Your opinion on a hotwire

[tomcat017]

Hi Everyone,

Well, I've pretty much decided that I want to build an ROP low, an ROP high, and a Mag85 within the next year or so (as my first mag mods). I've also pretty much decided that the ROP low will be a flooder, probably with a heavy stipple reflector. That leaves the ROP high and the Mag85. I would like one to be an insane thrower :rock:, and the other to be a mid-performer, part thrower, part flooder. My question is: which should I make the thrower? I am open to several different battery configurations, and even perhaps (tho maybe not) the use of a modded head. So...just wanted to hear everyones choice, and your reasoning. Thanks in advance---hope to start within a few months :naughty:

 

[LuxLuthor]

I couldn't vote. Your choices are too limited. :laughing:

 

[jlomein]

I read through the link provided by LuxLuthor and am beginning to think the ROP hi in Mag 2C powered by two AW C sized liIons I am planning is not the best way to go. The Philips 5761 may be brighter?

At any rate I wished I had bought a stock incan like a SF M4. This modding path is a dangerous road.

 

[Northern Lights]

I vote the 5761. 2,272 feet is throw:
http://candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=147344

 

[LuxLuthor]

I ordered some of these bulbs, and will do a couple Maglite setups and compare. Thanks for that link.

 

[tomcat017]

You guys are killing me :laughing:. I'm new to mods, so I think I better stick to a simpler one. The mag85 and ROP seem fairly doable, so thats why I listed them as the two choices...so as much as it hurts, try to humor the noob ...lol. Thanks for the suggestions tho--once (if) I feel confident enough, those will definitly be on the list of mods to tackle :naughty:

 

[Northern Lights]

Ok, tomcat017. To build an 1185 or 5761, hmm? In either case you need a bi-pin socket. Get a KIU or a FM pr-to Bi-pin. You will also need to get a new window, borofloat or UCL glass are favorites. The reflector can be cammed in a mag if you use the bi-pin pr sockets other wise a KIU takes a fixed reflector. I like smooth for most throw and I frost the lower 2/3 of the bulb to remove shadows, artifacts. Glass etch is available at most crafts stores. Now the 5761 takes only 7.2 volts and is brighter than the 1185 that usually is run from 9.9v all the way up to 11.1v on soft start. The lower voltage is less batteries, cheaper and easier to get into a host. Other than that, building the light is about the same amount of work or parts. One odd thing that you will encounter is the Pelican bulb and 5761 are the same size, and some reflectors need a reaming to fit them in. The 1185 is much thinner.
In any build you need to look up the links as how to reduce the resistance in stock switches and tail caps. Not doing this will cost you hundreds of lumens output in any build. AW is about to release a C size driver swithc combination with variable output. That on a smooth reflector, 2C cell light and AW C cells and spacer in a 5761 is got to be the brightest and most inovative light in 2C-cell size. I have a planned design to put that on a 4C cell and run a bulb we have not tried yet for 2200+
torch lumens. An ROP outputs @550 torch lumens in reality. Look into it.

 

[tomcat017]

OK NorthernLights...maybe I'll do it :twothumbs. It doesn't sound too bad--I was expecting it to be a much harder mod. I would definitly like to use some sort of voltage regulator if that sort of thing is available for this light--that way the light can be used right off the charger. And what do you guys think about the cammed reflector? Of course it's nice to retain focusability, but are there any downsides to not fixing it? Well...thanks for persuading me--I'll definitly have to give it a try. When I start (maybe ~6 months from now?) I'm sure I'll get stuck and have some questions. But until then...thanks!

 

[jimjones3630]

Phillips 5761 is one I continually instantflashed with my 2c that had all the low resistant mods. Even at 7.8v on rested 18650.

Knowing the 5761 can be instantflashed by lowering the resistant too much I would only install kiu socket or FM's PR to bipin(has more resistance than Kiu socket), metal reflector, and boro or glass lens.

Then do another resistance mod one at a time, probable the tailcap spring next.

Jim

 

[Northern Lights]

I used the 5761 on AA Sanyoo 2700, 12x, 6s2p, a 5400mAh pack off the charger. I also have used it on different li-ions right off the charger. Tuff bulb. It is common to rest batteries on a 1185 but not always necessary for 5761. Some folks report blowing them, I did only once. I like cammed reflectors because I use a short 2C-cell because it rides perfect in a belt holster and I must inspect the interior of cars at 12 feet or less and you can to some extent flood the beam. By no means is it a good flood for ranges beyond that but it does take some of the intensity off if you were working on close work and found it too bright in the spot selection. MagChargers have a reflector designed for throw. FMs cammed reflectors for the regular Mag pretty much duplicate the original function are probably the best all around reflector type. I have used fixed focus with a beautiful and pleasant spill merging to hotspot beam in a smo reflector from Litho0123. I know people to whom the symetry of the beam and clarity is so important they will only use fixed focus reflectors. As I mentioned I like smooth and remove the artifacts by only frosting the lower portion of the bulb, the area below the wire filament as that is what creates the shadows, above the filament are no shadow so I do not remove lumens by frosting above that line. Think about how you would use it the most and then use that reflector. Stippling and Orange peel reduce throw but make a clean beam that illuminates smoothly without harsh shadows and contrast. More to think about, huh? That is why it is a fascinating hobby; I first came to CPF just to find a better flashlight for work. I stayed, got hooked, learn a lot, I like to learn new technical things and least of all I have fun and meet new folks like you. Thanks!

 

[Nitro]

I have a 2C ROP HI using AW liIon C's. Nice light! I love this form factor.

However, I decided to try the 5761 bulb, because of the tighter filament (hence more throw). I had to drill out the VLOP refector, because the 5761 wouldn't fit. After a few try's and one broken bulb (that's another story, but be careful testing to see if the bulb fits) I got it to fit.

My Impressions:
I love the beam pattern. Because of the small filament, you don't need a MOP reflector. The VLOP works great and gives plenty of throw.

It's bright! It's hard to tell how much, but I believe it's brighter then my MAG85. However I only have three C Cells, so it's hard to do a comparison shot. I may try taking the shots separately with the same exposure settings.

My Issues:
I have to click the switch a few times until the bulb warms up. However, when AW comes out with his C driver, it will solve this problem.

My only other issue is runtime. Assuming 5.53 amp draw, with 3.3Ah C's, that's a little over 30mins. Here again with AW's driver, you can dim it down to 60% and 30%. At 60% we're talking about an hour.

My Conclusion:
IMO, the 2C-5761, with AW's C's and Driver should be the best light in it's class.

 

[jlomein]

How much current draw can be supported by two AW protected C sized liIon cells in series? They are rated 3.7v and 3300mAH.

5.53A current draw from the Philips 5726 sounds like a little too much for the AW C sized cells.

 

[Nitro]

How much current draw can be supported by two AW protected C sized liIon cells in series? They are rated 3.7v and 3300mAH.

5.53A current draw from the Philips 5726 sounds like a little too much for the AW C sized cells.

Well 5.53 is less then the 2C rule at 2 x 3.3 = 6.6 amps, so I'm guessing they can handle it. I believe the problem is the 5761 is pulling much more then 5.53amps during startup, which is shuting down the protection circuits in the batteries.

Anyone else want to weight in?

 

[mudman cj]

Here is some data to answer your question. It does push them pretty hard, so I am going to add AW's PWM regulator and compare the 5761 against the 1111 and ROP with that setup.

Edit: I realized right after I posted that I was not going to be using the ROP with AW's bi-pin regulator. :duh2:
While I was looking for other bulbs though I came across the Osram 54261. It's a T-3 size, so it's bigger than the 1111, but it's a lot cheaper and looks like it might even be a bit brighter. I'll bet the beam won't be as nice or it would have become a favorite already. Maybe I'll give it a try...

 

[jlomein]

What is this unit of C? Is it coulombs?

 

[Northern Lights]

What is this unit of C? Is it coulombs?

Now what is confusing is talking about 2C lights. So if I talk about how many batteries I say 2c-cells or something like that. In regards to the amps used. The capacity of a battery is called C, so for a 2600 mAh battery C is 2.6 Amps or 2600 mAh. The rule of the thumb for li-ions is that they cannot handle 2C draws. Unprotected li-ions often are reported to handle a little better than 2C draws. So two 18650s at 2600 mAh can power a 5761. In my case I measured the 5761 at 5.2 amps running and that is ecactly 2x C (2600mAh) in this case and the product I used is unprotected and possibly could handle more. Now for the AW C (c as in size) li-ions they have a capacity of 3.3 Ah and I believe the sale posts states in the beginning of the thread they will handle 5.0 Ah draws.
Hope this helps.
To jump in. I am having problems right now with AW C protected cells and the 5761, I removed the OEM protection and obtained after market boards to make a 7.4 pack that can be protected and charged in series. I am re-wiring a board. Running my 5761 light pulls 5.2 Amps; cold it could be as high as 7A on cold start as the boards were rated at 7A but who knows how accurate that was, they do not allow it to fire up on a cold start. Less than a half ohm resistance introduced into the circuit, like an NTC, will allow the board to work but that reduces V at the bulb and significantly reduces lumens by 100-200 lumens. So that is why I chose to rewire the board. Wish I had known about the new AW incan driver for a C light he just mentioned is coming.

 

[jlomein]

The capacity of a battery is called C, so for a 2600 mAh battery C is 2.6 Amps or 2600 mAh. The rule of the thumb for li-ions is that they cannot handle 2C draws.

So when you say they cannot handle 2C draws, you mean they cannot handle 2000mAH draws?

 

[Nitro]

NL: What about a COIL?

A Coil will add impedance during the initial surge in current, but once the current levels off the Coil impedance will drop.

 

[Nitro]

So when you say they cannot handle 2C draws, you mean they cannot handle 2000mAH draws?

2C meaning 2 x [The AH of the battery]

 

[Northern Lights]

Lets see if I understand the question. Each battery is rated as to how much energy it holds, measured in Amphere Hours or smaller decimal way to write that is Mili-AmpHours or mAh, 1 amp is 1000 mA.
So there are in the case of 18650 batteries commonly 2000, 2200, 2400 or 2600 mAh batteries. The more power the better and more expensive the battery. Each rating is the "C" for that battery. So 2C for 2600 mAh is 5200mAhs, for 2C of 2200 mAh it is 4400 mAh.