Surefire’s 2009 New Lights Discussion - Part II

[dcjs]

New Surefire LED lights at SHOT

Just grabbed a SF tactical catalogue:

-aluminum CR123 "T1A Titan"

-seems like the Optimus is dead, no mention in the catalogue

-there's a P7 light that has the L6 body, a reflector head and a 2-stage tailcap called the M3L, loks like the L6 successor (350 lumens)

-M3TL has a TIR(!) turbo head (350)

-A2L and A2Z Aviator models with SSC P4 and extra leds for flood (120/10 and 120/25)

-V2L Vampire LED with two stage white or IR light (70/10 and 75mW/10mW)

-LX1 and LX2 to replace L1 and L2 (80/10 and 120/15)

No new models or protos were on display yet since they were just putting their booth together. Maybe I find time to stop by tomorrow and see what's actually in existence as prototypes.

 

[Gary007]

Re: Surefire's 2009 New Lights Discussion

photos provided by Goatee, hosted by me.

for larger photos, click here

I hope this is okay -- 600 x 800

I am working to do this right now and trying to keep from uploading all of the images again cause it took a long time. I just tried to resize the files in www.photobucket.com but it didn't work.

If it becomes too problematic, can you please delete them and I will re-post them with the smaller sizes at some time later this evening?

Sorry for the sizes.

 

[Monocrom]

Forgot to mention, it's nice to see that those who already own an M3 or M3T will be able to buy the LED heads seperately, instead of buying a new variation of the M3 light.

Wondering if the new LED heads will fit on my Leef 2x18650 C-M body.... It's basically a slightly longer, no grip-ring, M3T when running on rechargeables.... Looks like I'm adding a new SF head to my list of "must buy" items.

 

[AA6TZ]

Give and Take

SureFire has 86'ed the Optimus and the 400 lumen Invictus. Instead, they will now be offering a 3-celled Invictus with a reduced output of 350 lumens.

So far, it's more "take" and little "give" on behalf of SureFire.

Since there will be no adjustable beam Optimus, why not sweeten the deal by bumping the Invictus up to, say, 450 lumens?

I'll bet several of us out here could "live" with that.

-Clive

 

[woodrow]

Am I just missing it??? Is there no mention of a 200lm 2x123a light? (and the e2dl is not 200 lumens...I had one...also our fellow cpf'rs intagration spear tests confirm this)

 

[Mercaptan]

Am I just missing it??? Is there no mention of a 200lm 2x123a light? (and the e2dl is not 200 lumens...I had one...also our fellow cpf'rs intagration spear tests confirm this)

Which integration sphere test was this? Link please.

 

[Kiessling]

Forgot to mention, it's nice to see that those who already own an M3 or M3T will be able to buy the LED heads seperately, instead of buying a new variation of the M3 light.

Wondering if the new LED heads will fit on my Leef 2x18650 C-M body.... It's basically a slightly longer, no grip-ring, M3T when running on rechargeables.... Looks like I'm adding a new SF head to my list of "must buy" items.

I think we'd need a new tailcap, too, for the 2 levels?
When looking at the prices for single LED heads I guess buying a new light instead of the two items will be cheaper.
bernie

 

[jac2001]

Which integration sphere test was this? Link please.

+1 please....mine is quite comparable to my SF D-2 with a Malkoff M60. A couple of new beamshots in the snow this morning!

e2dl in the snow!

malkoff m60 in the snow

 

[iapyx]

Last edited by jac2001; Today at 02:28 PM. Reason: posted wrong pic, my bad! [/I]

yeah, I thought so. Was already trying to discover the 7 differences and couldn´t find any.. Thanks for editing.

 

[Size15's]

Am I just missing it??? Is there no mention of a 200lm 2x123a light?

I don't think there is a realistic wide-spread need for such a flashlight in the applications SureFire makes illumination tools for given their capability to manage light (beams) like they do.
Feedback from operational users, especially in the Military gives clear messages that runtime and low-weight are more important than increased output.
Feedback from Law Enforcement and other groups using light in CQB / indoors environments state that too much light is an issue and that the ballpark for too much light is 'when it gets far greater than 100-150 lumens' depending on the beam and conditions etc.

Where the higher output is needed is for longer range applications. SureFire need to be comfortable setting and rating the likes of the M3L and TurboHead at 350 or 400 lumens or whatever - remember users want runtime. Also consider that it's a SureFire lumen rating, and they are using a TIR optic in the TurboHead so it's likely that such a beam will appear higher output compared to other products CPF members may be comparing it to.

It must be very difficult for SureFire to hammer out the design and specs of new products given that they'll be mass-producing them in tens of thousands of units. Being able to source sufficient quantity of the LEDs SureFire wants must be a real issue they have to manage and plan for.

Perhaps some manufacturers can only dream of having the sorts of challenges SureFire has in brings new products to market?

 

[Centropolis]

Where the higher output is needed is for longer range applications. SureFire need to be comfortable setting and rating the likes of the M3L and TurboHead at 350 or 400 lumens or whatever - remember users want runtime. Also consider that it's a SureFire lumen rating, and they are using a TIR optic in the TurboHead so it's likely that such a beam will appear higher output compared to other products CPF members may be comparing it to.

I was thinking about something last night. And I may be maybe someone has already mentioned this, or I am getting this completely wrong.

If the TIR is supposed to be internal focus, what's the effectiveness of the large reflector on the turbohead as compared to a "regular" head? I am sure that lights do bounce off the reflector as the TIR cannot catch all of them but still...doesn't the use of a Turbohead redundant?

(Someone can call me a loser if I totally misunderstood the TIR concept.)

 

[Size15's]

SureFire have been experimenting with larger diameter optics for years (spinoff from the DARPA project). I believe they plan for the LED TurboHead with TIR optic to be 2" rather than 2.5" diameter suggesting that they can create the beam they want to from a smaller diameter bezel compared to using a reflector.

 

[Kiessling]

If the beam of the M3TL is similar to the E-Series TIR it will be a Sci-Fi weapon.

 

[Outdoors Fanatic]

If the beam of the M3TL is similar to the E-Series TIR it will be a Sci-Fi weapon.

I was thinking the same. That thing will throw like Alien Technology... Imagine a beam from an UFO.

 

[danpass]

I'd like to see yellow/green offered in the A2L ................

 

[Outdoors Fanatic]

I'd like to see yellow/green offered in the A2L ................

I'll happily take one in plain green.

 

[danpass]

I'd like to see yellow/green offered in the A2L ................

I'll happily take one in plain green.

I hear ya. Its just that they seemed to have 'missed' one. Though I understand that past sales numbers probably dictated the color lineup.


Perhaps if they had touted the Y/G combo benefits some more? Maybe it'll be added next season.

 

[KDOG3]

I hope those new clips with fit on the E2DL. I was also thinking that those new clips would work GREAT on the C2 and C3 lights ... you could pull up the light off your pocket or belt for immediate action....

 

[leon2245]

Which one of these come in black? Just the Invictus?

 

[MarNav1]

Any prices? The newer L1 looks pretty cool, although I like L1's anyhow. Also the T1A too. I'm sure the rest are probably not within reach for now.