Nichia High CRI 119 LED

[McGizmo]

Hi guys,
I have mentioned elsewhere the fact that I have been working with the Nichia 119 H1 High CRI LED and it's time to introduce it as an aloternative in my lights.

Unlike the 083 Nichia High CRI LED I have enjoyed working with (and plan to continue with) the 119 is a single die LED with a package very similar in form and size to the Cree XP-G. It can also be driven at higher current levels than the 083. The 083's I am working with are just stellar in my opinion as they offer very high CRI as well as a high CCT (~5500k). Most of the 119's are available in CCT below my interest and preference but I was able to score some LED's that are in the highest CCT bin offered by Nichia.

These LED's have a flux range of 90 - 100 lumens at 350 mA. (B09)

The CCT is a minimum 4500k (sw45)

The CRI ra is a typical 92 per the spec sheet.

The 119 has a lens optic which yields a relatively narrow viewing angle which lends itself for use as a flood source without a secondary optic. This LED prompted me to decide to bring back a Mule head but in titanium, to be in keeping with the rest of my current offerings:

The LED also works well in the Haiku resulting in one of the best beams I have encountered and of course purely subjective and of my opinion.

I believe the 119 is a great alternative in both the Mule and Haiku. The LED driven at ~ 500 mA puts out about half the flux of the XP-G R5 LED which is certainly at an expense in terms of lumens. However, with a conservative estimate of 75 lumens coming out the front of these lights, there is ample flux for many tasks. In my integrating sphere, I measured a Haiku High CRI at 90 lumens on high and a Mule High CRI putting out 85 lumens. With those measurements, I think it reasonable to suggest 75 lumens as output.

Both samples measured at 4950 CCT and 92 CRI ra in my sphere which certainly dove tails with the specs. In contrast, I also measured my personal Haiku XP-G which yielded 160 lumens on high and measured 8100k and a CRI ra of 75.

I did measure the three levels of these three tested lights and I would think these numbers could serve as a bench mark. (YMMV)

Lumens
Light High Med Low

Haiku XP-G 160 39 8
Haiku High CRI 90 22 5
Mule High CRI 85 20 4

In retrospect, I probably should have used the same High CRI LE in the Haiku and Mule heads to see how it differed but a sampling of one LED or even two is hardly enough to make any real claims and although I have provided some measured numbers here, ultimately I make no claims as to output numbers of these lights.

Because of the viewing angle provided by the integral lens on the 119, it is not a friendly LED to the SunDrop lens, in my opinion. I think the SunDrop lens does best with a LED not sporting its own optic.

I think this 119 High CRI LED is a nice addition and alternative to the 083 High CRI LED if one seeks more flux or a collimated beam. I think the 083 still offers the ultimate in CRI provided its flux is sufficient for the task and a flood or concentrated flood beam is acceptable.

So anyway, that is my take and observations so far. I will be offering both the Mule High CRI as well as the Haiku High CRI up here as soon as I can get the threads started and I welcome comments and observations from you folks!

One of these in a custom 2x123 with the 6V LE has already slipped out into the population and should that owner be inclined to comment, he is welcome to do so. His light has a high level drive of ~450 mA and consequently is a bit shy of the flux I have reported above.

 

[maxspeeds]

These two new lights look awesome, Don! I can't wait for the waves to wash ashore

 

[scout24]

:bow: :rock: I'm in... Love the Ti mule head...

 

[Henk_Lu]

Wow... I knew there would be coming lights with the Nichia 119, but I didn't expect them so soon! :huh:

Did Don know I'll have budget in a few hours? This afternoon I thought some of it would last a time...

Well, the question is, which of these lights wil be best for me? I know the Haiku well, have an XR-E and an XP-G one and they are about the best beam I ever saw. A high CRI Haiku certainly is a dream!

I also have a Mule, bought it from a CPFer. Let's not speak about it's beam, but about the angle and the output. How much output has a Ti PD Mule on high? If there were different ones, I don't know which one I have, it's XR-E. Is the angle of the beam the same with this new Nichia-Mule? How can the beams be compared in brightness?

This info would be good for me to decide which one I need. Yeah, I know which answer I'll get first, sorry, no way to buy both... :shakehead

Thanks Don, new lights appear each day, but high CRI are still very, very rare. You provide us with two different ones at a time. Christmas must be near!

:bow: :bow: :bow:

 

[jellydonut]

Hey guys

I was going to make a post here where I would ask people to explain high CRI LEDs and how these compare to incandescent bulbs to me, but instead I spent a second or two on Google and found it myself. What I found might be deemed relevant by those interested in this offering! At least to those not CRI-tically well informed on CRI.:nana:

CRI explained

Color rendering index, or CRI, is a measure of the quality of color light, devised by the International Commission on Illumination (CIE). It generally ranges from zero for a source like a low-pressure sodium vapor lamp, which is monochromatic, to one hundred, for a source like an incandescent light bulb, which emits essentially blackbody radiation. It is related to color temperature, in that the CRI measures for a pair of light sources can only be compared if they have the same color temperature.

Intriguing, isn't it? Yeah, I'm sure those of you already 'in the know' are laughing at me but surely I'm not the only CRI-noob here.

CRI is a quantitatively measurable index, not a subjective one. A reference source, such as blackbody radiation, is defined as having a CRI of 100 (this is why incandescent lamps have that rating, as they are, in effect, blackbody radiators), and the test source with the same color temperature is compared against this. Both sources are used to illuminate several standard samples. The perceived colors under the reference and test illumination (measured in CIE 1931 form) are compared using a standard formula, and averaged over the number of samples taken (usually eight) to get the final CRI. Because eight samples are usually used, manufacturers use the prefix "octo-" on their high-CRI lamps.

Okay, all well and good. Where's the juicy stuff?

A more simple explanation is how an artificial light source shifts the location of eight specified colors on a version of the C.I.E. color space as compared to the same colors lighted by a reference source of the same Color Temperature. If there is no change in appearance, the light source is given a CRI of 100 by definition. From 2000K to 5000K, the reference source is the Black Body Radiator and above 5000K, it is an agreed upon form of daylight. Incandescent bulbs have a CRI rating of 100, yet are far from ideal for color rendering and matching. Why? With a color temperature of only 2700k they are far too weak at the blue end of the spectrum making it next to impossible to distiguish between various shades of blue. The CRI rating of 100 simply means that the 8 samples look exactly the same as they would under a black body radiator at 2700k. The same can be said for lamps that exceed 6000k in color temperature as they are too weak in the red end of the spectrum, making reds and oranges appear too similar creating a "washed out" appearance.{Of course we all know this too well with our cool LEDs.} The northern sky with a color temperature of about 7500k and a CRI of 100 is not necessarily the ideal color rendering light source either. An ideal light source for color rendering will have both a color temperature similar to daylight and a high CRI value.

Interested yet?

An example:

The image on the left is an example of a full spectrum light source with a kelvin temperature similar to natural daylight and a CRI of 93. {feel like you've seen that before.. say, a couple posts above?} The image on the right is from a Solux halogen bulb source touted as having a "spectral match to daylight" and a CRI of 98. So why does her white hat appear yellow and not white in the photo? It is because the CRI calculation and spectral match was done against a 4100k reference source which is several shades more yellow than the actual sunlight striking the earth's surface. Remember CRI can only be determined by using a reference that has the same color temperature. A true spectral match to daylight would only occur in the 5000-6000k range, not at daylight if it were only 4100k! In our opinion, it is unfortunate that marketing strategies like this are allowed to exist, but can be easily avoided by the educated consumer. Some examples of some common and competitive light sources color temperature and CRI values are:
Candle: 1700k 100 CRI
High Pressure Sodium: 2100k 25 CRI
Incandescent: 2700k 100 CRI
Tungsten Halogen: 3200k 95 CRI
*Solux Bulb: 4100k 98 CRI
Cool White: 4200k 62 CRI
*Ott-Lite™ Pro: 5000k 82 CRI
Clear Metal Halide: 5500k 60 CRI
Natural Sunlight: 5000-6000k 100 CRI
Daylight Bulb: 6400k 80 CRI

Basically, I came into this thread curiosity peeked like a running cat's tail. The output numbers had me puzzled - if incandescents are supposed to be good at color rendering, why should I use this instead of the regulated incandescent goodness of my A2? The output and use case would be about the same - I hear all about the high CRI LEDs not only having a low output but also having a 'brownish' beam.

Well -- it has explained itself. This LED not only has a high CRI rating, but also a correlated color temperature extremely close to natural daylight!

I want to try one now.

Don, any chance at all for single-level E-series compatible heads with this LED in them?

Or better yet, LunaSols with these?!

 

[Drywolf]

I think the Ti mule is awesome!!


I liked the Al version, but it got scratched too easy.


Now we need a 9amp SST90 high CRI version with 16990 power pak.
:devil:

Frank

 

[run4jc]

No mule in my collection - this would (hopefully will) be the perfect addition! I'll be watching! and hopefully buying!!

 

[Bass]

Wow, these have come much quicker than I expected
I've been coveting the high CRI mule since you hinted about it a while back but both these offerings look superb.

I eagerly await more details!

 

[Moka]

Hmmm... Methinks I'll have to have one of these... =)

 

[palimpsest]

So why does her white hat appear yellow and not white in the photo?

Because the photographer was too ignorant or too lazy to correct the white balance of his camera. :devil:

An ideal light source for color rendering will have both a color temperature similar to daylight and a high CRI value.

No, there is not an ideal light source, because it depends on the situation (i.e.: metamerism) and/or personnal taste. This is marketing language to sell their products which are listed at the end of the article. :shakehead

 

[jellydonut]

Okay, nevermind, I guess I still don't 'get' CRI. I'm gonna stick to my normal emitters and shut up now.

 

[Th232]

Very tempting Don!

Small note, your link to the spec sheet seems to link to the picture of the LED? Very interested in seeing the full spec sheet for this.

 

[wyager]

Jellydonut, I think you nailed it... To my understanding "CRI" is a measure of how close something is to a blackbody emission curve. However, blackbody emission curves can have different color temperatures depending on the emitter's actual temperature.
Imaginary example-
we have this standard filament based bulb. Here are some imaginary specs-

When heated up to 1000 degrees, the color temperature is 5500K (daylight) and the CRI is 100 (because it's a filament).

Now, if we heat it up to only 800 degrees, the color temperature might only be 3000K (ruddy orange) because of shifted emission curve, but the CRI is still 100, even though the light quality sucks.

All CRI means is how close something sticks to a blackbody curve. You need to know both CRI and CCT to judge a light source. It's why incans can really suck for photography before you put the picture through photoshop, but afterwards they have the best color rendition.

 

[jellydonut]

Very tempting Don!

Small note, your link to the spec sheet seems to link to the picture of the LED? Very interested in seeing the full spec sheet for this.

http://www.nichia.co.jp/specification/en/product/led/NCSL119-H1-E.pdf :naughty:

 

[Th232]

Sweet, thanks for the link!:thumbsup:

 

[McGizmo]

Henk Lu,

I would guess that the PD Mule would have a measurable edge over the High CRI Mule in terms of flux but probably not noticeable to the naked eye. The High CRI Mule will have a different CCT and CRI to be certain as well as 3 levels VS 2.

Jellydonut,
Thanks for bringing that information and explanation into the thread. I appreciate it and I suspect others do as well. There are other threads delving into CRI and no need to bring all of it to bear here unless folks are inclined to do so. I would also point out that I think Nichia is great at explaining their LED's in regards to color rendering and I appreciate the fact they don't state CRI but rather CRI ra which highlights the fact that this is an averaging across a number of different spectral points. I do agree that the ideal light source has a spectrum of daylight if one is to consider the notion of an ideal in the first place.

palimpsest,

I don't know if the photographer would appreciate your comment about being lazy or ignorant but presumably he (she) would recognize an attempt at humor?!?

Th232,
I'll fix the link as soon as I have made this post and thanks for catching that!

 

[ibcj]

Are you using the same reflector in the Haiku that was used in the XP-G ?
I look forward to beam shots with the 119 Haiku to see how it compares
with the XP-G.

I'm all about nice tints and beams these days.:thumbsup:

 

[McGizmo]

Are you using the same reflector in the Haiku that was used in the XP-G ?
I look forward to beam shots with the 119 Haiku to see how it compares
with the XP-G.

I'm all about nice tints and beams these days.:thumbsup:

Thanks for asking. Yes, it is the same reflector and no need to make any adjustments to it or the head. I was going to take an out door beam shot (reluctantly) but was saved by the full moon.

 

[F250XLT]

Are these Mules going to be 3 speed?

 

[JMP]

I think so

Henk Lu,

I would guess that the PD Mule would have a measurable edge over the High CRI Mule in terms of flux but probably not noticeable to the naked eye. The High CRI Mule will have a different CCT and CRI to be certain as well as 3 levels VS 2.