What is it with new CPFers and throw?

[FlashInThePan]

Everyone has made good points; I think that most newbies come to CPF searching for a more powerful flashlight, and seek "throw" because they equate it with a more powerful light. Indeed, as many have mentioned, it's also a really easy benchmark to use - "my light can illuminunate that distant tree, and yours can't. Ha!"

But here's another possibility: it might be because newbies more commonly use their flashlights *outdoors,* where the objects that need illumination are further away (and thus require that throw!).

In contrast, us flashaholics will use any old excuse to fire up a flashlight. Since a lot of that use is inside, a flood beam is much more useful.

Just my two cents.

- FITP

 

[Skyclad01]

As far as I can remember the vast majority of newcomers around ere are obsessed about throw, since the measuring stick of the maglite is "hey ma, look how far I can shine this mag".

It's just a natural progression

I would have to say that pretty much hits the nail on the head. "The further the flashlight can shine = the more power it has = the better the flashlight" is pretty much the mentality of newcomers (myself included). I think the main thing is that we (newbies) usually assume that it will also have a balanced amout of flood as well. That is something we dont realize.

For example, the LEDBeam gives excellent throw, but it really lacks in side spill. For me when I got my LEDbeam, I knew it would have throw, but I didnt know would lack in sidespill. So I was a little dissapointed in that aspect. In comparison, my XM-3 certinatly doesnt have the throw that the LEDbeam has, but it is equally (if not more so) usefull than the LB due to it having twice the amout of sidespill.

So now when I buy a new light, I am more aware of the different charaterstics of the beams of each light. So I am no longer in that frame of mentality of "The more it throws = the more light it has = the better the flashlight"

 

[Lurveleven]

Great post Icebreak.

I think you'll find that professional users (i.e. SAR, Police, Firemen) are throw oriented because that is what they need, at least that is what I find I need 90% of the time for SAR. Average Joes appear to be more flood oriented, using their lights for houshold tasks.

Sigbjoern

 

[Nyctophiliac]

Hmmm... Contentious.

I care about throw,output,optics and engineering differently depending on mood, activity, practicality etc.

After all , one wouldn't wear one set of clothes for all seasons whether working,playing,excersising,seducing,etc. etc.

The idea that newbies obsess about one point, throw, is a sweeping generalization coupled with a crass joke about manhood!

By the way...I'm h@ng like a hamster, and I don't care! :naughty:

 

[OutdoorIdiot]

Well, I'm new to CPF, so I though perhaps I should say something on this subject.

When I first started becoming fussy about flashlights, I must admit that I saw "throw" as being the most important factor.

Now, as a more experienced and discerning flashlight customer, I take into account all the factors of a flashlight: I consider the battery consumption, brightness, beam quality, colour temperature, build quality, and all the other factors. Then I apply the following rules to decide whether I buy the flashlight:

Throw =

 

[Paul_in_Maryland]

Some of you have pointed out that urban washout makes flood pointless and throw more critical. That makes sense to me. It's the same reasoning behind the push for faster wireless networking: No one "needs" 100 megabits per second to cruise the Net on a laptop PC from the living room couch. But most of this bandwidth will be attenuated by walls and floors; that's why you need a large gross value.

The comment about stereo reminded me of an exchange I once had with a roommate. We were watching LA Law, and the episode involved a pair of hot blonde twins who had "been with" one of the firm's lawyers (and soon, with a second).

Me: "What is this fascination with twins?"
Roommate: (pause) "You know what it is? It's the difference between mono and stereo."

 

[SilverFox]

As a relative newbie myself...

The first thing I look for in a review of a light is its throw. I usually am using a light to identify things further away, or in shadows in high ambient light conditions. I like spill also, but my prime objective is to illuminate things that are some distance away.

Perhaps I am "far sighted..." :nana:

Here is my thought process... I look at Doug's (Quickbeam) charts and although the throw values are given in meters down to 1 lux, I view them as foot candles down to 1 foot. Since 1 foot candle at 1 foot is equal to 10.764 lux at 1 meter, I end up with roughly 10 times the light falling on the object I am trying to see.

For example, the TigerLight has a throw of around 145 meters, down to 1 lux. For me, I view that as at 145 feet I will be able to clearly see an object in minimal ambient light conditions, at around 72 feet I will be able to see in higher ambient light conditions, and at around 36 feet I will be able to light up a shadow in bright sunlight.

Things change when I am working in close quarters, or it is completely dark. I become "near sighted" in those conditions and prefer a good flood beam.

I would guess that if you spend most of your time on a boat or involved in search and rescue, you would lean toward throw, but if you spend most of your time trying to figure out wiring inside a computer case, flood would be better.

It all depends on what you are doing...

Tom

 

[tron3]

...
So I guess I have two questions:

1. Do you agree that newbies seek out throw more than non-newbies?
2. If so, why newbies?...

Well, I'll toss in my 2 or 3 cents.

When I was a young ignorant flashaholic (No comments, guys!) I associated throw with power. There is something thrilling about lighting something too far out for you to even see detail. It was like having a laser light.

As long as I have throw, do I need anything else? For some reason, people would rather pan the light up and down, and side to side to see the large object, rather than have a spot light. Maglites were supposed to be the best of both worlds, but that broken halo effect didn't do us much good.

In short, I'd say it is inexperience. If you want that much throw but have no legit reason for it, it's just a toy for you. A TRUE flashaholic has one of each. :naughty:

 

[mdocod]

reminds me of this time I visted checker auto(evening, dark out)- and out in front one of the employees was trying to help a lady put in a new battery- they barrowed the floor model THOR and had it pointed at the battery from less than 2 feet away.... talk about using a throw monster in the most useless possible way, lol. It was reflecting so much light back OUT from the intense spot that they probably would have been able to see better, unblinded, in the low lighting conditions anyways.

 

[the_beast]

This may have been mentioned before (I didn't read the second page), but I think the reason newbie's favour throw is because it is the ONLY thing you can measure properly. All light meters measure throw, and saying a light will go x meters means something to someone who has no lights to compare.

I know there are other ways to measure output than using the integrating sphere (like Doug's box idea), but these measurements are useless until you have a light in your hand that acts as a reference. How many people off the street will know what a 10 lumen light (for flood or throw) will look like anyhow? But say 'this light goes further than that one' is understandable by everybody.

Basically I don't think newbies are obsessed with throw (speaking as a newbie myself). I just think that until you have a few lights (and are therefore probably not a newbie any more) you don't have anything else to compare.

And still as a newbie, possibly my most often used light has zero spill and relatively good throw (for it's size/output) and that is why I use it. My Dorcy 1AAA (with optic) is great for finding your way through a dark cinema without disturbing anybody . I also prefer it when inside my computer case, as it only lights up what I need to see at once, and I don't get too many reflections of the inside of the case. Spill isn't always good, even for a dim light.

 

[RAF_Groundcrew]

For maximum throw, I have my Thor with 130w bulb, for a little less throw, and a light I can carry round, I have my M4, for everything else, I make do with SF 6P, M2, or more often, my L1, which has a F04 diffuser fitted, to even out the beam, which is too tight for indoor use, but quite good outdoors, for such a modest 1 cell light.

Surefire puts a lot of sales pitch mileage into their perfect beam 'no holes', and generally, with reflectors and lamps, this is true. When the light is coming from LEDs, or through lensed optics, the beam can be less than perfect, and this can be annoying at times, my Orb RAW has a hole in the middle of the beam at close range, it could be the focus of the LED is off little, but beyond 2 feet, it doesn't matter.

 

[Paladin]

I lived with a couple of Maglites and a SF 6P quite happily for many years. When I needed to make a large hole in the darkness I just accepted that a 12 volt. light plugged into a cigarette lighter would be needed.

What sparked my interest was the Gen I KL-3, hardly a throw monster! Streamlight TL-2 LED's have been my favorite EDC since I found them. And the night I turned on a TL-3 xenon while pointing it at a pad of paper a foot from my well dilated night adapted peepers merely reinforced the practicality of "less light".

Here in West Texas in open areas like around our city reservoir you can use all the throw imaginable. I like to drive out there during the cycle(new?) when the moon is absent or almost so. An M4 is a nice tool for nocturnal walks along a shoreline when you need to decide "Honey, is that a dog or really large coon?".

We really had an incident where some fellow walkers asked my wife if a large furry critter over on some rocks was her dog. We did not have our animal with us, so we went to look. And Paladin crawled up and took a flash camera photo of a "looked waist high in the dark!" coon which was kind of agitated about the attention. The sight would have been much more enjoyable from about 30 yards farther away, I assure you!

This flashoholism can still be as inexpensive and rewarding as any other "hobby" activity for the DIY type. That's something I think is cool about CPF, the chance to build/buy/own something that gives personal satisfaction while being of considerable utility value.

Paladin

 

[maxilux]

I don´t understand this threat, will you have a flashlight only to show?
to clean? for high price? what´s the problem?
I think a flashlight is to make light in the dark in the first!!
I (and i can speak only for me) need no flashlight for Showtime.
A had a car to drive, and a TV-Set to look, a pen to write and so on.
The newbies are at the roots, they are not infectet with the SF-Virus and others modern problems that no one needs realy.

 

[stogiez]

I'm a noob and here's why I went for throw at first. As my sig line states I got tired of having this big ol' bat hanging off my belt when my friends and I were out plinking frogs and other critters at night out on a ranch near the watering holes. But the Mag was all I knew. It got pretty heavy/awkward swinging around a 4-6 D light while taking aim with a 22LR pistol in the other hand. It just doesn't work.

Enter Flashlightreviews.com TADA! Starting reading and learning. A lot. Learned about throw, output, and everything else. The comparisons helped tremendously. My PT Surge, Scorpion, and G2 were a perfect balance of throw, size and COST. Especially the Surge. Used it to "spot" bunnies when a hand held spot got too hot.

Tried to start EDC the Scorp, and/or G2 but they are too big for a pocket. That's when I decided to go smaller for the pocket. Started looking at those, and now--

My name is Stogiez, and I'm a flashaholic.

Having said that, I now am looking forward to my next trip to my buddy's ranch with UV lights. He had a scorpion crawling on his boot while he had his feet kicked up. It would be very nice to be able to spot them in the dark out on the porch. Or even on the floor in the house, getting up in the middle of the night.

 

[Icebreak]

Lurveleven -

It's a little difficult to describe dimensional use of a dimensional beam. Thanks for the confirmation it was understandable.

 

[mdocod]

https://www.candlepowerforums.com/threads/110313

 

[Babo]

I just don't get this single-minded search for throw per dollar, throw per watt, throw per unit of length, or any other measure, be it absolute or relative.

Users of high-end bicycle lights don't seek out throw above all else. They understand the value of a broad beam. (Of course, many use two lights: One for throw, the other for flood.)

At the risk of offending: I'm reminded of a fake radio spot I heard back in the 80s: "Cadillac--for 50 years, the choice of men with small p_____s."

A variation on your Cadillac commercial: "(brand) bicycles--for 50 years, the choice of boys....or grown men who can't afford a Cadillac."

Some folks venture outside and would like to illuminate
things more distant than the cables behind their X-Box.

 

[Sub_Umbra]

...Some folks venture outside and would like to illuminate
things more distant than the cables behind their X-Box.

/LOL -- Slaps knee

 

[cave dave]

Well I must be the only person on CPF who joined looking for efficiency. Most Lumens per Watt at the smallest size and lightes weight. Those are still my main interests. I still find a 15 Lumen light to be the all around most useful, and have yet to find a use for tight throw except for playing around and spotting deer in my yard.
So what is throw actually good for. Here is the list so far:
1) Frog Gigging
2) Search and Rescue
3) Spotting Deer and other wildlife (see 1)
4) Blinding your friends because you are immature (PS I'll admit I did this yesterday with the Stenlight)
5) any others...

 

[tracker870]

Many newbies figure out eventually that
Throw is good for some things,
Spill & Flood are good for other apps.
Somewhere in the middle can be great!