times I've gone in and the office is filled with each person using a Vostro-level PC. Not necessarily a Dell brand, maybe an HP or whatever, but something the boss went out and got one day based on lowest price and it was in stock. Maybe they got them all at once from Best Buy or Circuit City. What's on them? Well, here's my segue to software and MechBgon's point exactly.
Just like the hardware, the lower-end PC's come loaded to the hilt with crudware. There are toolbars across the top, zippy things going on at the sides, low end imaging, disk burning, and sound tools that step all over each other, and then there are the malware tools. Loads of them. So many I can't believe the PC even boots. Like Norton 360, some expired one like McAfee not totally uninstalled, adaware, anti-spyware galore, some other freeware antivirus tool, some other popup prevention freeware thingy, and some more junk that they might have heard about from a friend then never used again after loading it but it's running in the background with everything else.
Heavens to mergatroid I just can't believe these manufacturers & vendors think the very people who don't know to uninstall these overburdensome apps are the ones who should be taking home a low-end PC that can barely run 2 of these, much less the 6-8 that are loaded and auto-start during boot. Then as soon as they activate Windows they start loading more crudware that they got packed in the deal at the store.
I'm with MechBgon. He didn't say it outright but I'm sure you guessed his mantra is keep it simple. Have one or 2 better guns instead of a whole arsenal of uzzi's. One AV, maybe one anti-spyware tool if really needed, but the real key is to know how to act and to protect the border. Using best-practices like non-admin user, system updates, use a firewall appliance box, etc.
On the other side of the fence there are Macs. There are some lines with problems. They're not immune. For example, a whole lot of previous-rev iMacs had power supplies die. I had one in a salon at the checkout desk and got a call "the Mac is smoking ... What should I do?" Then 2 months later the other one just shut off and never came back. Straight to the Apple Store it went, for a replacement. In contrast, I have had nearly zero problems with the Pro line of equipment, and exactly zero with the Xserve. Well, one Xserve with problems but that one had clearly been physically abused onsite. The iMacs are about value. The "Pro" line is about speed & quality. Same deal as the PC world, in my opinion, though the i-line isn't as low a price/quality target as Vostro gets.
I don't think the iMac/Non-Pro line is down at the level of Vostro, but they also hit the higher price point than the lowest Vostro and aren't as stripped down. And as for software Apple just doesn't sell the Macs with crudware like a Google Toolbar (yet) and all the other junk to bog it down. Some might argue about some apps being hoggy, like Spotlight (think Google Desktop) is notorious.
I personally like Macs a whole lot better than Windows machines for a lot of reasons, so I'm not trying to change your mind, but I also think Windows PC's get a bad rap that in many cases isn't deserved at all. Kinda like what nerdgineer and others said -- with an IT department to set them up & maintain them, the PC's really are OK.
FWIW.
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Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
I was curious to see how the prices compare, so I looked at Dell's configurator. It appears that the Dell Inspiron 530 with Vista Home Basic is slightly less expensive than the Ubuntu-equipped Inspiron 530 N. :thinking: In the big picture, both are quite affordable in absolute terms, at starting prices of about $500-$510 (counting the current $100 instant savings they're currently offering). An Inspiron wouldn't be my cup of tea, especially not the baseline builds (analog LCDs, ugh!), but whatever If you get it with Vista Home Basic, you can still run Ubuntu (dual-boot or not, your call), you raise the resale value, and you have $10 left to buy pizza! A win-win situation.
A Mac Mini isn't insanely higher... it would be about $750 if it were equipped with the same monitor the Inspiron 530 baseline systems have, although the 80GB hard drive might leave you a bit short of capacity if you're trying to do some home video editing.
I was curious to see how the prices compare, so I looked at Dell's configurator. It appears that the Dell Inspiron 530 with Vista Home Basic is slightly less expensive than the Ubuntu-equipped Inspiron 530 N. :thinking: In the big picture, both are quite affordable in absolute terms, at starting prices of about $500-$510 (counting the current $100 instant savings they're currently offering). An Inspiron wouldn't be my cup of tea, especially not the baseline builds (analog LCDs, ugh!), but whatever
If you get it with Vista Home Basic, you can still run Ubuntu (dual-boot or not, your call), you raise the resale value, and you have $10 left to buy pizza! A win-win situation.A Mac Mini isn't insanely higher... it would be about $750 if it were equipped with the same monitor the Inspiron 530 baseline systems have, although the 80GB hard drive might leave you a bit short of capacity if you're trying to do some home video editing.
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asdalton
Flashlight Enthusiast
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
I'm on my third Dell desktop since 1994, with no hardware trouble at all. (I do hear people complain about Dell laptops, though.)
As for other problems, I've done quite a bit of troubleshooting on family members' computers, and it seems that user-installed software is a source of a lot of trouble. Part of the problem is that people, understandably, will buy a gigantic software suite like Norton because it has a firewall, antivirus, anti-spyware, etc. that they've always been told they ought to have. But these suites can be very bloated and resource-hungry.
New software can also create trouble that is mystifying to users who don't know what to look for. One time when my parents' computer was dragging, I discovered that the default Norton antivirus settings had heuristics scanning turned on for every single file opened.
I remember spyware being out of control in 2004, which was the reason why I switched to Firefox then. But Internet Explorer became much safer after Win XP SP2 came out. People really should not have runaway spyware problems today, unless they've been clicking "Yes" to every unexpected ActiveX script.
I'm on my third Dell desktop since 1994, with no hardware trouble at all. (I do hear people complain about Dell laptops, though.)
As for other problems, I've done quite a bit of troubleshooting on family members' computers, and it seems that user-installed software is a source of a lot of trouble. Part of the problem is that people, understandably, will buy a gigantic software suite like Norton because it has a firewall, antivirus, anti-spyware, etc. that they've always been told they ought to have. But these suites can be very bloated and resource-hungry.
New software can also create trouble that is mystifying to users who don't know what to look for. One time when my parents' computer was dragging, I discovered that the default Norton antivirus settings had heuristics scanning turned on for every single file opened.
I remember spyware being out of control in 2004, which was the reason why I switched to Firefox then. But Internet Explorer became much safer after Win XP SP2 came out. People really should not have runaway spyware problems today, unless they've been clicking "Yes" to every unexpected ActiveX script.
Groundhog66
Banned
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
Just Do it, go Mac
Just Do it, go Mac
MSaxatilus
Flashlight Enthusiast
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
Yikes.
Thanks for all of your time and thoughts guys. I really do appreciate your input. I have to admit that part of my problem with my PC is that it is old and out of date. But that being said, I've still had numerous problems with my old Dell Inspiron over the years, from having to reinstall drivers program crashes, system bogging down for lord knows what reason, etc. etc.. For the most part, I have been able to keep the system itself running fine (or should I correct myself... good enough). The hardware that they put in there has not failed me since I bought it and things continue to work fine..... well aside from the recent add on Maxtor.
I think most of my problems lie in software. I understand that it probably has alot to do with my fault for not being as up to date with exactly how all these applications such as Norton, Ad-Aware and others. Do I exactly know how to completely remove a program from my system.... no. Should I be able to keep the system clean and moving along quickly, I think I know some, but I admit I'm not an expert.
My question is why should I have to be a computer genious to prevent my system from continally giving me problems? I feel its just a constant battle and its exhausting.
While I think alot of you guys have a bunch of great ideas and have really given me alot of food for thought, I think it really comes down to this..... those of you that have stuck up for PCs have done so because of two reasons.... 1) You have alot more knowledge about their operation than I, and 2) I think deep down, you guys really enjoy tinkering and fiddling with the machines to get them running just the way you want them to. Its almost equivalent to a guy tinkering with an oly '57 Chevy. Its a hobby and its fun to play around and make it work the way you want.
For me, well I'll quote myself from before....
I've got to say, I'm leaning more and more towards the other side.....
Its a scary step.
MSax
.....with an IT department to set them up & maintain them, the PC's really are OK.
Yikes.
Thanks for all of your time and thoughts guys. I really do appreciate your input. I have to admit that part of my problem with my PC is that it is old and out of date. But that being said, I've still had numerous problems with my old Dell Inspiron over the years, from having to reinstall drivers program crashes, system bogging down for lord knows what reason, etc. etc.. For the most part, I have been able to keep the system itself running fine (or should I correct myself... good enough). The hardware that they put in there has not failed me since I bought it and things continue to work fine..... well aside from the recent add on Maxtor.
I think most of my problems lie in software. I understand that it probably has alot to do with my fault for not being as up to date with exactly how all these applications such as Norton, Ad-Aware and others. Do I exactly know how to completely remove a program from my system.... no. Should I be able to keep the system clean and moving along quickly, I think I know some, but I admit I'm not an expert.
My question is why should I have to be a computer genious to prevent my system from continally giving me problems? I feel its just a constant battle and its exhausting.
While I think alot of you guys have a bunch of great ideas and have really given me alot of food for thought, I think it really comes down to this..... those of you that have stuck up for PCs have done so because of two reasons.... 1) You have alot more knowledge about their operation than I, and 2) I think deep down, you guys really enjoy tinkering and fiddling with the machines to get them running just the way you want them to. Its almost equivalent to a guy tinkering with an oly '57 Chevy. Its a hobby and its fun to play around and make it work the way you want.
For me, well I'll quote myself from before....
I've got to say, I'm leaning more and more towards the other side.....
Its a scary step.
MSax
binky
Flashlight Enthusiast
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
Must... hold... back... :duck:
Don't step -- LEAP! RUN!
If the Inspiron's going to the dumpster anyway then save the key from your WinXP sticker on the bottom of the thing and load WinXP in a 2nd partition on the Mac (Apple calls it "Boot Camp") that you can access either at boot time as a separate boot or using a product from Parallels or VMWare Fusion you can use it simultaneously when running the MacOS.
Must... hold... back... :duck:
Don't step -- LEAP! RUN!
If the Inspiron's going to the dumpster anyway then save the key from your WinXP sticker on the bottom of the thing and load WinXP in a 2nd partition on the Mac (Apple calls it "Boot Camp") that you can access either at boot time as a separate boot or using a product from Parallels or VMWare Fusion you can use it simultaneously when running the MacOS.
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
The WinXP key from the Dell, being an OEM license, cannot be legally re-used on anything else... sorry man.
If those are your entire needs in a nutshell, and the games in question are browser-based games, then you could probably accomplish this by making a Knoppix DVD (Linux-on-a-disc) and running your Dell directly from the DVD disc. This actually would make you immune to hard-drive failures, unlike switching to a Mac and Knoppix is free, so you're basically looking at the cost of a blank DVD-R for that option. Making a Knoppix DVD is so easy, even *I* can do it :tinfoil: http://www.knoppix.org/ if you want to try it out.
Not the most flexible solution in the world, but unbreakable...? Yes. Reboot, and it's all back to the way it was before.
Must... hold... back... :duck:
Don't step -- LEAP! RUN!
If the Inspiron's going to the dumpster anyway then save the key from your WinXP sticker on the bottom of the thing and load WinXP in a 2nd partition on the Mac (Apple calls it "Boot Camp") that you can access either at boot time as a separate boot or using a product from Parallels or VMWare Fusion you can use it simultaneously when running the MacOS.
The WinXP key from the Dell, being an OEM license, cannot be legally re-used on anything else... sorry man.
If those are your entire needs in a nutshell, and the games in question are browser-based games, then you could probably accomplish this by making a Knoppix DVD (Linux-on-a-disc) and running your Dell directly from the DVD disc. This actually would make you immune to hard-drive failures, unlike switching to a Mac
and Knoppix is free, so you're basically looking at the cost of a blank DVD-R for that option. Making a Knoppix DVD is so easy, even *I* can do it :tinfoil: http://www.knoppix.org/ if you want to try it out.Not the most flexible solution in the world, but unbreakable...? Yes. Reboot, and it's all back to the way it was before.
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Sir Lightalot
Enlightened
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
Ive done this on my 12 year old PC as i had put the HD in a different PC. I copied DSL (damn-small-Linux) to a CD and booted it up from the cd drive. the computer uses a Pentium 1 at 75mhz so its just about the only thing that runs . the motherboard didn't support booting from CD so i had to put a booting program on a floppy and boot that to transfer boot to the CD drive. it actually works! except that i cant save anything but thats a minor set back . MSaxatilus is right bacause i just did it for fun as it wasn't being used.
anyway, that could be the way to go if you use a flash drive to save to or something.
If those are your entire needs in a nutshell, and the games in question are browser-based games, then you could probably accomplish this by making a Knoppix DVD (Linux-on-a-disc) and running your Dell directly from the DVD disc. This actually would make you immune to hard-drive failures, unlike switching to a Mac
Ive done this on my 12 year old PC as i had put the HD in a different PC. I copied DSL (damn-small-Linux) to a CD and booted it up from the cd drive. the computer uses a Pentium 1 at 75mhz so its just about the only thing that runs
. the motherboard didn't support booting from CD so i had to put a booting program on a floppy and boot that to transfer boot to the CD drive. it actually works! except that i cant save anything but thats a minor set back . MSaxatilus is right bacause i just did it for fun as it wasn't being used. anyway, that could be the way to go if you use a flash drive to save to or something.
abvidledUK
Flashlight Enthusiast
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
GO MAC GO.......
I've been using Macs for many years now, (since System 7 software) a major plus point for me is the lack of fan noise.
As to user friendliness, you can't beat them.
The Apple software is fully integrated too.
PC...no way.
(if you're a bit poor, go the Apple Refurb route, works for me.)
GO MAC GO.......
I've been using Macs for many years now, (since System 7 software) a major plus point for me is the lack of fan noise.
As to user friendliness, you can't beat them.
The Apple software is fully integrated too.
PC...no way.
(if you're a bit poor, go the Apple Refurb route, works for me.)
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Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
It's not likely a big deal to anyone other than myself. I just find it bothersome that people attempt to permit corporations to make laws. Microsoft can't make laws. Laws are legislative edicts. Licensing restrictions can't be viewed as "legal" infractions. They are at best, or worst, an aberration of licensing dictates. On a legal standing, and with past court decisions regarding the use of pre-owned copyrighted materials, Microsoft can't do much regarding the physical use of software you've previously purchased. It's not good for anything though. The concept of licensing, locking and validations are used to invalidate a real product by merging it and making it dependent on abstract concepts. Thus subsequent use of the WinXP key is useless, but not a matter of legality.
Just nit-picking about a pet peeve, I guess.
It's not likely a big deal to anyone other than myself. I just find it bothersome that people attempt to permit corporations to make laws. Microsoft can't make laws. Laws are legislative edicts. Licensing restrictions can't be viewed as "legal" infractions. They are at best, or worst, an aberration of licensing dictates. On a legal standing, and with past court decisions regarding the use of pre-owned copyrighted materials, Microsoft can't do much regarding the physical use of software you've previously purchased. It's not good for anything though. The concept of licensing, locking and validations are used to invalidate a real product by merging it and making it dependent on abstract concepts. Thus subsequent use of the WinXP key is useless, but not a matter of legality.
Just nit-picking about a pet peeve, I guess.
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
Trust me, this topic is a pet peeve for me as well, as a Moderator of a computer forum about 5x the size of CPF. :tinfoil: I'm not surprised to find someone who disagrees with the concept of getting a super-discounted license and having to agree to some restrictions, but I really don't think it's unfair practice. There's retail licenses for people who want unrestricted transferability. Anyhow, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, since no one in the history of Time has ever had a change of viewpoint on this subject :thumbsup:
Hey MSaxatilus, so what's the diagnosis on your Dell?
Trust me, this topic is a pet peeve for me as well, as a Moderator of a computer forum about 5x the size of CPF. :tinfoil: I'm not surprised to find someone who disagrees with the concept of getting a super-discounted license and having to agree to some restrictions, but I really don't think it's unfair practice. There's retail licenses for people who want unrestricted transferability. Anyhow, I guess we'll have to agree to disagree, since no one in the history of Time has ever had a change of viewpoint on this subject :thumbsup:
Hey MSaxatilus, so what's the diagnosis on your Dell?
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Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
I don't think I offered any opinions on the practice of licensing and such. The pet-peeve was on labeling license violations as illegal. In other words, Microsoft doesn't make laws, thus violating or adhering to their restrictions can't be called legal or illegal.
I don't think I offered any opinions on the practice of licensing and such. The pet-peeve was on labeling license violations as illegal. In other words, Microsoft doesn't make laws, thus violating or adhering to their restrictions can't be called legal or illegal.
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
I always use a Mac at home, and Never have regretted it. The interface takes some getting used to, but other than that, they're great, easy-to-use, virus free machines. Go Apple, MSax, and you won't regret it!
I always use a Mac at home, and Never have regretted it. The interface takes some getting used to, but other than that, they're great, easy-to-use, virus free machines. Go Apple, MSax, and you won't regret it!
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
Is violating the terms of a contractual agreement possibly illegal, though? :shrug: I'm not a lawyer, so you tell me. At any rate, I'm sorry the phrasing rubbed you the wrong way, so let me try again:
In this situation, the terms of the End User License Agreement for OEM Windows licenses would be violated if the Dell's OEM WinXP installation key were used on any other computer.
Big picture: if he needs Windows at all, I think he should get the Dell fixed, secured, and possibly locked down using Windows SteadyState if he likes what that achieves. He can still get his Mac too :thumbsup: MSax, if you want to ship me your Dell, I'll fix it, secure it, and ship it back, but you got to pay shipping both ways, 'cause I'm unemployed atm
Is violating the terms of a contractual agreement possibly illegal, though? :shrug: I'm not a lawyer, so you tell me. At any rate, I'm sorry the phrasing rubbed you the wrong way, so let me try again:
In this situation, the terms of the End User License Agreement for OEM Windows licenses would be violated if the Dell's OEM WinXP installation key were used on any other computer.
Big picture: if he needs Windows at all, I think he should get the Dell fixed, secured, and possibly locked down using Windows SteadyState if he likes what that achieves. He can still get his Mac too :thumbsup: MSax, if you want to ship me your Dell, I'll fix it, secure it, and ship it back, but you got to pay shipping both ways, 'cause I'm unemployed atm
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MSaxatilus
Flashlight Enthusiast
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
....at this moment (Sun. afternoon).... I don't know. We had alot of snow here on Friday and the IT guy that was going to look at it never made it in. His still sitting in his workstation. Hopefully he can get to it tomorrow. You never realize how much you miss something till you have to go without.
...Wow! Are you serious? That's a really nice offer. I'll tell you what, if my IT guy is too busy to look at it right away, I'll send it out to you (whereever you might be). That way I can get my computer up and running soon and I can get a few bucks your way to help you through your unemployment situation.
Thanks for the offer. Really appreciate it.
MSax
Hey MSaxatilus, so what's the diagnosis on your Dell?
....at this moment (Sun. afternoon).... I don't know. We had alot of snow here on Friday and the IT guy that was going to look at it never made it in. His still sitting in his workstation. Hopefully he can get to it tomorrow. You never realize how much you miss something till you have to go without.
MSax, if you want to ship me your Dell, I'll fix it, secure it, and ship it back, but you got to pay shipping both ways, 'cause I'm unemployed atm
...Wow! Are you serious? That's a really nice offer. I'll tell you what, if my IT guy is too busy to look at it right away, I'll send it out to you (whereever you might be). That way I can get my computer up and running soon and I can get a few bucks your way to help you through your unemployment situation.
Thanks for the offer. Really appreciate it.
MSax
Re: My Computer Died.... I might go Mac!?!?!
Sure thing I would just need the tower and the software CDs that came with it, primarily the Windows CD. Which variant of Windows was it, if you recall (Home, Professional, or Media Center Edition)? I do live at the opposite end of the country (Washington state) so it would be AWOL for a couple weeks total; factor that into the picture.
Sure thing
I would just need the tower and the software CDs that came with it, primarily the Windows CD. Which variant of Windows was it, if you recall (Home, Professional, or Media Center Edition)? I do live at the opposite end of the country (Washington state) so it would be AWOL for a couple weeks total; factor that into the picture.
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